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#1
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Brian H
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1980238595&category=31719 |
#2
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Ryan Christoff
Clearly they have stolen the image from Jerry Smolin's "About Time" auction website: http://www.abouttimeauctions.com/index3.html |
#3
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jaime Leiderman
Not an expert, but you have to be very careful with these kind of pieces. |
#4
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jay Miller
Brian---I saw this earlier in the day. This same seller also has a George Wright tin type on ebay with no identification that it is Wright. As to the Mathews I want to do a little more research. My first response is to be skeptical but the picture does look like Mathews. Mathews, although his career ended in 1887, had no 1887 Old Judge card, only 1888 ones. I have never seen a Gypsy Queen card for which there is not an identical Old Judge card and since Gypsy Queens were only issued in 1887 and he had no 1887 Old Judge card and since this does not even correspond to any of the 1888 Old Judge poses I'm starting from the doubters camp. I guess, given what I have just said, that I don't know what this would be a proof of. It wouldn't have been of an issued Gypsy Queen. |
#5
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Ryan Christoff
please picture a winky smiley face somwhere in my last post. |
#6
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: runscott
Remember last year when you, me and Leon discussed this? |
#7
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jaime Leiderman
Did't see the tintype before my last post... |
#8
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jay Miller
The photo also seems incredibly clear and sharp. I have seen quite a few proofs but never one like that. It is always a bad sign when two very similar items appear suddenly for the first time. Something doesn't smell good. |
#9
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jay Miller
Scott---There wasn't a hoard of glass plate negatives found---only 44 if I remember correctly. However, you are right (not Wright--but then the tin type may not be either)that these could have been made from a glass plate negative. I hate to say it but Seth's item looks a little funny too. I saw a Mathews proof about five years ago (on a similar mount) and it did not have the massive edge damage that his does. The photo would not have been damaged that badly before it was mounted and the mount would have shielded it from that type of damage after it was mounted. |
#10
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jay Miller
Scott---By the way, I have a couple of those glass plate negatives. One is of a player unknown in the Old Judge set (Wilson-Omaha). I had a print made from the negative and I believe that I included it in my VCBC article on how Old Judge were made. |
#11
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jaime Leiderman
Jay, Seth has been offering the Matthews piece since he opened the 19thc.... store a while back without any response. (Like all the items he's offering now in the auction...) |
#12
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: runscott
...as time goes by size increases in your mind! In about ten more years some of my ex-girlfriends may start calling me again. |
#13
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: runscott
It would be far more productive if the glass plate negative owners produced a set of high-quality prints from those negatives, and offered them for sale. Perhaps a set of 10 of the best, mounted in such a way that they couldn't be mistaken for vintage, but still had the nostalgic appearance. |
#14
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: runscott
...some mounted, some framed - and they look great on the wall or on a small display stand on my desk. |
#15
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jay Miller
It's all relative. Your competition from back then will be magnified by a like amount. |
#16
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jay Miller
I'm not suggesting anything about Seth. It is the piece, not the seller, that I have questions about. |
#17
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jaime Leiderman
Jay, I never said you had any questions about him. |
#18
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jaime Leiderman
... In fact, I'm not a very big fan of his items HUGE price tags. |
#19
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: David
Such 19th century photographs can be authenticated (and, alternately, forgeries identified) without difficulty for a variety of reasons. |
#20
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: David
One more point, if he changes his tune and says it's not a photograph but a lithograph or such mechanical print, it's definitely a fake. While lithography, woodcut and those types of prints existed, it was impossible for them to make an image with that type of photo-realistic quality and subtle tones. |
#21
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: David
One very last thing (I promise). While they may genuinely exist, I have never in my life a 'PROOF' stamp like that on a 19th century photograph. |
#22
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: runscott
Are all tin types automatically vintage, or are there ways to make them now? If they can still be made, how could you tell the fakes from the real ones? |
#23
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: David
There is a long answer and a short answer. The short answer is that the collector shouldn't loose any sleep over forgery of 19th century baseball tintypes. If a collector owns one or is considering bidding on one at eBay, and there isn't anything fishy, it's safe to assume the baseball tintype is legit. Even if it does look fishy, it's still probably legitimate. If someone has one that appears goofy, I will be happy to look at it in person. |
#24
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: BROOKS
I SURE DO NOT QUALIFY FOR EXPERT BUT THAT PROOF STAMP IS TOO CONVIENENT FOR ME AND I HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO RECALL ANY 19TH CENTIRY CARDS WITH STAMPS......PROOF MARKS YES,STAMPS NO |
#25
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Jaime Leiderman
The "Not George Wright" Tintype is over $1200 and reserve not yet met... |
#26
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19th century experts (Jay etc.) any opinions on this...
Posted By: Hankron
Jaime, it's not you. Your a smart cookie, and I'm confident that you know more about 19th century baseball photos than any of the bidders or seller. |
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