1989 Fleer Bill Ripken White Box

bnorth · #1 08-04-2025, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacksoncoupage

It seems to me that the language used in describing various whiteout corrections, back then and now, refers to Fleer employees hand-editing the bat knobs on the production line. I've never held a whiteout variation but I've followed dialog about the Ripkens for a few decades. Its always been odd to me that nobody since the hyperfocus on this card of the last 20 years has ever written an in depth description of the whiteout area: ie, is it the same surface gloss/texture as the rest of the card. I'm sure you have seen all the strange and varying white shapes that have popped up on ebay over the years and they are hardly consistent. This leads me to believe that any "white" was applied to either fully printed FF or Box (or Scribble) versions, in the factory or otherwise.

Most of them are BB cards because they are cheaper for the guy at home making them. If I can hold it in hand I can pretty much tell you how the person made them. I have a stack of them made many different ways I have purchased over the years and I highly doubt a single one left Fleer that way.

I have seen unopened packs with even the silly rare versions showing. I have never seen anything with a whiteout version showing. I have opened a ton of 89 Fleer and know many others who have also opened many many cases of it and nobody I know has ever personally found one.

I do have one real whiteout story but it was really whiteout over a FF version. My younger brother pulled it out of a pack when we opened some wax boxes back in the day. I seen him pull it and scratch the whiteout off the card. Other than that I pretty much call BS on all whiteouts.

All the scribble versions can easily be explained with how printing works

jacksoncoupage · #2 08-04-2025, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnorth

Most of them are BB cards because they are cheaper for the guy at home making them. If I can hold it in hand I can pretty much tell you how the person made them. I have a stack of them made many different ways I have purchased over the years and I highly doubt a single one left Fleer that way.

I have seen unopened packs with even the silly rare versions showing. I have never seen anything with a whiteout version showing. I have opened a ton of 89 Fleer and know many others who have also opened many many cases of it and nobody I know has ever personally found one.

I do have one real whiteout story but it was really whiteout over a FF version. My younger brother pulled it out of a pack when we opened some wax boxes back in the day. I seen him pull it and scratch the whiteout off the card. Other than that I pretty much call BS on all whiteouts.

All the scribble versions can easily be explained with how printing works

I guess this is what confuses me still. Aside from the fact that whiteout variations can be faked easily, are the ones pulled from packs, like the one your younger brother pulled, other versions that Fleer workers applied whiteout or other substance over the bat knob - OR - are some white versions printed on the card (scribble for example)? Or is it a mix of both? Most hobby write-ups at the time refer to it as something Fleer's people did in the factory, which seems very odd to me and something PSA would never slab.

More importantly, I am very interested in what Gilkeson was referring to as a 'white box' version, which he describes in the article as the same as the black box version but white. I have yet to see a copy of this offered for sale and have not seen it mentioned outside his write-up ca. 1989.

jp1216 · #3 08-05-2025, 07:19 AM

Oh boy. Great topic. Time to put the coffee down and type:

My opinion has always been - 'Whiteout' or 'White Box' etc cards are all Post Production creations. Without question, some/many came from inside Fleer. Some were even inserted into packs but most were backdoored by employees.

These are not to be confused with the authentic White Scribble version!

White Box, White Blob, White smudge, White line, White Stripe - there are lots. Believe it or not - many of these came from within Fleer, but are all Post Production creations. Why? I know Fleer offered 'replacement' cards through the mail for those that found the FF too offensive to own. What were these replacements? I've heard anything from Whiteouts (by employees), to standard Black Box (real) versions to even Paper Hole Punched cards. Fact is - Fleer people did 'create' these but they are nothing more that Post Production human altering and should never be slabbed/graded. Some are easy to notice in hand, others are not so much - but they are all Altered/Authentic cards and not true versions or variations. Kind of like that 1952 Mantle where someone drew glasses on his face. (pic added)

They could have been dispersed to create a buzz for the '89 Fleer product after sales declined with the introduction of standard Black Box corrected cards. Fleer was sold later in 1989 so maybe they were trying to boost numbers. Who knows?

Do I own a few 'graded' Whiteouts? Sure. But they are just part of my collection. Part of the FF story. PSA, BGS and SGC to be exact.

This was years before everyone had the internet. For some time, Whiteouts and White Scribbles were being mixed up and confused. White Scribbles are real but also are faked. Buyer beware. 10 years ago, there was a rash of these popping up.

I have received dozens of these cards from people that either worked at Fleer or had direct contact. From within the plant, but Post Production / altered.

One of my favorite FF cards was obtained from the estate of the late former head of Fleer - Frank Mustin who died in 2018. It's a Black Box cards with a whiteout smudge on the front. Someone also wrote "Make it look Professional' on the surface. Pretty cool card that resided with Mr. Mustin for 30 years. Smoking gun? You never know. Cool card though.

The Gilkeson article mentions 'White Box' but not 'Whiteout'. I have seen square-ish, oval, circle, smooth, fuzzy etc white knobs. Maybe he was simply referring to one or a few box-ish examples he had seen.

Great topic!

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