PSA has stopped accepting submissions

[dealme]

Originally Posted by edhans

362 new employees in the last 14 months. Wonder how many of them can spot a fake or altered card or tell the difference between an e120 and a w573.

I would guess very few, which may or may not be an issue. If they were hiring to meet the demand created by the glut of modern submissions, then being able to tell subtle differences in pre-war cards is probably not a requirement of the new employees.

I had always made the assumption that the grading companies operated in some type of assembly line fashion (which may or may not be correct). That would likely leave the logjam with the individual actually assigning the grade. To me, it would seem like there would or could potentially be a rather steep learning curve to this type of thing, even for someone with what many on this board would consider basic knowledge. As with many other business problems, throwing more people at a problem doesn't always make it go away.

Cheers,
Mark

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

Actually it was supposed to be the same grade.

Rich

Maybe that was the original plan but I can guarantee that is not what happened in all cases. I am not saying that they didn't change it to correct a mistake, just that it did happen. A long time hobby friend and fellow member was way more than a little mad when they done it to him.

Originally Posted by Leon

One of my fave meals is BBQ. In Texas it is just a fact. That said. have yawl seen how much BBQ has gone up recently? You would think they are in the grading business!

To answer Ed's question above, 0 graders will know the difference between an E120 and W573. They look the same on the front, ya know...

Yep. It has gotten more expensive but worth it at the great places. Have two right here in Central Texas. Salt Lick BBQ in Driftwood and Creekside right here in Wimberley. Two of the best in Texas!

[conor912]

Originally Posted by Leon

One of my fave meals is BBQ. In Texas it is just a fact. That said. have yawl seen how much BBQ has gone up recently? You would think they are in the grading business!

To answer Ed's question above, 0 graders will know the difference between an E120 and W573. They look the same on the front, ya know...

TBH, I’ve never not had sticker shock at a BBQ joint, but I’ve never once regretted it, either. Expensive ingredients + a lot of labor is gonna cost you. The pandemic certainly isn’t helping the supply chain either. My guess is meat prices soar even higher as we head into prime grilling season, too.

As for PSA, it’s pretty rare that a company creates such a high demand for their product/service that they no longer even try to meet it. Usually when this happens another company swoops in to fill the gap, but I’m not so sure here. PSA is so much more preferred by everyone. I think Peter’s theory is interesting...that they come out of this and position themselves as a higher end option. If that happens, however, the hobby will be forced to accept an alternative TPG as the leader in the lower end, and I see no front runner there. It’ll be interesting to see how it plays out, nonetheless.

[Rich Klein]

Originally Posted by dealme

I would guess very few, which may or may not be an issue. If they were hiring to meet the demand created by the glut of modern submissions, then being able to tell subtle differences in pre-war cards is probably not a requirement of the new employees.

I had always made the assumption that the grading companies operated in some type of assembly line fashion (which may or may not be correct). That would likely leave the logjam with the individual actually assigning the grade. To me, it would seem like there would or could potentially be a rather steep learning curve to this type of thing, even for someone with what many on this board would consider basic knowledge. As with many other business problems, throwing more people at a problem doesn't always make it go away.

Cheers,
Mark

Remember many of the newly hired employees are NOT hired as graders. You need people to accept mail, open mail, ship out packages, do data entry, do accounting, etc. Never assume everyone is hired as a grader and frankly many of the people just need to be proficient at what they are hired for, not card knowledge

[egri]

Originally Posted by Leon

Have you ever seen prices go down? Maybe for a blip but not much at all. My guess is prices for grading goes up. New owners and all....

.

Like when the College Board eliminated the essay part of the SATs, and exam fees went up because they had 'restructured' the exam.

[samosa4u]

Originally Posted by conor912

There are enough devout PSA addicts that will just save up their cards rather than sub to a different TPG. PSA could see a tidal wave come July 1 and be right back where they started....

Exactly! SGC ain't getting shit!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

Exactly! SGC ain't getting shit!

Unless those lower tiers never come back, which would not surprise me.

[h2oya311]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Who is "Anthony Rendon"?

Adam - You do live in LA, right? Modern is clearly a four letter word to you.

[frankbmd]

I thought PSA was justifying their recent prices increases by including a side of BBQ with each order.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by h2oya311

Adam - You do live in LA, right? Modern is clearly a four letter word to you.

So, an athlete?

[Touch'EmAll]

Interesting recent article - PSA claims Pokemon submissions have greatly affected their turnaround times. Pokemon Company says they can't print cards fast enough.

Yes, newer sports cards are overwhelming PSA, but Pokemon sounds like a huge contributing factor to the long delays.

[AGuinness]

I just can't see the logic that another grading company can take advantage of this. PSA gets higher prices because of its registry. People use PSA because they get higher prices due to the registry. I'm pretty sure that if people were willing to wait six months or so to get their cards back after being graded anyway, pausing submissions until July won't incentivize anyone to go to another TPG. There isn't another TPG that has remotely positioned themselves to taking advantage of this situation and PSA surely knows this.

[hcv123]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

Exactly! SGC ain't getting shit!

They are in process of getting about $3k of my business!

I can "afford" to sell cards for less in SGC holders if I need to - I can't sell crap from the 5 orders that I have sitting at PSA from as early as JULY! I can't make $$ on inventory that I can't sell. Secondly, the difference in grading fee allows me "room" to sell an SGC graded card for $75 less (for cards valued under $499) and still be in the same place net should I choose to do so.

The only reason I have heard that gives me any pause is the extra piece of pointy plastic (on the black plastic insert) that another board member found in his recently received slab.

This situation reminds of the "soup nazi" episode of seinfeld!! - NO GRADES FOR YOU!

[Arazi4442]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

So, an athlete?

What if I had replaced Rendon with Teofimo Lopez, would that help?

[bobbyw8469]

I get exactly what Howard is saying. I still have a hard time pulling the trigger on SGC, when PSA brings sooooooooooooooooooooo much more money!!! Irregardless, sounds like all the Big Boys are gonna be charging AT MINIMUM, $20 per card to get stuff graded. I will wait and see if the quarterly specials resume. The swinging 60's was a good one.

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

BTW- the Onion started in Madison, WI - Go Badgers!

[conor912]

I just don’t understand how hard it is for SGC to put together a registry. Give the data to a few college kids and they’d build it in a week for beer money.

[Johnny630]

SGC May have to raise their pricing for a while to keep from becoming overwhelmed. Idk

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Couple thoughts.

1. What's the difference if your cards sit in your possession or PSA's? If a bulk submission was going to take 9 months anyway it doesn't disincentivize you to wait for PSA to get caught up in 4 months and then take another two to grade your bulk order, providing they get their ducks in a row for the slamming they are going to take if and when they accept bulk again.

2. This MIGHT hurt the raw card market on low value raw, high value PSA 10, cards. Jordan cards like 89 Fleer which were selling for nice money raw to people who intended to gamble with it may suffer as there is no way you're going to gamble $300 on grading that card.

3. It might well HELP the versions of those cards already graded because they are no longer infinite until PSA makes it affordable to grade them again. So cards like PSA 9 and 10 1989 UD Griffey might actually go up FURTHER because the supply isn't going to increase for a while and if the speculators are holding onto theirs it may make them appear more scarce than they actually are.

That's three thoughts actually but the last one hit me while I was typing the 2nd.

So if I were in this market personally, I'd likely look to buy raw and sell graded, not immediately, but I'd definitely be watching things closely.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Couple thoughts.

1. What's the difference if your cards sit in your possession or PSA's? If a bulk submission was going to take 9 months anyway it doesn't disincentivize you to wait for PSA to get caught up in 4 months and then take another two to grade your bulk order, providing they get their ducks in a row for the slamming they are going to take if and when they accept bulk again.

2. This MIGHT hurt the raw card market on low value raw, high value PSA 10, cards. Jordan cards like 89 Fleer which were selling for nice money raw to people who intended to gamble with it may suffer as there is no way you're going to gamble $300 on grading that card.

3. It might well HELP the versions of those cards already graded because they are no longer infinite until PSA makes it affordable to grade them again. So cards like PSA 9 and 10 1989 UD Griffey might actually go up FURTHER because the supply isn't going to increase for a while and if the speculators are holding onto theirs it may make them appear more scarce than they actually are.

That's three thoughts actually but the last one hit me while I was typing the 2nd.

So if I were in this market personally, I'd likely look to buy raw and sell graded, not immediately, but I'd definitely be watching things closely.

Isn't the part I made bold the whole idea anyway? There is no more money in selling PSA cards than SGC or Beckett if you bought them graded. Sure PSA might sell for more but that just means you paid more for it. I always though the real money was buying raw and selling PSA graded cards.

Then if you can do a few group subs so others are paying to get your cards graded you can make even more. At least that has always been my take on it.

[bobbyw8469]

Then if you can do a few group subs so others are paying to get your cards graded you can make even more. At least that has always been my take on it.

I must be doing something wrong then......

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

I must be doing something wrong then......

Charge an extra $1 a card then. On a 500 card sub that should be several free cards for the work of doing the submission.

To be clear Bobby what you do for everyone on the forum is great, I have even got in on at least one before.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Ben, sure but I think the difference is going to be more extreme than in the past. Also right now speculators are hoarding the graded stuff. Cards you used to find 40 of on Ebay at any given time aren't there at all right now. I'm also not talking about doing it with the idea of grading the raw that you buy and flipping it. I'm specifically thinking because you will be UNABLE to do just that it may have interesting repercussions on the raw card world.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by conor912

I just don’t understand how hard it is for SGC to put together a registry. Give the data to a few college kids and they’d build it in a week for beer money.

Is it possible that the registry idea is proprietary to PSA (or their lawyers are at least pushing that narrative), and that is the reason none of the other TPG's have followed in those footsteps?

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Is it possible that the registry idea is proprietary to PSA (or their lawyers are at least pushing that narrative), and that is the reason none of the other TPG's have followed in those footsteps?

Also............don't understand why anybody would need anything more then a Pop report to get a feel for value, rarity, demand, etc......

Anything beyond that is just a d*ck measuring contest.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Is it possible that the registry idea is proprietary to PSA (or their lawyers are at least pushing that narrative), and that is the reason none of the other TPG's have followed in those footsteps?

I am asking because I got out of graded cards. Did SGC completely get rid of the crappy registry they used to have?

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I am asking because I got out of graded cards. Did SGC completely get rid of the crappy registry they used to have?

I don't know, LOL. I just (barely), got into graded.

[hcv123]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Is it possible that the registry idea is proprietary to PSA (or their lawyers are at least pushing that narrative), and that is the reason none of the other TPG's have followed in those footsteps?

SGC had one - it just wasn't very user friendly.

As discussed in another thread the time is ripe for a 3rd party registry that is inclusive of at least the big 3 grading companies (PSA, SGC and Beckett).

Re: what's the difference if you have inventory or PSA has it? Really? Imagine how an auction company would do with no consignments (their "inventory"). I'm more "okay" with PSA not taking subs than taking them and saying we have no idea when we will get these back to you. 3 of the 5 subs I have there were submitted while they still had turnaround estimates. 1 of them coming up on a year now. VERY different for a collector just looking to put a card away (in which case I agree with your assessment).

It is definitely going to be interesting to see how this move affects the market both short and long term. A number of different possible outcomes.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I am asking because I got out of graded cards. Did SGC completely get rid of the crappy registry they used to have?

It was a hot mess that they were "updating" and going to release the new and better version of. As that statement got stale and old (that was the line for YEARS) they finally admitted defeat and pulled the plug on it a few months ago.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Casey2296

Agreed. Did you catch Barret-Jackson last week? Thursday and Friday usually pretty sedate, this year it was weekend prices from the get go, 75k cards going for 200k, the commentators were blown away. This isn't going to end until it ends badly.

somebody offered me 100, then 125 and finally 150K the other day on a drive around the block in the Resto Mod. It was tough not to say "Here's the Keys fatso". He said it would cost him 200 to build it today if he could find someone to do it. There is a year wait at most good builders. VROOOOMMMMMM

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

somebody offered me 100, then 125 and finally 150K the other day on a drive around the block in the Resto Mod. It was tough not to say "Here's the Keys fatso". He said it would cost him 200 to build it today if he could find someone to do it. There is a year wait at most good builders. VROOOOMMMMMM

Still less time then it takes PSA to get your cards back to you.


Zing!

I'm here all night folks!

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

somebody offered me 100, then 125 and finally 150K the other day on a drive around the block in the Resto Mod. It was tough not to say "Here's the Keys fatso". He said it would cost him 200 to build it today if he could find someone to do it. There is a year wait at most good builders. VROOOOMMMMMM

Nice ride Chuck. My uncle had a white/blue 74 with the HO 455. My cousin and I used to beat the hell out of it back in the day.

[Fred]

I'm not a PSA fan but I don't think this is going to change anything as far as collectors opinions are concerned. PSA will be the desired slab for most people that like TPG flips.

[hockeyhockey]

i'm still not caught up on the registry thing - what's the point of it? is it just people registering their collection online?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

i'm still not caught up on the registry thing - what's the point of it? is it just people registering their collection online?

It's never too late to get into it.

It is basically a dick measuring contest for most. Others it is a nice way to keep track of your collection.

[mark evans]

Originally Posted by bnorth

It's never too late to get into it.

It is basically a dick measuring contest for most. Others it is a nice way to keep track of your collection.

Pretty funny. I can think of several less costly, and more accurate, measuring methods.

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by bnorth

It is basically a dick measuring contest for most. Others it is a nice way to keep track of your collection.

i was gonna say that, but you went and said it for me

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by bnorth

It's never too late to get into it.

It is basically a dick measuring contest for most. Others it is a nice way to keep track of your collection.

I have one set registered with PSA - my t206 set. Why? 100% a dick flaunt. I admit it, guilty. And god damn is it addictive. PSA’s registry is absolutely brilliant.

I add, I am not really a set guy. I only own two other complete sets - E104–II pirates (mix of SGC and PSA) and 1906 Lincoln Publishing (all SGC, but I bought it this way). I am far along on a D304 set (mix of SGC and PSA). No thought of/care for the PSA registry for these. I collect cards in both slabs. All things equal, I prefer my rare stuff in SGC slabs (bc SGC is much more knowledgeable/better) and more “commodity” cards in PSA (bc of value). But generally speaking, I will buy a card in either flip if I like the card. I will not buy 1950 or older cards in any other flip.

[Johnny630]

https://gosgc.com/update-20210401?fb...Xe6-kH_7V9UFlI

I called it above

[Dardevl]

Does anyone know if tickets and/or autographs are included?

Vintage cars and baseball cards. Oh yeah. Two of mine.

[Tyruscobb]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

https://gosgc.com/update-20210401?fb...Xe6-kH_7V9UFlI

I called it above

Surely, this is an April Fools' joke. $75.00 a card?

Edit: No, it is now legitimately $75.00 a card.

Wow - just a 400% increase from the $15.00 a card just a month ago. I'm in the wrong business!

[36GoudeyMan]

We know that PSA cannot reliably detect trimming. The stories here and elsewhere demonstrate that beyond any real argument. Yet there is such a demand for PSA grading, despite its demonstrated unreliability, that they have to close their doors to new business.

SGC rolls out its "new" website, kills its Registry (such as it was, at least you could somewhat track your own inventory), and, after ceremoniously announcing it was largely caught up with demand, jacks its prices up 200% immediately after PSA announces its temporary shuttered doors.

Beckett seems to have no traction in the graded pre-war card market (not sure, I don't follow BVG or Beckett on eBay).

CSG is a new kid on the block with some pedigree, but seems not to be able yet to grade anything after 1980 all that well. Yet. Its prices fetched seem to reflect the market not the quality of their work, but we'll see.

Submitting anything but reliably high-value cards is now out of reach. People like me, who don't rip open boxes of shiny new basketball cards from boxes snuck out the back of WalMart are left pretty much with nowhere to turn.

COVID or none, the card collecting marketplace has now, I think, been irretrievably changed, and not for the better. On top of all the other losses and disappointments of the last year, the adverse changes to the hobby I've loved for over 50 years is truly disheartening.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Tyruscobb

Surely, this is an April Fools' joke. $75.00 a card?

Edit: No, it is now legitimately $75.00 a card.

Wow - just a 400% increase from the $15.00 a card just a month ago. I'm in the wrong business!

So has anyone actually started a submission today to see if it is a company trying to be funny with a April fools joke?

If not good for them if they can get a minimum of $75 a card. Raising the prices makes way more sense that hiring/training a bunch of people they will just have to lay off once all the new investors/collectors drop the hobby like a hot rock when they return to normal activities.

[Rich Klein]

Originally Posted by bnorth

So has anyone actually started a submission today to see if it is a company trying to be funny with a April fools joke?

If not good for them if they can get a minimum of $75 a card. Raising the prices makes way more sense that hiring/training a bunch of people they will just have to lay off once all the new investors/collectors drop the hobby like a hot rock when they return to normal activities.

I hear this is NOT an April Fools joke but a real response.

Rich

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

I hear this is NOT an April Fools joke but a real response.

Rich

Thanks for the confirmation Rich.

I was going to start a sub to see if it was a joke or not. Then they asked for my password and it has been so long since my last sub I couldn't remember it.

[GasHouseGang]

PSA announced today that they have stopped grading cards and will now just sell the sealed slabs with grades attached. Joe Orlando stated, “Here at PSA, we began to realize that the real value is in the PSA slab itself, and it doesn’t really matter what card is in the slab. Plus, grading cards is really difficult and very time consuming. We were falling behind in grading our submissions, so we finally decided to stop grading cards. I mean really, what’s the point?”

“From now on going forward, our customers can order a slab with a card identifier and grade they would like. So say you always wanted a 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle in a PSA 6 slab, just order the slab you want! Now you don’t have to wade through those giant auction catalogs any longer looking for that elusive PSA slab you need. Just order it directly from PSA! We are currently working out the pricing, and basing it on the latest completed auctions for cards sold in our PSA slabs. Look for a price list to come out soon.”

APRIL FOOLS! (I hope)

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by GasHouseGang

PSA announced today that they have stopped grading cards and will now just sell the sealed slabs with grades attached. Joe Orlando stated, “Here at PSA, we began to realize that the real value is in the PSA slab itself, and it doesn’t really matter what card is in the slab. Plus, grading cards is really difficult and very time consuming. We were falling behind in grading our submissions, so we finally decided to stop grading cards. I mean really, what’s the point?”

“From now on going forward, our customers can order a slab with a card identifier and grade they would like. So say you always wanted a 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle in a PSA 6 slab, just order the slab you want! Now you don’t have to wade through those giant auction catalogs any longer looking for that elusive PSA slab you need. Just order it directly from PSA! We are currently working out the pricing, and basing it on the latest completed auctions for cards sold in our PSA slabs. Look for a price list to come out soon.”

APRIL FOOLS! (I hope)

That is funny. I remember when a very similar thing was said about GAI. They would send you the slab, flip, and slab sealer so you could slab your own card. When done you would put the sealer back in the box and mark it "wrong address return to sender" to save on shipping.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Wimberleycardcollector

Vintage cars and baseball cards. Oh yeah. Two of mine.

VERY NICE, but are they graded? I think there is an auto grader AGA? You'll need them to sub, so they pop in the registry, otherwise they are fake....and no fun.