What is the origin of Frank Thomas NNOF?

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

There were two for sale. I just bought one. If anyone is interested in a live stream opening let me know.

wow, very cool. i'd watch.

[slidekellyslide]

Would love to watch you open the pack. Good luck!!

[jakeinge]

PM me your email addresses and I'll let you know when I plan on doing it. I will try to do it on YOUTUBE.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

PM me your email addresses and I'll let you know when I plan on doing it. I will try to do it on YOUTUBE.

You should just post a link here or PM some of us here. I get way too much email and don't always check it regularly anymore.

[Statfreak101]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

You should just post a link here or PM some of us here. I get way too much email and don't always check it regularly anymore.

Agreed.

[jakeinge]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

You should just post a link here or PM some of us here. I get way too much email and don't always check it regularly anymore.

Done! The live stream will be at 8:30pm tonight on my Facebook page. Here is the link:

https://www.facebook.com/jakeinge/

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

Done! The live stream will be at 8:30pm tonight on my Facebook page. Here is the link:

https://www.facebook.com/jakeinge/

working tonight, but good luck - will watch a recap if there is one.

[jakeinge]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

working tonight, but good luck - will watch a recap if there is one.

I will post a link to the video.

As an aside, I wonder what the reaction would be in the hobby if someone were to pull a Thomas on video.

[Statfreak101]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

I will post a link to the video.

As an aside, I wonder what the reaction would be in the hobby if someone were to pull a Thomas on video.

Awesome - looking to watching later as well.

[deweyinthehall]

Anyone here watching this live? I'm yelling "Tin Snips" at my monitor and cringing everytime the box cutter is run along the edge of the pack....

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by deweyinthehall

Anyone here watching this live? I'm yelling "Tin Snips" at my monitor and cringing everytime the box cutter is run along the edge of the pack....

No don't have the facebook. Hoping to watch the youtube link later when posted.

[deweyinthehall]

I won't give anything away - only that it was a nail biter as the PSA packaging was slowly chipped away...

[jakeinge]

Originally Posted by deweyinthehall

I won't give anything away - only that it was a nail biter as the PSA packaging was slowly chipped away...

HAHA! I learned a (luckily) cheap lesson!! I will be much better prepared next time (and there will probably be a next time). I pulled a Darrin Jackson partial blackless to boot! Video link is below:

https://www.facebook.com/503196138/v...7730769741139/

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

HAHA! I learned a (luckily) cheap lesson!! I will be much better prepared next time (and there will probably be a next time). I pulled a Darrin Jackson partial blackless to boot! Video link is below:

https://www.facebook.com/503196138/v...7730769741139/

That was extremely painful to watch. Your hoodie more than made up for it though.

EDIT: to add thanks for sharing.

[slidekellyslide]

Thanks for posting this. Love the Ripken FF hoodie!

[steve5838]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

HAHA! I learned a (luckily) cheap lesson!! I will be much better prepared next time (and there will probably be a next time). I pulled a Darrin Jackson partial blackless to boot! Video link is below:

https://www.facebook.com/503196138/v...7730769741139/

Thanks for sharing! This was great and exciting to watch.

[jakeinge]

It appears as though a new mystery and a new discovery were made with the opening of this pack. I was chatting with someone on Facebook who watched the video and is the guy on Youtube who opened 8 packs and pulled 2 of the blackless cards. The Darrin Jackson I pulled has a crease in the bottom center that loops up along the I in Darrin and bends left up just under the jersey button. Wouldn't you know it he has a blackless Darrin Jackson with the IDENTICAL CREASE. I believe it is safe to say the crease is correlated to the ink issue in some way. All of the printing experts out there are free to chime in. The mystery deepens....

[hockeyhockey]

that was awesome, congrats on the jackson. great card.

[HalfNipponese]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

It appears as though a new mystery and a new discovery were made with the opening of this pack. I was chatting with someone on Facebook who watched the video and is the guy on Youtube who opened 8 packs and pulled 2 of the blackless cards. The Darrin Jackson I pulled has a crease in the bottom center that loops up along the I in Darrin and bends left up just under the jersey button. Wouldn't you know it he has a blackless Darrin Jackson with the IDENTICAL CREASE. I believe it is safe to say the crease is correlated to the ink issue in some way. All of the printing experts out there are free to chime in. The mystery deepens....

Congratulations on your pull. Make sure to join the 1990 Topps Partial Blackless Facebook group.

[HalfNipponese]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

It appears as though a new mystery and a new discovery were made with the opening of this pack. I was chatting with someone on Facebook who watched the video and is the guy on Youtube who opened 8 packs and pulled 2 of the blackless cards. The Darrin Jackson I pulled has a crease in the bottom center that loops up along the I in Darrin and bends left up just under the jersey button. Wouldn't you know it he has a blackless Darrin Jackson with the IDENTICAL CREASE. I believe it is safe to say the crease is correlated to the ink issue in some way. All of the printing experts out there are free to chime in. The mystery deepens....

Congratulations on your pull. Make sure to join the 1990 Topps Partial Blackless Facebook group.

[ALR-bishop]

Hope it does not make the news that there is a Blackless Facebook group :-)

[jakeinge]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Hope it does not make the news that there is a Blackless Facebook group :-)

AL wins the internet today.

[HalfNipponese]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Hope it does not make the news that there is a Blackless Facebook group :-)

That took me a minute. Thinking man's humor...I love it.

[West]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

It appears as though a new mystery and a new discovery were made with the opening of this pack. I was chatting with someone on Facebook who watched the video and is the guy on Youtube who opened 8 packs and pulled 2 of the blackless cards. The Darrin Jackson I pulled has a crease in the bottom center that loops up along the I in Darrin and bends left up just under the jersey button. Wouldn't you know it he has a blackless Darrin Jackson with the IDENTICAL CREASE. I believe it is safe to say the crease is correlated to the ink issue in some way. All of the printing experts out there are free to chime in. The mystery deepens....

Very cool finds! However, the wrinkle does not have anything to do with the causation of the error.

[jakeinge]

Originally Posted by West

Very cool finds! However, the wrinkle does not have anything to do with the causation of the error.

What leads you to that conclusion? Not here to argue, but two blackless with identical creases would be indicative of there being correlation. I suppose I should open a box to see i a normal Jackson has the same crease though. I'm far from an expert here...

[West]

Originally Posted by jakeinge

What leads you to that conclusion? Not here to argue, but two blackless with identical creases would be indicative of there being correlation. I suppose I should open a box to see i a normal Jackson has the same crease though. I'm far from an expert here...

It defies the theories put forward by multiple printing experts on this thread and the main one on the CU forum. My best advice is just to read both of those threads. You don’t even have to leave this site, just go back one page. Every printing causation theory is discussed ad nauseam right on this thread. Finding a similar wrinkle on two cards is fairly interesting but not that uncommon and definitely not related to the cause of the errors.

[hockeyhockey]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/13378836174...0AAOSwbSdgxlL0

now apparently sammy sosa is part of all this

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

https://www.ebay.com/itm/13378836174...0AAOSwbSdgxlL0

now apparently sammy sosa is part of all this

LOL, thanks for the laugh. It is sad to see people with a decent ebay history pulling these type of scams. They should leave them for the zero feedback sellers.

One of my favorites was when a seller was selling missing red ink cards when the cards weren't missing the red ink.

[ALR-bishop]

Darn, you mean these are not true redless cards

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Darn, you mean these are not true redless cards

that's a great nolan ryan though!

[slidekellyslide]

Bought a 3000 count box today of 1990 Topps and found the Curt Ford blackless.

[slidekellyslide]

Still sorting and found two more error cards - The Leibrandt partial blackless and checklist #1 missing the "Continued" text.

[ALR-bishop]

You are on a roll Dan

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

You are on a roll Dan

And having fun with cards again thanks to you guys and your error/variation hunt that got me hooked when I was stuck at home. Going to keep this batch of cards separate from the rest of my collection so I can go back as I learn of more error/variations in the 1990 set since this box seems to contain an early run of the cards. Not a single Thomas in the box, but almost all other star cards are present except for Griffey.

[TheAck]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

And having fun with cards again thanks to you guys and your error/variation hunt that got me hooked when I was stuck at home. Going to keep this batch of cards separate from the rest of my collection so I can go back as I learn of more error/variations in the 1990 set since this box seems to contain an early run of the cards. Not a single Thomas in the box, but almost all other star cards are present except for Griffey.

lol me too.. spent 2 hours last night going through a box of mix 80s junk looking for 1990 cards. No variations (yet!)

[butchie_t]

I'm gonna have to go through mine now too. I opened a fair amount of wax of 90's. Of course no Frank's NNOFs to speak of at all. But one never knows if something else could be in the mix.


……later that day…..

I got a rock. Zilch, zip, nada. I even have a partial case left over and am not gonna bother gripping and ripping them open because that was what I pulled from to begin with.

[slidekellyslide]

A few weeks back I purchased a 3000 count box of 1990 Topps locally and while perusing I discovered some blackless cards I did not know about. I also found a checklist error card that is missing the "Continued on Checklist 2". When googling the Curt Ford card I found another collector had discovered the same green sheet partial blackless cards that I had found too so they are not a one off.

[lowpopper]

HOF RC NNOF

[ALR-bishop]

The Baines variant was highlighted sometime back in this thread

https://www.net54baseball.com/showth...ght=fleer+1981

[West]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

A few weeks back I purchased a 3000 count box of 1990 Topps locally and while perusing I discovered some blackless cards I did not know about. I also found a checklist error card that is missing the "Continued on Checklist 2". When googling the Curt Ford card I found another collector had discovered the same green sheet partial blackless cards that I had found too so they are not a one off.

Correct, this was me, I pulled all of the green sheet errors from a case of 1990 Topps, the case was mailed out on March 8, 1990 I believe so it was definitely not an early print run.
My case contained the Chris Speier error which had the largest missing blackless area. Nice to see you found a clean Curt Ford, mine had a very unfortunate scuff straight out of the pack that I've seen on many cards in the 1990 set.
Another point of interest - the green sheet cards from my case, also bore the distinctive blue plate scratch that was present on the orange sheet containing the Frank Thomas NNOF. I don't believe that to be a coincidence. I've opened up thousands of 1990 Topps packs from all kinds of sources, and I would say there were perhaps 3 other instances of finding noticeable plate scratches, and none came close to being as distinctive as the plate scratches that ran the length of both the orange and green sheets containing the blackless cards.

Speier:


Ford:


Here is how the cards would line up on an uncut sheet:

[slidekellyslide]

My stash of cards did not have a Speier card at all and the Santana, Meadows and Martinez cards were all normal. Now how do we get PSA to recognize these green sheet PB errors?

The Frank Thomas partial black is sitting in Goldin Auctions right now at $8,101 with the juice.

https://goldin.co/item/1990-topps-er...rd-psa-mipr73r

[Cliff Bowman]

At least two cards at the top of the A* Blue Sheet have the print flaw, John Smiley and Dan Pasqua. I suspect more cards on the top row may have also been affected.

[Cliff Bowman]

At least one other card is part of the E* Green Sheet print flaw, Lance Johnson, which is two cards away from the others. It seems Sammy Sosa should have also been affected but I have never seen or heard of one missing part of the border line.

[GoldenAge50s]

Can someone provide a list of all the card #'s affected by the "missing ink" & "white areas" so I can check mine out?

[slidekellyslide]

Cliff, when did you discover those extra missing black cards? Is there a definitive list somewhere of these cards?

[Cliff Bowman]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

Cliff, when did you discover those extra missing black cards? Is there a definitive list somewhere of these cards?

I wish I did discover them, richtree posted the Smiley and Pasqua on page 22 of the CU thread nearly three years ago and I ran across the Lance Johnson listed on eBay about a year ago. I would say without a doubt that Jay Howell and Candy Maldonado were also affected and possibly more on the top row of the A* Blue Sheet, the other cards on the top row are Ramon Martinez, Ricky Jordan, Andre Dawson, Stan Javier, Benito Santiago, Mike Witt, and Todd Burns.

[GoldenAge50s]

Cliff--

Do you have a list by card number, not name??

Anybody??

[jacksoncoupage]

Originally Posted by Cliff Bowman

I wish I did discover them, richtree posted the Smiley and Pasqua on page 22 of the CU thread nearly three years ago and I ran across the Lance Johnson listed on eBay about a year ago. I would say without a doubt that Jay Howell and Candy Maldonado were also affected and possibly more on the top row of the A* Blue Sheet, the other cards on the top row are Ramon Martinez, Ricky Jordan, Andre Dawson, Stan Javier, Benito Santiago, Mike Witt, and Todd Burns.

I pulled a few of the dark blue border blue cards from holiday factory sets around 2007-2008. The only one I can recall with clarity was Doug Drabek with the blackless portion over the team name on front, like the Smiley.

None of them had the full, missing black ink like the Lance Johnson, Speier, but more like how the Smiley looks with a bit of gradient/fog to it.

All of the blackless green borders I found came from random collections and lots purchased in the PNW, I never pulled any from sealed product, unfortunately.

[hockeyhockey]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/384672072649

far from an expert on these, but the bidding suggests this may be legit.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

https://www.ebay.com/itm/384672072649

far from an expert on these, but the bidding suggests this may be legit.

Someone is going to be sad when they get that. Hopefully they figure out it is bad while they can still get their cash back.