An Ebay transaction first -soliciting opinions

[tschock]

Originally Posted by hcv123

Again - thank you all for your input - the conflicting perspectives highlight well the dilemma and questions.

1) Is it reasonable to expect that the buyer would keep the poster in its unopened state seems like the really important consideration.

My thought after mulling this over is that it is a more reasonable scenario in the case of a poster (significantly different in my mind from an unopened pack of cards) that a buyer will want to open and display it and would be purchasing one that was unopened expecting it to be in better condition than an opened one.

2) There was no "intent to deceive" on either part - of course I couldn't know about the damage and nor could the buyer.

3) The poster including shipping was about $200 - somewhat irrelevant in my mind to the question at hand.

4) Everything that has been stated about Ebay - in my experience is 100% accurate and if it got to a "not as described case" I am almost certain Ebay would side with the buyer - regardless of reasonable mitigating circumstances.

5) The buyer has in the mean time communicated he wants a 100% refund. I am going to give it to him - 90% because I believe that is reasonable given the circumstances and 10% because any other decision would more than likely come back to bite me in the ass with Ebay!

Just curious. Are you asking him to return the poster? I think for me, and as someone else pointed out, it depends on the 'pain point'. Again, just curious.

[hcv123]

Originally Posted by tschock

Just curious. Are you asking him to return the poster? I think for me, and as someone else pointed out, it depends on the 'pain point'. Again, just curious.

The unique thing about the poster was that it was never opened. With the damage and the fact that it is opened, it isn't worth investing anything more into. I told him I do not want it back (he offered to return it).

[Leon]

Originally Posted by hcv123

The unique thing about the poster was that it was never opened. With the damage and the fact that it is opened, it isn't worth investing anything more into. I told him I do not want it back (he offered to return it).

Good decision. Life is too short to let small issues take up too much time.

[Tyruscobb]

In my humble opinion, the general rule is that the buyer bears, at least on the secondary market, the entire risk. He must take the good with the bad. The exception is if the seller knew the issue existed and failed to properly disclose it. Absent proving the seller’s bad faith, the buyer takes the risk.

There was a chance the poster was pristine and worth considerably more than the paid price. If this occurred, I doubt the buyer would offer you a partial refund. There was also the chance for the opposite, as what occurred here, that the poster would be worth less than the selling price.. The buyer does not get to experience all the upside with no downside risk. This is my opinion.

If the buyer sent pictures and you are convinced the damage would’ve occurred even with exercising the utmost care, I would potentially give a partial refund. However, I don’t think you are obligated to do it.

[Leon]

While I said what I did above here, and I still believe it, I do agree the buyer bears most of the brunt. But it's still all about the shi$ to equity ratio.

Originally Posted by Tyruscobb

In my humble opinion, the general rule is that the buyer bears, at least on the secondary market, the entire risk. He must take the good with the bad. The exception is if the seller knew the issue existed and failed to properly disclose it. Absent proving the seller’s bad faith, the buyer takes the risk.

There was a chance the poster was pristine and worth considerably more than the paid price. If this occurred, I doubt the buyer would offer you a partial refund. There was also the chance for the opposite, as what occurred here, that the poster would be worth less than the selling price.. The buyer does not get to experience all the upside with no downside risk. This is my opinion.

If the buyer sent pictures and you are convinced the damage would’ve occurred even with exercising the utmost care, I would potentially give a partial refund. However, I don’t think you are obligated to do it.

[D. Bergin]

I'll admit, when I first read this thread my initial reaction was to just refund and move on, without much discussion. Poster from the late 80's? Can't be that big of a deal, and yeah, you'd want it to unroll in pristine condition to display.

Now that I've gone and looked the item up and made comparisons, you are right in that the poster definitely sold at a premium BECAUSE it was unopened.

If this guy just wanted a poster to display, he could have bought an already opened poster of that same subject, in pretty good condition for much less.

Hope he sent you pictures of the poster as proof at least, and I also hope he wasn't just using you to upgrade an already damaged poster.

[perezfan]

This is really a tough one. As I read this thread from start to finish, I must have changed my opinion 3-4 times. Bottom line (unfortunately) is that eBay will inevitably side with the Buyer. So why make it difficult or uncomfortable?

I would just issue the refund (in exchange for getting the Poster back), and move on. No point in belaboring the issue or dragging it out, as we all know where eBay would land in the event of a dispute.

Definitely a bummer, but not the end of the world.

[LarsenMN]

You sold the item packaged, in it's sold form to the buyer. You are not the manufacturer of the item so any defects are not your responsibility. He would have to contact the manufacturer who will a. no longer be in business or b. manufacturer's warranty is now void. I had this problem selling new old stock pipes, as buyer would complain about manufacturer's flaws that I was not responsible for. I would imagine this poster was relatively inexpensive.

Although you are not at fault, My advice would be refund the money, let them keep the poster and put them on your "do not sell" list moving forward if you suspect they are trying to pull a fast one. From my experience, they complain once, they will complain again, again and again to try to get a better price. Even if you have a no questions asked 100% satisfaction refund. I even had buyers try to scam me giving me the "pity" card saying they are a retired vet with limited money, so I should give them 75% off my asking price. Not falling for that one.

[hcv123]

As stated I already gave the guy a refund and told him I didn't want the poster back. I'm glad to have sparked a thought provoking conversation.

He did send me pictures showing the damage and while I will never know for sure do not believe he was pulling a fast one. He stated the poster was for Bo Jackson (it was a Bo poster) to sign for a charity event.

As stated, Ebay's position on this is presumably clear - they will side with the buyer - right wrong or otherwise.

I stand by my earlier comment that my ultimate perspective after wrestling back and forth with it myself is it is a reasonable expectation that someone would open never opened old stock of an item like a poster (different in my mind than a pack of cards - or many other old unopened collectibles). As mentioned he could have purchased one that was not sealed - I think in a perfect world it would have been equitable to split the cost in some way, but given the Ebay factor - I didn't think it was worth the battle.