Its not just moser/pwcc...more trimmers exposed

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by steve B

The hobby was around for a long time before grading. And will be around a long time after it.

I still don't understand giving more business to a company that from what I can see is either grossly incompetent. Or is involved in deliberately allowing altered cards to be graded.

But hey, it's PSA! They're the experts and final arbiters of all things cards. How dare we question them....

Not questioning them. But like I stated earlier, am I supposed to quit going to my gym because a few of the members there take steroids??? I know I DO NOT cheat. It's called ETHICS. It sounds like a few members need a class in it.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Not questioning them. But like I stated earlier, am I supposed to quit going to my gym because a few of the members there take steroids??? I know I DO NOT cheat. It's called ETHICS. It sounds like a few members need a class in it.

that gym analogy isn't a good one imo. would you keep going to the gym if it was proven that the gym equipment did't contribute to muscle building/overall health?

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

that gym analogy isn't a good one imo. would you keep going to the gym if it was proven that the gym equipment did't contribute to muscle building/overall health?

Oh, but the machines ARE working!! Compare myself to someone who doesn't work out at all (ie, a raw card) and you can see the difference. I sold a Mars Attacks checklist last night in PSA mid grade form for almost $1,000. If I were to sell the card raw, it would bring around 1/5 of that. Am I supposed to not get my cards graded because of the scams of others? Should I just leave the hobby entirely, as it is ALL corrupt?? I tell you what....you sell all your cards and never buy another card in your life and I will follow suit.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Not questioning them. But like I stated earlier, am I supposed to quit going to my gym because a few of the members there take steroids??? I know I DO NOT cheat. It's called ETHICS. It sounds like a few members need a class in it.

If you were an athlete competing at a very high level, that answer would be yes.
Cycling requires a written itinerary of where off-season training will be done, and who you do it with. Going outside the written plan without advance written notice is taken as a potentially positive test. If you train with dopers, or dopers coaches, or see their doctors you get bumped into the next level of suspicion, and get extra scrutiny.

If you don't want to be associated with dopers, you can work out at home, or in a gym with a better reputation.


Similarly, PSA readily grades cards that are altered, possibly knowing they're altered. It now appears that altering and getting the card to pass is just as prevalent as doping in cycling (In other words, depending on era anywhere from rampant to almost required.)
I'd consider any card in a PSA holder as suspect. That doesn't mean of course that the submitter altered it, but my level on confidence that the grade is correct and that the card is not altered is currently very low.

To avoid this, just like the cyclist could train in a less suspect gym, or at home, a collector could collect cards that aren't graded, or are graded by someone else. (Admittedly difficult, since all the big 3 have problems, and the rest either don't have enough track record, or are worse. )

[drcy]

A sensible response is not to spend $200,000.00 for a 1957 Topps Sandy Koufax or $15,000.00 for a 1980 Topps Rickey Henderson because it's in a PSA 10 holder.

Of course, then, that would have been the sensible thing to do in the first place.

[Bicem]

Originally Posted by drcy

A sensible response is not to spend $200,000.00 for a 1957 Topps Sandy Koufax or $15,000.00 for a 1980 Topps Rickey Henderson because it's in a PSA 10 holder.

Of course, then, that would have been the sensible thing to in the first place.

Yep, I've always thought it was insane how much people put blind faith into PSA, especially when it came down to so much money and such minimal grade (opinion) difference.

If anything, I hope this entire mess helps recalibrate collector mindset a bit.

[calvindog]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAm...ature=youtu.be


CLCT down over 9% today.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by Bicem

Yep, I've always thought it was insane how much people put blind faith into PSA, especially when it came down to so much money and such minimal grade (opinion) difference.

If anything, I hope this entire mess helps recalibrate collector mindset a bit.

I've always been baffled by that as well. Literally the very first card graded by the company was no good by their standards.

[swarmee]

PSA: another for my wish list.

Decertify Cert# 00,000,001

Take it up with Ken Kendrick.