State Of The Hobby

[AGuinness]

Originally Posted by Dpeck100

Buying a card for $20 and selling it for $50 isn't going to change anyone's life but find me another area where the investment minimums are so low and the percentage returns can be so outsized. I don't know of one.

I flip cards at COMC and have been pretty successful at doing this, sometimes for not as great a profit, occasionally better and with a hit-and-miss sprinkled in, too. I'm not a big player there or in the hobby in general, but flipping at COMC in addition to my other hobby ventures makes for a diverse and fun hobby.
I think COMC's rise over the past 10 years, in particular, is a strong point for the health of the hobby (in general). The site's foundation is in buying and selling of lower valued cards and in set builders, and the company has grown tremendously. It's now one of the bigger sellers on eBay and elsewhere, I believe.
And here's a hair-brained theory on the state of the hobby, in general, and recent price increases...
Access to the hobby has increased dramatically over the past 10-20 years. eBay is now readily available on most everyone's phone, major auction houses offer numerous auctions every year and people can participate from anywhere in the world, and collectors have the ability to purchase and learn about the hobby at a level that is unprecedented. So, in terms of the demand side, it is easier than ever for a seller to access a greater population of the people who want a card. With the greater access to the demand side, prices have gone up - but perhaps this isn't a bubble for prices, perhaps this is actually more of an accurate representation of true price when it comes to supply and demand.
In this way, despite some high profile scams recently (forged T206s, trimmed cards in high-graded slabs, shilling, etc.), perhaps the state of the hobby is actually as healthy as ever.

[clydepepper]

I'm still having fun, but I use far more resources before making purchases.

[Leon]

Good analysis. I remember about 20 yrs ago when I first started ebay. I knew it was a game changer. I remember putting quite a bit of savings into it, as such. It worked out fairly well back then. Just pick the right cards and don't sell short. And then try to time the stock market.

Originally Posted by AGuinness

I flip cards at COMC and have been pretty successful at doing this, sometimes for not as great a profit, occasionally better and with a hit-and-miss sprinkled in, too. I'm not a big player there or in the hobby in general, but flipping at COMC in addition to my other hobby ventures makes for a diverse and fun hobby.
I think COMC's rise over the past 10 years, in particular, is a strong point for the health of the hobby (in general). The site's foundation is in buying and selling of lower valued cards and in set builders, and the company has grown tremendously. It's now one of the bigger sellers on eBay and elsewhere, I believe.
And here's a hair-brained theory on the state of the hobby, in general, and recent price increases...
Access to the hobby has increased dramatically over the past 10-20 years. eBay is now readily available on most everyone's phone, major auction houses offer numerous auctions every year and people can participate from anywhere in the world, and collectors have the ability to purchase and learn about the hobby at a level that is unprecedented. So, in terms of the demand side, it is easier than ever for a seller to access a greater population of the people who want a card. With the greater access to the demand side, prices have gone up - but perhaps this isn't a bubble for prices, perhaps this is actually more of an accurate representation of true price when it comes to supply and demand.
In this way, despite some high profile scams recently (forged T206s, trimmed cards in high-graded slabs, shilling, etc.), perhaps the state of the hobby is actually as healthy as ever.

[swabie2424]

Fun thread. The age old question!

Lots of excellent points made so I won't rehash.

Allow me to say I totally agree about technology aiding in the success of the market these past 10-20 years. It's just quite simply way easier to buy and sell. My collecting life changed with the ebay app... not having to run back to a computer X number of times per day. Alerts, bid sniping, message boards etc etc. Basically the world is your card store/show and opportunity abounds to build a collection or invest in any way a person desires! Also, in the internet age, with ease of access to quick/solid research, there's just such an awareness of value to possessions for the average non-moron. What once may have been tossed in the trash or thrown into a yard sale bin for a quarter is now posted on an auction site for market value.

To add a new angle, and focus in on the vintage... I've been wondering at what point grading populations are going to begin to completely plateau on pre-war and then subsequently on the pre-70's post-war star player markets. Obviously there's a ways to go but at some point in the coming decades I have to imagine the vast, vast majority of the truly grade-worthy cards will have been slabbed (assuming the grading phenomenon doesn't implode/explode!) At some point, the days of finding major vintage collections in attics, in barns and at yard sales... or that co-worker staggering into work with his deceased dad's ungraded vintage collection... will come to end (with the rarest of exceptions becoming like unicorns.)

When those star player pop reports truly grind to a halt, and there are basically no more 1950's Mantles left to grade if you will... it's going to be very interesting to see what happens to the market.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by swabie2424

Fun thread. The age old question!

Lots of excellent points made so I won't rehash.

Allow me to say I totally agree about technology aiding in the success of the market these past 10-20 years. It's just quite simply way easier to buy and sell. My collecting life changed with the ebay app... not having to run back to a computer X number of times per day. Alerts, bid sniping, message boards etc etc. Basically the world is your card store/show and opportunity abounds to build a collection or invest in any way a person desires! Also, in the internet age, with ease of access to quick/solid research, there's just such an awareness of value to possessions for the average non-moron. What once may have been tossed in the trash or thrown into a yard sale bin for a quarter is now posted on an auction site for market value.

To add a new angle, and focus in on the vintage... I've been wondering at what point grading populations are going to begin to completely plateau on pre-war and then subsequently on the pre-70's post-war star player markets. Obviously there's a ways to go but at some point in the coming decades I have to imagine the vast, vast majority of the truly grade-worthy cards will have been slabbed (assuming the grading phenomenon doesn't implode/explode!) At some point, the days of finding major vintage collections in attics, in barns and at yard sales... or that co-worker staggering into work with his deceased dad's ungraded vintage collection... will come to end (with the rarest of exceptions becoming like unicorns.)

When those star player pop reports truly grind to a halt, and there are basically no more 1950's Mantles left to grade if you will... it's going to be very interesting to see what happens to the market.

Grading will never end, thank God. Cracked slabs will be weaponized and constitute an essential element of national security. The most popular bumper sticker of 2026 will read

CRACK IT FOR UNCLE SAM

[Leon]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Grading will never end, thank God. Cracked slabs will be weaponized and constitute an essential element of national security. The most popular bumper sticker of 2026 will read

CRACK IT FOR UNCLE SAM

More like CRACK IT FOR TPG's

.

[Directly]

Several years ago I bought a Graded 8 1993 SP Jeter RC card in the $150 range--I was surprised that same 8's now commanding in the 850.00 + range--I wish I had bought 5,000 dollars at 150.00 each--33 x $850.00 = $28,000-- (28,000 -5,000 = $22,000 profit)--I would suspect several astute investors on here loaded up on this modern icon.

[NYYFan63]

Originally Posted by AGuinness

I flip cards at COMC and have been pretty successful at doing this, sometimes for not as great a profit, occasionally better and with a hit-and-miss sprinkled in, too. I'm not a big player there or in the hobby in general, but flipping at COMC in addition to my other hobby ventures makes for a diverse and fun hobby.
I think COMC's rise over the past 10 years, in particular, is a strong point for the health of the hobby (in general). The site's foundation is in buying and selling of lower valued cards and in set builders, and the company has grown tremendously. It's now one of the bigger sellers on eBay and elsewhere, I believe.
And here's a hair-brained theory on the state of the hobby, in general, and recent price increases...
Access to the hobby has increased dramatically over the past 10-20 years. eBay is now readily available on most everyone's phone, major auction houses offer numerous auctions every year and people can participate from anywhere in the world, and collectors have the ability to purchase and learn about the hobby at a level that is unprecedented. So, in terms of the demand side, it is easier than ever for a seller to access a greater population of the people who want a card. With the greater access to the demand side, prices have gone up - but perhaps this isn't a bubble for prices, perhaps this is actually more of an accurate representation of true price when it comes to supply and demand.
In this way, despite some high profile scams recently (forged T206s, trimmed cards in high-graded slabs, shilling, etc.), perhaps the state of the hobby is actually as healthy as ever.

This is a great point. With access to ebay from a smart phone, the demand side has probably increased over the years.

You know what happens when demand exceeds supply...

[conor912]

Originally Posted by NYYFan63

This is a great point. With access to ebay from a smart phone, the demand side has probably increased over the years.

You know what happens when demand exceeds supply...

This is a great point. Never underestimate the power of the uneducated impulse buy.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by conor912

This is a great point. Never underestimate the power of the uneducated impulse buy.

Can there be an educated impulse buy? I think I have made a few of those.

Yes, hobby appears strong in a lot of places.

.

[Goudey77]

I agree, someone stated fear of missing out. Sometimes you gotta make your best educated guess and buy with that uncertainty which is usually an impulsive reaction. Only speaking for myself

Originally Posted by Leon

Can there be an educated impulse buy? I think I have made a few of those.

Yes, hobby appears strong in a lot of places.

.

[irv]

Originally Posted by Dpeck100

This is an excellent point. I am in financial services and many advisors had been telling clients wait for the pullback to deploy cash and when the violent move lower took place they sat on their hands or the clients said lets wait and see what happens.

The other big issue with stocks is the daily volatility can shake you out very easily. With cards at least there is a longer selling cycle generally so in my view they are easier to hold and this is one of the appeals from an investment standpoint.

The hobby is very healthy. When it takes as long as it does to get your cards back from third party graders it isn't because they don't want to get them back to you quickly it is because there are so many being sent in.

I was just having a brief discussion last night with a neighbor about the rate of return that can be achieved in cards and it is astonishing. You don't have to have a lot of money to at least see a positive return on the funds you spend and you get the benefit of owning the hard asset. Buying a card for $20 and selling it for $50 isn't going to change anyone's life but find me another area where the investment minimums are so low and the percentage returns can be so outsized. I don't know of one.

I also, like Octavio, agree with Dpeck's post above.

Although, obviously, not conclusive, I have noticed card shops/sellers popping up more locally now as well. In my big metropolis, there has mostly just been one which focused mainly on hockey cards but just recently another one opened up as well. Also, while searching the Bay, I have also encountered a few local sellers that I have never noticed before.

[Leon]

There are a few new ones in DFW too. The one I went into not long ago didn't have any vintage though. I think I might have seen a few 70s Topps but otherwise I didn't really know what anything was.

Originally Posted by irv

I also, like Octavio, agree with Dpeck's post above.

Although, obviously, not conclusive, I have noticed card shops/sellers popping up more locally now as well. In my big metropolis, there has mostly just been one which focused mainly on hockey cards but just recently another one opened up as well. Also, while searching the Bay, I have also encountered a few local sellers that I have never noticed before.