OT: Will the NL adopt the DH soon?

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

DH takes away strategy but adds offense, and I think fans enjoy high scoring games. Also, it's time for both leagues to play with the same rules. Although controversial, maybe not a bad idea to employ it.

Imagine if you will an NFL where in the NFC only a single extra point was permitted, while in the AFC the two point conversion was allowed.

In games between teams from each conferencre, the rule applicable for the home team would be used for that game.

In the Super Bowl the rules for the team that won the coin flip would be used in the first and fourth quarters and the other rules would be used in the second and third quarter.

Think about it. Is there anyone in their right mind, if such a scheme was adopted, who would not think it was created and approved by an idiot, or a rules committee populated by a majority of idiots.

The whole DH thing hasn’t made sense for forty odd years since it was instituted. If you raise your son to become an AL pitcher, you don’t allow him to touch a bat. He can then skip tee ball and get his first Tommy John operation before Little League. Fine.

NL pitchers will be culled from Little League shortstops who are clearly the best all around players on their team, whose talent in the batter’s box is gradually lost in college and the minor leagues where DHing is king.

Personally I would eliminate the DH from the AL, but adopting the DH in the NL is far better than the current system, I will concede.

Half the NBA shouldn’t have to play on an ice rink.

Marathon runners shouldn’t have to compete against smart cars at Indy.

How about a cross between golf and whack a mole where the hole is continually moving on the green, or where half the holes are suspended .10 feet off the ground and Tiger Woods Jr. could literally be a chip of the old block.

Disclaimer: This post was written while sober and not in a bowling alley, where the consumption of adult beverages can impact the results of the game. Cheers!

[Jim65]

I'm not in favor of the DH in the the NL but I believe its inevitable. If they want more offense, then ban the damn shifts.

When I saw the new proposals, the only one that made no sense was giving a draft advantage to winning teams over losing teams, how does that help competitive balance?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Maybe baseball can become football -- one team for batting and another for defense. I don't like the DH, and baseball was and is just fine without it.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Maybe baseball can become football -- one team for batting and another for defense. I don't like the DH, and baseball was and is just fine without it.

Great idea Peter

Works in basketball too

You have two seven footers on your team.

Put one under your defensive basket - the shot blocker

And the other under your offensive basket - the dunker

Why should those big boys have to run?

[BearBailey]

This is long over due, I have seen pitcher only start as early as 12u baseball and the next time they bat Would be if they made it to the National League. Dh starts in high school but can be used for any position if your pitcher is such a good hitter just dont use the Dh there is no penalty.

[KCRfan1]

Originally Posted by Jim65

I'm not in favor of the DH in the the NL but I believe its inevitable. If they want more offense, then ban the damn shifts.

When I saw the new proposals, the only one that made no sense was giving a draft advantage to winning teams over losing teams, how does that help competitive balance?

Maybe they should learn to hit to the opposite field instead of bellyaching about it.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

Maybe they should learn to hit to the opposite field instead of bellyaching about it.

+1 billion!

[Bigdaddy]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

Maybe they should learn to hit to the opposite field instead of bellyaching about it.

One word, three letters: E-G-O. Can you see Bryce Harper giving in to the shift and laying a bunt down the third base line instead of trying to punch one through the right side?? I agree with KCR.

And as far as the union goes, I would imagine that the average salary for a DH is higher than that of the last man off the bench who is used to pinch hit. A lot of the DHs are higher paid veterans who can't field a lick, but can still hit the big fly.

Like it or not (and generally I'm against the DH), the NL is the last holdout in the universe that has not embraced the DH. Any change going forward will be the NL letting go and joining all the other baseball leagues in existence. Not the other way around.

ps. One good thing about the DH at younger levels is that it gets one more kid off the bench and on the field in a game. Yes, their PT is limited, but their name is in the lineup.

[packs]

Originally Posted by Bigdaddy

One word, three letters: E-G-O. Can you see Bryce Harper giving in to the shift and laying a bunt down the third base line instead of trying to punch one through the right side?? I agree with KCR.

And as far as the union goes, I would imagine that the average salary for a DH is higher than that of the last man off the bench who is used to pinch hit. A lot of the DHs are higher paid veterans who can't field a lick, but can still hit the big fly.

Like it or not (and generally I'm against the DH), the NL is the last holdout in the universe that has not embraced the DH. Any change going forward will be the NL letting go and joining all the other baseball leagues in existence. Not the other way around.

ps. One good thing about the DH at younger levels is that it gets one more kid off the bench and on the field in a game. Yes, their PT is limited, but their name is in the lineup.

That's assuming a lot. What if the last guy cut is in the bullpen? I don't see the union being in favor of prospective salary over salary that exists. Just seems like they're advocating for someone losing their job. I'm not saying the times don't change, just that it's an unusual thing for the union to support.

[MartyFromCANADA]

The strategy argument is complete BS. 99% of the time, the pinch hitter is a better batter than the pitcher. So if it seems the pitcher is weakening, you pinch hit, and if the pitcher is dominating, he stays in. NO strategy there. And the double-switch, really.

I look at it this way: If a position player is out a few games, clubs send him to the minors to get in a few AB's. If this is the case, all NL starting pitchers should be sent to their minor league clubs to see live pitching on their days off.

The game is too specialized, and watching a pitcher's at bat is one of the worst, and most embarrassing parts of baseball. The only players who truly like this archaic rule are the NL starters themselves. (for easy outs)

LONG LIVE THE DH!

[Tabe]

I'm in favor of most of these rules. Pitch clocks? Yes, please. Reducing pitching changes by having a minimum number of batters faced? Yes, please. One rule for DH, even if it's not the one I want? Yes, please. Draft penalties for teams that intentionally tank and don't spend money? Yes, please.

[vintagewhitesox]

I hope this happens. At least we can all stop pretending to care about the double switch.

[barrysloate]

When the DH first appeared in 1973, the leagues were separate, so while it was odd for each league to have different rules, it at least didn't cause any problems. Now that we have interleague play, the rules are determined by who is the home team. That's ridiculous.

Either have the DH in both leagues, or get rid of it entirely. Doesn't matter to me which one they utimately choose, but having separate rules makes no sense.

And I agree completely about neutralizing the defensive shifts. If a batter keeps hitting into the shift, he is going to see it for the rest of his career. And his production will be greatly diminished. But if he learns to slap the ball the other way and puts together a few 4 for 5 games, watch how quickly they will end. It seems to me that batters who have seen a shift in the past should be taking a little extra batting practice in spring training to learn how to hit to the opposite field.

[nolemmings]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

And I agree completely about neutralizing the defensive shifts. If a batter keeps hitting into the shift, he is going to see it for the rest of his career. And his production will be greatly diminished. But if he learns to slap the ball the other way and puts together a few 4 for 5 games, watch how quickly they will end. It seems to me that batters who have seen a shift in the past should be taking a little extra batting practice in spring training to learn how to hit to the opposite field.

It is embarrassing that almost no one tries to beat the shift. My biggest complaint isn't about delays per se, but the lack of any action. Strikeouts are at an all-time high, and stolen bases are nearly forgotten. Get back to basics, and the game would be fine.

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

It is embarrassing that almost no one tries to beat the shift. My biggest complaint isn't about delays per se, but the lack of any action. Strikeouts are at an all-time high, and stolen bases are nearly forgotten. Get back to basics, and the game would be fine.

Absolutely. How many times have you seen a lefthanded hitter line a ball into right field, which is normally a single, only to see the second basemen who is playing in short rightfield throw him out as if it were an infield groundout. Yet if the batter took a simple check swing and tapped the ball toward leftfield, he could trot to first base with a single. If I can figure that out, why can't the team figure it out?

Every team in every sport spends countless hours trying to come up with counters to their opponents offensive and defensive switches, yet baseball hasn't figured how to counter the defensive shift. And it isn't even complicated. I find the whole thing baffling.

[Bill77]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

When the DH first appeared in 1973, the leagues were separate, so while it was odd for each league to have different rules, it at least didn't cause any problems. Now that we have interleague play, the rules are determined by who is the home team. That's ridiculous.

Either have the DH in both leagues, or get rid of it entirely. Doesn't matter to me which one they utimately choose, but having separate rules makes no sense.

I say keep the DH the way it is and reduce interleague play back down to the All-Star game and the World Series.

[insidethewrapper]

If both leagues continue to play each other throughout the season then one rule needs to be in place. My vote is for the "Home Team" to have the option to decide before each game if the game will be played with or without the DH that day. This would increase and not decrease strategy in the game. The manager would have to review both rosters( strenghts vs rh and lh pitchers) and decide that day based on his pitcher (Rh vs LH) and the opposing pitcher if he wanted to use the DH that day or not. Many factors involved( bench, your injuries vs the oppsing team injuries etc). If playing a team with a great DH and you know he may not play if you decide not to use the DH that day then that would be a great strategy ( maybe making the opposing manager put (Pujols or Cruz ) on the bench etc. Pujols has an injury, then no DH that day and that would eliminate the opposing teams DH that day. Endless factors and possibilies . More strategy not less. Would be a lot of discussion and second guessing. Sounds fun to me.

[silvor]

Well, if we standardize the DH, then why not make all the parks universal?

Seem silly center field is 436 at Minute Maid and only 390 at Fenway.

Why does Oakland Coliseum have all the foul ground and Coors field doesn't.

NFL fields are all the same. Why not MLB then?

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Imagine if you will an NFL where in the NFC only a single extra point was permitted, while in the AFC the two point conversion was allowed.

In games between teams from each conferencre, the rule applicable for the home team would be used for that game.

In the Super Bowl the rules for the team that won the coin flip would be used in the first and fourth quarters and the other rules would be used in the second and third quarter.

Think about it. Is there anyone in their right mind, if such a scheme was adopted, who would not think it was created and approved by an idiot, or a rules committee populated by a majority of idiots.

The whole DH thing hasn’t made sense for forty odd years since it was instituted. If you raise your son to become an AL pitcher, you don’t allow him to touch a bat. He can skip then skip tee ball and get his first Tommy John operation before Little League. Fine.

NL pitchers will be culled from Little League shortstops who are clearly the best all around players on their team, whose talent in the batter’s box is gradually lost in college and the minor leagues where DHing is king.

Personally I would eliminate the DH from the AL, but adopting the DH in the NL is far better than the current system, I will concede.

Half the NBA shouldn’t have to play on an ice rink.

Marathon runners shouldn’t have to compete against smart cars at Indy.

How about a cross between golf and whack a mole where the hole is continually moving on the green, or where half the holes are suspended .10 feet off the ground and Tiger Woods Jr. could literally be a chip of the old block.

Disclaimer: This post was written while sober and not in a bowling alley, where the consumption of adult beverages can impact the results of the game. Cheers!

[RichardSimon]

The only proposed rule change that made sense to me was roster size.
26 man roster makes sense now.
In the past, you had 25 man rosters with 10 pitchers. Managers could pinch hit without fear. A strategy was utilized more so than now. With teams now carrying 12/13 pitchers, the benches are very thin.
And limit the Sept. roster to 28, that would make the absurd rule of 3 batter minimum not necessary. With rosters at 28, they could not load up on relief pitchers.

[Orioles1954]

Why not keep the DH separate in the regular season but universal in all ballparks in the postseason? As for strategy....what is more difficult. Facing a lineup of 9 professional hitters or facing 8 players, an automatic out all because of pinch hitting and double switches?

[SteveWhite]

When I was a kid playing baseball the best athlete was always the pitcher. Then when he didn't pitch he played shortstop. Oh and by the he was almost always the best hitter. Its just like the specialization of all sports. If pitchers hit all the time wouldn't they continue to be good hitters. It doesn't seem to hurt Micheal Lorenzen for the Reds.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by SteveWhite

When I was a kid playing baseball the best athlete was always the pitcher. Then when he didn't pitch he played shortstop. Oh and by the he was almost always the best hitter. Its just like the specialization of all sports. If pitchers hit all the time wouldn't they continue to be good hitters. It doesn't seem to hurt Micheal Lorenzen for the Reds.

This was alluded to in my post. The best player on a little league team, who is also a future major leaguer, plays both shortstop and pitcher usually because he is the best pitcher, the best hitter and the best fielder on the team. With the DH for 10 years before he hits the bigs, his hitting skills are truncated if he is groomed to pitch.

Conclusion, you would see better hitting pitchers in the majors if the DH was eliminated from the ground up.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by RichardSimon

The only proposed rule change that made sense to me was roster size.
26 man roster makes sense now.
In the past, you had 25 man rosters with 10 pitchers. Managers could pinch hit without fear. A strategy was utilized more so than now. With teams now carrying 12/13 pitchers, the benches are very thin.
And limit the Sept. roster to 28, that would make the absurd rule of 3 batter minimum not necessary. With rosters at 28, they could not load up on relief pitchers.

25 to 26 seems inconsequential to me. Let’s make it 25 to 46. With an additional 20 arms in the bullpen, more specialization based on analytics would be possible, as well as more commercial breaks for pitching changes.

Warren Whiffle could pitch only in the eighth inning with one out and two runners on base to a right handed 32 year old pitch hitter with a batting average between .276 and .282 with a tendency to swing at sliders off the plate 3 inches above his patella. In fact Warren has never pitched successfully to any batter who did not have this profile, believe or not.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by silvor

Well, if we standardize the DH, then why not make all the parks universal?

Seem silly center field is 436 at Minute Maid and only 390 at Fenway.

Why does Oakland Coliseum have all the foul ground and Coors field doesn't.

NFL fields are all the same. Why not MLB then?

Just a bit off center is the deep part of Fenway at 420


They sort of tried building "standard" stadiums in the 70's, and it was dull dull dull.

[silvor]

Originally Posted by steve B

Just a bit off center is the deep part of Fenway at 420


They sort of tried building "standard" stadiums in the 70's, and it was dull dull dull.

Agreed. Just when people talk about standardizing the rules, shouldn't the dimensions be the same? What if one NFL field was 105 yards and another was 85? The quirkiness of the dimensions, DH rule etc is one of the great things about baseball.

FWIW, I like most of the other rule changes.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Imagine if you will an NFL where in the NFC only a single extra point was permitted, while in the AFC the two point conversion was allowed.

In games between teams from each conferencre, the rule applicable for the home team would be used for that game.

In the Super Bowl the rules for the team that won the coin flip would be used in the first and fourth quarters and the other rules would be used in the second and third quarter.

Think about it. Is there anyone in their right mind, if such a scheme was adopted, who would not think it was created and approved by an idiot, or a rules committee populated by a majority of idiots.

The whole DH thing hasn’t made sense for forty odd years since it was instituted. If you raise your son to become an AL pitcher, you don’t allow him to touch a bat. He can skip then skip tee ball and get his first Tommy John operation before Little League. Fine.

NL pitchers will be culled from Little League shortstops who are clearly the best all around players on their team, whose talent in the batter’s box is gradually lost in college and the minor leagues where DHing is king.

Personally I would eliminate the DH from the AL, but adopting the DH in the NL is far better than the current system, I will concede.

Half the NBA shouldn’t have to play on an ice rink.

Marathon runners shouldn’t have to compete against smart cars at Indy.

How about a cross between golf and whack a mole where the hole is continually moving on the green, or where half the holes are suspended .10 feet off the ground and Tiger Woods Jr. could literally be a chip of the old block.

Disclaimer: This post was written while sober and not in a bowling alley, where the consumption of adult beverages can impact the results of the game. Cheers!

Frank- I'd pay to see Lebron slam in the crease & Usane Bolt blowing past that 43rd car, but the convergence of Golf and Whack-a-Mole may be your greatest invention to date. Tiger's caddy would have to be...wait for it...Bill Murray.


=

[steve B]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Half the NBA shouldn’t have to play on an ice rink.

How about a cross between golf and whack a mole where the hole is continually moving on the green, or where half the holes are suspended .10 feet off the ground and Tiger Woods Jr. could literally be a chip of the old block.

Both of those have some real potential. Basketball on ice especially.
Or maybe Maxi-golf where you drive through an actual windmill.

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Disclaimer: This post was written while sober and not in a bowling alley, where the consumption of adult beverages can impact the results of the game. Cheers!

The senior class picnic/outing in college we had a softball tournament. I was on a team with a bunch of other people nobody cool wanted on their team. 3 inning games. First game I had a perfect game! Second game they put in a rule that the pitcher had to have a beer on the mound at all times, and had to drink after each batter. We won the second game! Third game the pitching control was just gone along with any ability to win. Still had a great time


I like both the DH, and seeing pitchers hit. Especially when the get a hit and seem totally lost on the basepaths.