PWCC green cobb psa 5.5 going through the roof

[Beastmode]

Originally Posted by kickitup

Here I am, the "real possible buyer".... If you actually have some "high grade, nicely centered cards", feel free to contact me with scans and prices and I will evaluate the opportunity. If not, please refrain from attempting to act like blowhard on some online forum.

I won these auctions because I wanted them more than anyone else. I don't shill, I buy cards at prices that I feel are appropriate, whether you do or not. I have collected for years and purchased cards from multiple sources including ebay, Memory Lane, Heritage, Greg Bussineau. I have bid at Mile High and SCP as well.

If any of you have a problem with the way I bid or who I choose to bid with, too bad. I deal with people I trust and Brent/PWCC Auctions is one of them.

My email is jcornett@liquidity-partners.com.

** BTW, the reason my account has bid retractions was over a heavy disagreement with a seller I was bidding with. My confidence in their service was affected so I canceled my bids with them to protect myself. The seller later apologized, and I later won all the cards that I bid on in which the bids were retracted.

Hello Justin. Well, nobody's called you out yet so I'll be the first. 18 bid retractions in 6 months? So your saying all with one seller? and none with PWCC?

An issue that has been raised in this thread is bidding at the top end of an auction to find the underbidders max bid; then retracting to expose the underbidder as the winner. -***o ebay username has been exposed as someone doing this multiple times, but NOT on PWCC auctions (just to be clear). I'm assuming this is not the type of retraction you have?

I also do a majority of my bidding with PWCC, and Brent is aware of my disgust with retractors. I'm confident he has a sound policy to address these issues with e-bay's support.

[kickitup]

Originally Posted by Beastmode

Hello Justin. Well, nobody's called you out yet so I'll be the first. 18 bid retractions in 6 months? So your saying all with one seller? and none with PWCC?

An issue that has been raised in this thread is bidding at the top end of an auction to find the underbidders max bid; then retracting to expose the underbidder as the winner. -***o ebay username has been exposed as someone doing this multiple times, but NOT on PWCC auctions (just to be clear). I'm assuming this is not the type of retraction you have?

I also do a majority of my bidding with PWCC, and Brent is aware of my disgust with retractors. I'm confident he has a sound policy to address these issues with e-bay's support.

I had one retraction with the PSA 8 53 mantle at Pwcc a few months ago where I made a mistake and retracted the bid. I then came in and rebid correctly like an appropriate person should do.

The other retractions were with two sellers specifically, one had 15 and one had 2. The one where I retracted 15 bids I ended up winning all the auctions on some 86 fleer psa10s. The user for the other two retractions were because I bid on the items and didn't pay attention to who the seller was. The seller had screwed me over on a deal and I refuse to do business with him.

I can definitely see the benefit in retractions to discover max bids, but it does not at all preclude you from losing to someone using a snipping service.

There are actually some honest people out there that retract for reasons other than intentional manipulation. Whether it be inexperience or ignorance, it needs to be policed and watched, but if you guys don't want someone to see your max bid, don't put one in. Wait till the end and use your snipping services. Don't try to blame retractors, look in the mirror and blame yourself.

Have a great evening.

[kickitup]

Lastly, if the prices I paid were so crazy high for everything, why haven't multiple high quality home run baker t206 cards showed up on eBay ? Why haven't any more high quality PSA green Cobb's surfaced yet as available? Why haven't all those folks with the top notch PSA 8 mantles put them up for auction if these prices really are crazy??

I can tell you why... Because people don't want to sell. Until they do, prices will keep going up... It amazes me that people don't understand that, but that's fine by me because I get to enjoy these cards and make money at the same time while some folks that like to complain and conspire on message boards will be left with nothing but their incorrect assumptions about guys like me.

Welcome to America !

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by kickitup

Lastly, if the prices I paid were so crazy high for everything, why haven't multiple high quality home run baker t206 cards showed up on eBay ? Why haven't any more high quality PSA green Cobb's surfaced yet as available? Why haven't all those folks with the top notch PSA 8 mantles put them up for auction if these prices really are crazy??

I can tell you why... Because people don't want to sell. Until they do, prices will keep going up... It amazes me that people don't understand that, but that's fine by me because I get to enjoy these cards and make money at the same time while some folks that like to complain and conspire on message boards will be left with nothing but their incorrect assumptions about guys like me.

Welcome to America !

+1. Q. David Bowers used to say in his excellent coin books that "the collector is king," but I'm not sure if he realized the actual nuts and bolts of the "why." The collector is indeed king when it comes to very scarce or rare desirable items, because while value = demand over supply mathematically, the "supply" factor that is relevant is not the number of examples in existence, but instead those that are available. If we start, for example, with 1,000 people going after 50 rare, desirable cards, then the ratio of demand to supply is 20 to one, equating to a certain value. Then let's say that a couple of years down the road, 40 of those collectors attain their cards, tucking them away into their own private collections where they will remain for decades (in the coin hobby, they refer to this as being "in strong hands"). That leaves 960 collectors seeking just the 10 examples that are still available, leaving the demand to supply ratio at 96 to one. Nine more are sold,and held by collectors who are not buying to flip the card, but because they like it and want to keep it, leaving merely one example still available for sale. Our ratio of demand to supply has now risen to 951 to one--anyone think that the price has remained within a country mile of what it was when our ratio was 20 to one?

In reality, the situation is a bit more dynamic--as a substantial portion of the available supply is absorbed by true collectors, and prices begin to dramatically rise, the situation attracts additional attention and demand, causing the demand end of the equation to rise even further. Supply too rises, however, as the rising prices leverage some of those previously sold out of what were intended to be permanent collections--the price has simply gotten too high for some to resist the impulse to cash in. The internet, as well as the number of quality auctions, has accelerated the pace at which the above phenomenon has occurred for the simple reason that you used to either have to attend many, many quality shows or get lucky with an SCD ad in the '90's to find that rare, desirable "unicorn" of a card you'd been seeking for many years. Now, with communications enhanced between buyers and sellers, even the rarest will come to your attention far, far sooner.

Econ 101 in a dynamic nutshell!

Hope you all find your unicorns--I'm putting mine together before too many "big boys" come looking for them!

Larry

[Touch'EmAll]

If everything is legit, this was a great milestone for our hobby. This price appreciation is what we all hope for. And a lesson learned as well - acquire good stuff, the best we can afford. I can't wait for someone to put up a 5.0 T206 green Cobb (well centered) with asking price in the $7-10k neighborhood and see if someone bites. Then we will know more. And will this sale bring up prices on slightly lesser demand cards as well?

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by 100backstroke

If everything is legit, this was a great milestone for our hobby. This price appreciation is what we all hope for. And a lesson learned as well - acquire good stuff, the best we can afford. I can't wait for someone to put up a 5.0 T206 green Cobb (well centered) with asking price in the $7-10k neighborhood and see if someone bites. Then we will know more. And will this sale bring up prices on slightly lesser demand cards as well?

BINs are not the same as auction.....would be interesting to see what happens in an auction.. psa 4 is for sale here on net54

[Iron Horse]

There is a PSA 4 strong on centering and eye appeal but a very weak 4 based on corners at Goldin auctions at $5400 currently.

[PolarBear]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

psa 4 is for sale here on net54

12 more days and I'll win it for $1500.

[Beastmode]

"I have friends, not hobby friends but friends in general, who could (probably justifiably) be accused of lots of things.."

Forgive me Kenny, but this is the best line in this entire thread. Feels like a statement Steve Martin would of made in "The Jerk".

[1952boyntoncollector]

I started this thread last year when I thought there was going to be an uptick on Green Cobbs and i had sold a few of them. Then came the PWCC aucttion last year.

The Green Cobb that blew the roof and opened the green cobb craze that was subject to this thread that sold for 15k with pwcc, is now at 15k with HA BEFORE buyers premium.

Guess PWCC is not crazy with prices afterall. There was lots of talk about shilling with PWCC on this card. One more bid and the consignor starts to make serious dough assuming the card didnt change hands since pwcc last year...

http://www.pwccauctions.com/item.php?item_no=1180713


http://sports.ha.com/itm/baseball/19...umbnail-071515

[ullmandds]

the cobb ex+? it's a gorgeous card!!!!!

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

I started this thread last year when I thought there was going to be an uptick on Green Cobbs and i had sold a few of them. Then came the PWCC aucttion last year.

The Green Cobb that blew the roof and opened the green cobb craze that was subject to this thread that sold for 15k with pwcc, is now at 15k with HA BEFORE buyers premium.

Guess PWCC is not crazy with prices afterall. There was lots of talk about shilling with PWCC on this card. One more bid and the consignor starts to make serious dough assuming the card didnt change hands since pwcc last year...

http://www.pwccauctions.com/item.php?item_no=1180713


http://sports.ha.com/itm/baseball/19...umbnail-071515

guess the green cobb craze continues! Funny stuff in this thread as well..

[HRBAKER]

Or blame ebay for creating (and continuing to refine) a playground for the ill-intentioned.
Please note: this is a general observation.

[bcornell]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

Or blame ebay for creating (and continuing to refine) a playground for the ill-intentioned.
Please note: this is a general observation.

I have two very thoughtful comments for you. First, eBay (actually, a segment of its horde of MBA know-it-alls) could not and still cannot understand the difference between commodities and collectables, so they push(ed) sellers to use the fixed price format and destroyed auctions. It was one of those "business decisions" that was really smart, unless you actually could care about the difference. Idiots.

However, eBay isn't to blame for the scumbagginess of buyers and sellers who use it to try to exploit others. It's *only* a platform; who the hell wants to police the nonsense that goes on there?

Bill

[HRBAKER]

Very thoughtful Bill.

As was ebay's obfuscation of bidder id's and the like.

It's a virtual harmonic convergence.

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

Very thoughtful Bill.

As was ebay's obfuscation of bidder id's and the like.

Don't forget...the ability for sellers to leave negative feedback. In my opinion, if you don't pay for a card, and a seller has to perform a NPB claim against you, that should warrant an AUTOMATIC negative.

[swarmee]

But they've rebranded auction wins as "Orders"; heck, you can cancel an order, right? Argh. And now they let sellers unilaterally cancel bids as well. eBay is making many bad decisions. That's why I stopped listing cards there and took all of mine to a competitor.

[bcornell]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Don't forget...the ability for sellers to leave negative feedback. In my opinion, if you don't pay for a card, and a seller has to perform a NPB claim against you, that should warrant an AUTOMATIC negative.

I worked at eBay at the time that this new policy went in place. It had taken much too long, but people had finally realized that Amazon was just destroying them. And Amazon never allowed sellers to leave feedback for buyers, nor did any other marketplace. eBay did a ton of things wrong, but this wasn't one of them. I say that even though I loved seller feedback, but too many bad sellers used it as extortion.

For old-timers, remember Roy Huff (libertyforall)?

Bill

[swarmee]

"sniping" services with one p. Snipping is not a service I'm interested in.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by swarmee

"sniping" services with one p. Snipping is not a service I'm interested in.

I am a snipped Jewish person who uses a sniping service.

As for the bid retractions, I find them to be a huge problem, generally speaking. I doubt very many of the large bid retractors will come on and explain themselves the way Justin (hi Justin) has. And I almost guarantee their stories won't hold water the way his did.