Please sign Mr Jeter - NY Times article about collecting Jeter in Fla

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by packs

It's not hard to make your autograph not worth selling. Sign for everyone.

+1

Anyone seen the value of a Bob Feller graph these days? The guy is a deceased HOFer and statistically was arguably one of the Top 10 pitchers of all-time, and his auto is in the "common bins" because the man simply signed everything in sight.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by Jim F

Would Babe Ruth or Dempsey have signed as much if they knew there was a huge market for their autograph? Would they have signed as much if there was ebay? How about if they had a memorabilia deal? Would they have signed as much if they kept seeing the same faces asking for autographs day after day? Times change, people change. Doesn't mean he's a jerk.

This is also a great point. There are a ton of athletes who turn people down for autos. Eventually most guys sign but people are people and they will have different ways about them. Because he rolls by and doesn't speak to the fans doesn't make Jeter a jerk. It means he doesn't feel like signing that day.

Also to be fair, the article tells of the security guy being the one barking out orders about not speaking to Jeter, etc. Now, I'm not saying with certainty that this wasn't the exact message Jeter relayed to the guy, because we will never know what conversation was had. But I will say that I have seen my fair share of security guards getting their kicks off of their 15-minutes of fame and being overly rude to collectors just because they can. The times I've seen Jeter interact with fans, which admittedly has not been in about ten years, he was fairly personable. Quiet overall, but definitely not rude.

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by dgo71

Because he rolls by and doesn't speak to the fans doesn't make Jeter a jerk.

Uhhh... yes, it does.

[mschwade]

Originally Posted by drc

Jeter should compromise and hand out 15% off coupons for his signed ball at the Steiner website.

I know you are trying to be funny, but it reminds me of a story. I grew up in Dublin, Ohio, home of Wendy's. My brother worked at a up-scale car wash and when Dave Thomas brought his car through, guys were not tipped. They received a coupon for 50 cents off a Single

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

Uhhh... yes, it does.

yep,

joe louis didnt have a inconsiderate bone in his body for his fans. he would talk, sign, he was gracious, he got asked ALL the time for 40 years. he wouldn't pull this "i am better than you" routine. There were probably days he didn't feel like signing and maybe didn't sign, but he didn't act like he was better than the "unwashed" masses.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

Uhhh... yes, it does.

Uhhh...no, it doesn't. Have you seen Jeter, through the entirety of his career, every single time he's been asked for an autograph? Even if you somehow had, you would have only that one aspect of his persona to judge him by.

Do you stop and give change to every guy on the corner with a sign? If not, does that make you a jerk? How about if you do 99% of the time, but the one time you didn't I happened to see it and wrote an article about it? Are you a jerk then?

I get that it doesn't take much to sign a graph, and you can compare him to Ruth or Joe Louis or whatever athlete you want from 60-70 years before Jeter played...but the fact is whether he signs autographs every day or never signs a single one, I don't think that fact alone is enough to speak to his character. Athletes are not obligated to sign autographs for anyone.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by travrosty

yep,

joe louis didnt have a inconsiderate bone in his body for his fans. he would talk, sign, he was gracious, he got asked ALL the time for 40 years. he wouldn't pull this "i am better than you" routine. There were probably days he didn't feel like signing and maybe didn't sign, but he didn't act like he was better than the "unwashed" masses.

Did you hear Jeter say "I'm better than you?" Or is that just the extent of your hyperbole after you read the quotes of a security guard, written from the angle of a journalist who is out to get his article noticed? I'm willing to bet you've not had enough encounters with Jeter to put words in his mouth.

One thing you guys fail to realize is that a large portion of autograph hounds can be extremely rude, pushy and downright nasty to deal with. They invade the athletes' private lives and stalk them just to get a signature, yet these same people won't pay for a GA ticket to try and get the same guy at a ballgame. Interrupting them at dinner, following them through the streets, calling hotels to find where they're staying...it's insane. I don't care how nice an athlete is, that crap would get old. The dealers are even worse, especially in New York where Jeter has played half his games over 20 years. The dealers do all those things AND will push and shove because if they don't get a graph that day, they can't pay their bills. Then when a guy doesn't sign, they yell at the athete or curse them out. Yeah, that really makes a guy want to sign in the future. The Babe Ruth comparison is really apples and oranges because autograph collectors in Babe Ruth's day weren't pushing kids out of the way to get 20 of the same 11x14 signed. So if after dealing with all this and much more over the course of his career, if Jeter wants to roll by the line of autograph seekers and wave, I think he's earned that right. And it's not even like he NEVER signs. The one guy in the article got him 30 times!

[BigJJ]

Originally Posted by byrone

Personalize the autographs, that will sort out the fans from the re-sellers.

Agreed

This is what DiMaggio did, sometimes, in lieu of not signing.

The only problem is, from certain players' perspectives, this requires a conversation, albeit short, with each and every person seeking an autograph.

And what if the guy says, "no need to personalize". Then the player may have to speak even more. And what does he say: "my contract requires I sign only personalized items", this makes the player sound like he is not in charge of himself.

But I do think you try and keep your market high: personalize as much as you can, limit one auto per person, and ignore the guys whose faces you recognize.

But players ought to be signing, legibly, like Ruth, Mantle, and even DiMaggio (he did sign legibly and for kids) for each and every kid under 18 who asks. Every time.

And I agree that most of us might not want a quick signature, except or resale. For our collections would want a nice, bold, clear example.

[BigJJ]

Originally Posted by dgo71

+1

Anyone seen the value of a Bob Feller graph these days? The guy is a deceased HOFer and statistically was arguably one of the Top 10 pitchers of all-time, and his auto is in the "common bins" because the man simply signed everything in sight.

Perfect example. If not for supply, Feller might be as costly as Ted Williams, etc.

Koufax is also an interesting case study, like Ted Williams, but even to a greater degree, Koufax will not sign, as a business venture, unless real money is put forward. But if you see Koufax in person, especially kids, he goes out of his way to sign and accommodate. Williams and Koufax kept their markets high, not by refusing fans, but by refusing lower paying signings and appearances.

[jimjim]

Originally Posted by BigJJ

Perfect example. If not for supply, Feller might be as costly as Ted Williams, etc.

Koufax is also an interesting case study, like Ted Williams, but even to a greater degree, Koufax will not sign, as a business venture, unless real money is put forward. But if you see Koufax in person, especially kids, he goes out of his way to sign and accommodate. Williams and Koufax kept their markets high, not by refusing fans, but by refusing lower paying signings and appearances.

Very true. I have had the opportunity to see Mr. Koufax twice over the past 5 years, and each time he was extremely accommodating. To the point I was shaking my head that Sandy Koufax was taking his time to sign autographs for a bunch of collectors and dealers. And then we get the drive by or wave from some bench warmer.

[jimjim]

Originally Posted by dgo71

Did you hear Jeter say "I'm better than you?" Or is that just the extent of your hyperbole after you read the quotes of a security guard, written from the angle of a journalist who is out to get his article noticed? I'm willing to bet you've not had enough encounters with Jeter to put words in his mouth.

One thing you guys fail to realize is that a large portion of autograph hounds can be extremely rude, pushy and downright nasty to deal with. They invade the athletes' private lives and stalk them just to get a signature, yet these same people won't pay for a GA ticket to try and get the same guy at a ballgame. Interrupting them at dinner, following them through the streets, calling hotels to find where they're staying...it's insane. I don't care how nice an athlete is, that crap would get old. The dealers are even worse, especially in New York where Jeter has played half his games over 20 years. The dealers do all those things AND will push and shove because if they don't get a graph that day, they can't pay their bills. Then when a guy doesn't sign, they yell at the athete or curse them out. Yeah, that really makes a guy want to sign in the future. The Babe Ruth comparison is really apples and oranges because autograph collectors in Babe Ruth's day weren't pushing kids out of the way to get 20 of the same 11x14 signed. So if after dealing with all this and much more over the course of his career, if Jeter wants to roll by the line of autograph seekers and wave, I think he's earned that right. And it's not even like he NEVER signs. The one guy in the article got him 30 times!

+1

I used to live in Philly, and I would go to the stadiums and wait outside once in a while when I had some time on my hands. Those dealers were brutal. And then I decided to try the hotel once or twice. They were even worse there. Dealers from NYC would come down and literally act like animals. Never seen anything like it before. And the autographs the players gave out were just c**p. I remember going for Wayne Gretzky at the hotel when he was coach for the Coyotes. I was hanging inside the hotel just to relax, and saw him chilling in a chair. I decided to not bug him and wait for him to run the line outside, as I was very confident he would stop (bad decision). He comes outside, I run out and get in line, and he does stop and sign but it was a madhouse, and the autographs he gave out were horrible. I don't even have that photo framed, it is that bad. Not sure how the dealers can even sell that stuff. Plus he was calling out the double dippers, and they were denying and arguing with him. I decided then and there that it wasn't worth it, and I was completely embarrassed to be associated with that dealer scum. Haven't gone back to a hotel since. Plus I moved down South and things are much more civilized here. Of course there are plenty of dealers, but at least they have manners!

[BigJJ]

Based on the article, Jeter signs one autograph for about the first 10 people on line, and for any kids.
If he were to stop each day, might be a good amount of signing.
And maybe Jeter is a bigger signer during spring training.

Strikes me as not the best time to ask anyone for anything, coming out of a rehabilitation session. if I just had rehabilitation, or for that matter a cavity filled, I might not be in the mood to interact. I could see the line outside of my dentists office for me now

It's a Yankee training facility, with workout equipment, weights, etc. so I suppose it is fair game, but it is still the off season, not spring training, and rehabilitation.

I vote Jeter passes the test here, not by wide margins, but passes.

[EvilKing00]

Originally Posted by HOF Auto Rookies

How is he overrated? One of the greatest Yankees ever, let alone a model of consistency on the field as well.

looking at his numbers:

Jeter - 255 HR - 313 batting average - 348 SB - 1254 rbi - Good player -
very good player. Not a middle of the order guy, also not a lead off guy and very good #2 hitter.

you know who has almost the same exact numbers with half the at bats - Nomar Garciaparra - 229 HR, 313 average - 936 rbi (about half the at bats)

or even Clemente - 317 / 240hr

larry walker - 313 / 383hr

edger martinez - 312 / 309 hr

tod helton was a way better hitter, 320 -354

Magglio Ordonez - 309 / 294 hr

tim ranes - had a 295 average, 170 RH and over 800 SB

you cant compare him to guys like this - Mantle, Joe D, Berra, Ruth, Mattingly, winfield, maris, gehrig, Rickey Henderson

Yes a 313 average is very good, 3000 hits... yea sure thats good too, but hes played 18 seasons, hes a "singles" hitter usually with a few of the best power hitters in the game hitting behind him ALL his life. I dont remember a time when he was even the best SS in the game let alone the best player.





there are tons of very good players with a 310-315 average with 250-300 hr,

[BigJJ]

Jeter comes through in the clutch too, particularly at post season time.
Both offense and defense. Hard to measure in statistics.
5 Championships

And you have left off career hits. Jeter has hit .313 over a long period of time

And 5 Gold Gloves

Lets hope he stays in the game many more years and dislodges Rose.
I understand this may be very wishful thinking but Rose played until he was 45.

[EvilKing00]

Originally Posted by BigJJ

Jeter comes through in the clutch too, particularly at post season time.
Both offense and defense. Hard to measure in statistics.

And you have left off career hits. Jeter has hit .313 over a long period of time

And 5 Gold Gloves

Lets hope he stays in the game many more years and dislodges Rose.
I understand this may be very wishful thinking

i did mention his 3000 hits and the 18 seasons hes played so far too.

As for his 5 gold gloves.....5 dosnt cut it

Keith Hernandez 11
Don Mattingly 9
Ryne Sandberg 9
Robin Ventura had 6
Mike Schmidt 10
Ozzie Smith 13
Luis Aparicio 9
Omar Vizquel 9

Id compare him to a yount / molitor player. Nothing wrong with that as they are both very good players, but far from what some people think of him

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by dgo71

Did you hear Jeter say "I'm better than you?" Or is that just the extent of your hyperbole after you read the quotes of a security guard, written from the angle of a journalist who is out to get his article noticed? I'm willing to bet you've not had enough encounters with Jeter to put words in his mouth.

One thing you guys fail to realize is that a large portion of autograph hounds can be extremely rude, pushy and downright nasty to deal with. They invade the athletes' private lives and stalk them just to get a signature, yet these same people won't pay for a GA ticket to try and get the same guy at a ballgame. Interrupting them at dinner, following them through the streets, calling hotels to find where they're staying...it's insane. I don't care how nice an athlete is, that crap would get old. The dealers are even worse, especially in New York where Jeter has played half his games over 20 years. The dealers do all those things AND will push and shove because if they don't get a graph that day, they can't pay their bills. Then when a guy doesn't sign, they yell at the athete or curse them out. Yeah, that really makes a guy want to sign in the future. The Babe Ruth comparison is really apples and oranges because autograph collectors in Babe Ruth's day weren't pushing kids out of the way to get 20 of the same 11x14 signed. So if after dealing with all this and much more over the course of his career, if Jeter wants to roll by the line of autograph seekers and wave, I think he's earned that right. And it's not even like he NEVER signs. The one guy in the article got him 30 times!

he didnt have to say it with his mouth, he says it with his actions. all he has to do is not sign for the professionals with stacks of photos. sign one each for everybody else. if he sees the same people day after day, don't sign for those people. not hard to do. his handler said it all. if jeter was the white knight in shining armor, and word got back to him that his handler treated people like that, i expect jeter to rip into that guy real good for abusing his fans. we all know that isn't going to happen. Jack Dempsey would hang out at Jack Dempsey's restaurant and mingle with the people, his fans who would come for a chance to see him, sign autographs, and have a good old time. He did it for many, many years. What's wrong with Jeter?

If it gets old, why doesn't it get old for Muhammad Ali? He got mobbed as much any anybody. He talked to the fans, signed autographs forever, didn't try to run away from people, he would get up early nearly every day at his home in Michigan, and sign hundreds of those pamphlets, hundreds of them each day, to take around with him and hand out to fans who asked him for his autograph, he didn't have to do it, he wanted to.

Or how about Brooks Robinson? He has a long line at a show, and he holds up the line himself to talk to each and every person, pose for pictures, shake hands, talk to the kids, and makes sure everyone is satisfied. What's wrong with Jeter?

You can't lump these famous athlete's together and say they have a right to act like a jerk. Because people keep hearing the same names on the jerk side over and over again, Barry Bonds, Willie Mays, Frank Robinson, Jeter.

And they hear the same names on the nice as heck side, Muhammad Ali, Brooks Robinson, the late Harmon Killebrew and Kirby Puckett, Bert Blyleven, a bunch of other guys. So some appreciate the fans, some don't, why carry water for Jeter when all it would take is a little effort on his part?

No one got hounded day and night more than Michael Jackson, and people don't remember him as a jerk about signing autographs. Although it was difficult to get near him, when people did, he would sign a lot, and be polite, and be gracious. He got mobbed 100 times more than Jeter, but he liked his fans.

[chaddurbin]

i would agree jeter is a little overrated because he plays in new york, but he's still a credible hof'er and one of the best ss ever. you can't compare his stat at a premium defensive position to guys who play 1b or corner of spots where offensive production can easily be replaced or replicated.

as for the argument in this thread just like the tom brady charges $600/sig people sees things differently and i'm not gonna sweat it anymore.

Originally Posted by EvilKing00

looking at his numbers:

Jeter - 255 HR - 313 batting average - 348 SB - 1254 rbi - Good player -
very good player. Not a middle of the order guy, also not a lead off guy and very good #2 hitter.

you know who has almost the same exact numbers with half the at bats - Nomar Garciaparra - 229 HR, 313 average - 936 rbi (about half the at bats)

or even Clemente - 317 / 240hr

larry walker - 313 / 383hr

edger martinez - 312 / 309 hr

tod helton was a way better hitter, 320 -354

Magglio Ordonez - 309 / 294 hr

tim ranes - had a 295 average, 170 RH and over 800 SB

you cant compare him to guys like this - Mantle, Joe D, Berra, Ruth, Mattingly, winfield, maris, gehrig, Rickey Henderson

Yes a 313 average is very good, 3000 hits... yea sure thats good too, but hes played 18 seasons, hes a "singles" hitter usually with a few of the best power hitters in the game hitting behind him ALL his life. I dont remember a time when he was even the best SS in the game let alone the best player.





there are tons of very good players with a 310-315 average with 250-300 hr,

[esd10]

i meet jeter in the mid 90's when he was playing for the columbus clippers and it was at a big bear grocery store of all places and got his auto but didnt really know who he was until later. he was very nice to everyone who he signed autos for and man has his fame gone to his head and what a a#$hole now.

[cubsfan-budman]

I try to be pretty pragmatic about these things (imho), but I think more than many players out there, Jeter owes his livelihood to his fans. He's a first-ballot HOFer, far more for his fame than for his stats.

I honestly don't expect any athlete to spend the time that guys like Bobby Doerr must spend signing each day...but I do think that if he took a long, hard look at his station in life, he would realize that signing an auto for each of the people that got up at 3am just to interact with him for 10 seconds was a very small price.

[Deertick]

Originally Posted by jimjim

+1

I used to live in Philly, and I would go to the stadiums and wait outside once in a while when I had some time on my hands. Those dealers were brutal. And then I decided to try the hotel once or twice. They were even worse there. Dealers from NYC would come down and literally act like animals. Never seen anything like it before. And the autographs the players gave out were just c**p. I remember going for Wayne Gretzky at the hotel when he was coach for the Coyotes. I was hanging inside the hotel just to relax, and saw him chilling in a chair. I decided to not bug him and wait for him to run the line outside, as I was very confident he would stop (bad decision). He comes outside, I run out and get in line, and he does stop and sign but it was a madhouse, and the autographs he gave out were horrible. I don't even have that photo framed, it is that bad. Not sure how the dealers can even sell that stuff. Plus he was calling out the double dippers, and they were denying and arguing with him. I decided then and there that it wasn't worth it, and I was completely embarrassed to be associated with that dealer scum. Haven't gone back to a hotel since. Plus I moved down South and things are much more civilized here. Of course there are plenty of dealers, but at least they have manners!

+100
Those 'Out-of-towners' would say some of the rudest, nastiest stuff if they didn't get their quota. I mean what is the 'acceptable' allocation of time to sign after a game? 5, 10, 15 minutes. An hour? 20 autographs? 200?

Some have judged a players stance on the time it takes to sign an autograph. Have you ever seen an accomodating player signing all different kinds of material, usually having to take the cap off of any pen (or worse looking to borrow one that works), balancing the item on his palm or thigh? And then being cursed out because he wouldn't sign a dozen balls in a freshly opened box?

As far back as I go, dealers have used little kids as pawns. Most likely those kids in the article had the autograph in their hands for less than a minute. My guess is that there will be a sudden influx of children standing in line.

[mighty bombjack]

Originally Posted by EvilKing00

Id compare him to a yount / molitor player. Nothing wrong with that as they are both very good players, but far from what some people think of him

that's exactly what baseball reference has in his top 5 comparable players.

Biggio
Molitor
Alomar
Yount
Gehringer

All credible Hall of Famers, just like Jeter.

Yankees fans and national media hoist Jeter above those in this list, but if Biggio had been a Yankee and Jeter an Astro, we could very likely see Jeter sitting out of the Hall after his first ballot, too, because he wouldn't have the rings or the constant front page stories that he has now.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by travrosty

This is unbelievable, why would you want an autograph from someone like that? Mr. too cool for school.

he doesnt care about you, so dont ask him about his day. he can go jump in the lake as far as i am concerned. babe ruth was more popular than anyone, and i dont think babe treated people like that. who does he think he is? derek jeter? so what.

turns my stomach that people sign up for that abuse.

agree whole heartily. The guy is an idiot and I wouldn't care to own A THING WITH HIS AUTOGRAPH ON IT. The Jeter ball was the first thing I sold when I started to downsize and I couldn't be happier to rid my collection of that baboon ass.

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by dgo71

Athletes are not obligated to sign autographs for anyone.

If you mean it's not in their contracts, you're right.
But if they don't feel they should treat their fans well, then they are arrogant pricks. (If not jerks.)

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by HOF Auto Rookies

How is he overrated? One of the greatest Yankees ever, let alone a model of consistency on the field as well.

a model of consistency tripping over his own feet, injuring himself in the playoffs after a come back season....Typical pussy baseball player. JETER IS DONE. Enjoy all the over priced signatures yankee fans

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by travrosty

he didnt have to say it with his mouth, he says it with his actions. all he has to do is not sign for the professionals with stacks of photos. sign one each for everybody else. if he sees the same people day after day, don't sign for those people. not hard to do. his handler said it all. if jeter was the white knight in shining armor, and word got back to him that his handler treated people like that, i expect jeter to rip into that guy real good for abusing his fans. we all know that isn't going to happen. Jack Dempsey would hang out at Jack Dempsey's restaurant and mingle with the people, his fans who would come for a chance to see him, sign autographs, and have a good old time. He did it for many, many years. What's wrong with Jeter?

You completely are missing the point. We could go on for pages listing guys who are overly accommodating with their fans. If you're going to compare DJ3K to someone, at least compare him to a contemporary and not someone who was in the limelight 20 years before Jeter was born. It's 2013 my man, the days of hanging out in the bars with Jack Dempsey are gone.

I've seen Jeter 5 or 6 times. Every time I've seen him, he's signed. How many times have you seen him? Have you ever? I'm not saying he's a saint because he was cool the times I saw him, I'm saying perspective is a heck of a thing and unless you've seen a person several times over the years then you don't have the full story.

[EvilKing00]

Funny thing, because im a met fan, sometimes yankee fans say i just dislike jeter cause im a met fan. Let me tell you...Chipper Jones was my all time enemy, as he crushed my team for many years, so much so he named hes kid Shea, ugh.

BUT, not only do i respect him as a 1st ballot HOF, and have many of his rookie cards, but I made sure I was at his last game at shea, to give him a standing ovation.

there are very good players and then there are the elite.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

If you mean it's not in their contracts, you're right.
But if they don't feel they should treat their fans well, then they are arrogant pricks. (If not jerks.)

"Treating their fans well" is a pretty broad umbrella. I think if Jeter decides he's going to sign on Tuesday and not Wednesday through Saturday, he's not necessarily treating his fans poorly. At least he does sign, and I don't think that just because you have MLB Network at home or whatever that you have the right to tell a player how much of their time they need to spend "giving back."

[theshleps]

This is the first spring training I am missing in 12 years. I would spend 3 weeks from a few days before report date up until the games start from 6AM-4PM getting autographs at various AZ parks- usually 2 or 3 different parks a day.
The Jeter story is very similar to Ichiro except the people in line turn into a crazy pushing mob if he stops and the polite ones are shut out.
There are alot of dealers but alot of us are obsessed collectors. I would coolect every different card of a player so if say a Corey Hart came buy I might have a binder with 6 of his cards- all different. Never to sell. The dealers would usually have bats, jersey numbers, balls etc. Often times dealers would bring small children along who would ask. It was rare that children were getting autographs for themselves. Most dealers don't get cards signed as there is no $ in cards compared to other items. Or if they do they hand the player a stack of the same card.
Also being a physician who has worked on various players and my son being a bat boy, we talked to many players and they weren't good at differentiating dealers from collectors and sometimes I would try to eduacte them on the difference if they wanted to know. Some of the dealers are very helpful in identifying some of the "scrubs" in street clothes etc. others will go out of their way not to help and be real jerks
I always felt weird getting yelled at or turned down by some marginal player who I happened to want- keeps you humble.
I decided to skip this year for alot of reasons. I miss some of the collectors who are friends- there are also some folks down there I am glad I will not see. And I am trying to limit my collection now to HOF and potential HOF (I have 70,000 signed cards and want to downsize considerably). I feel bad I will miss a chance to get Koufax as I haven't gotten him since 1966 in NYC. . Do I need my 51st Josh Hamilton card signed? (what a great guy) or do I need to get pushed and almost killed in an attempt to get Albert Pujols? It is an obsession and some of us are hoarders. I accept that in myself.
I am going through withdrawal alittle. If Ichiro was still in AZ it would be more tempting tho I hated the wait and then he would drive by and wave but once he retires he disappears to Japan. Oh well, I am sure I will survive- tho getting a guy in person leaves you alot more memories than buying him through the mail and doing it with my son for many years was a great experience neither of us will forget tho he gave it up before me. Maybe he is more mature
I was one on one with Bryce Harper at Juco (while he was in college) in 3 different situations and he didn't acknowlege me or even look up (I was within 3 feet of him) and then when he would sign he'd put a Bible verse.
WE followed guys like Ryan Braun who we got his first day at minor league camp after he just was signed by the Brewers up until last year. He always remained nice as did Prince while others especially WS winning teams- suddenly would become arrogant (like the Giants) become non signers.
Sosa was one of the worst as he was two faced. Bonds at least you new where he stood.
All of us that have been doing this could write a book of stories

[HRBAKER]

Michael,
I have a very similar story. This is the first Spring Training in over ten years that I will not be attending. I used to go with my regular golf foursome every March to Orlando/Lakeland/Kissimmee/Clearwater/Bradenton, etc. Mostly to watch games but to get autos too. Over the past several years as the crowds have grown in size on the auto end, fewer and fewer players have been stopping to sign. Granted to previous posters - many of them are jerks, not sure I've ever seen a baboon ass but many are jerks. Just as assholish have been the actions and behavior of many of the "collectors" who choose to express their immature and off color peevishness at being ignored or turned down regardless of the makeup of the crowd. Frankly, it's just not fun anymore. Many other ways I'd rather spend my non-work time.

[packs]

Spring Training is definitely a whole different animal in terms of the number of dealers walking around. I don't know why, but most of the dealers walk around with binders of cards they're trying to get signed, not baseball after baseball. They are easy to spot, and guess what? Avoid if you're a player. The dealer thing is BS to me.

I love Spring Training because it allows you to get a lot of insight into the type of person players are. There are plenty of camps where you were barely separated from them, like Dodgertown or the old Winter Haven camp for the Indians. Of the players I've been around, I'd say Miguel Cabrera, Curtis Granderson, Pudge and Jason Giambi were the best.

[BigJJ]

Circa late 1980s, I remember Rickey Henderson on crutches at spring training, seeing me and a group of other kids standing by a gate seeking autographs, and he hobbled a half block over on crutches to sign for us.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by packs

Spring Training is definitely a whole different animal in terms of the number of dealers walking around. I don't know why, but most of the dealers walk around with binders of cards they're trying to get signed, not baseball after baseball. They are easy to spot, and guess what? Avoid if you're a player. The dealer thing is BS to me.

You couldn't be more wrong. I go to ST every year and I have stacks and stacks of cards with me and I never sell a single one. I get multiples signed for the occassional trade, but also because I spend over a grand each year on the trip and would like more than 15 signatures to show for my time and money. Not to mention any "dealer" will tell you there is no money in signed cards. People want photos, baseballs, equipment to sell.

Hmmm...so if you, as a collector and avid hobbyist cannot tell the difference between a fellow collector and a dealer, maybe Jeter (or any other athlete) can't either.

[packs]

Jeeze I don't know what to tell you. I don't know why the dealers carry around their binders either since I feel the same way you do, signed cards aren't big sellers. Here's what I do see though, the guys with the binders trying to get 10 autographs while every around them is trying to get one. You brought up how much your trip costs you and wanting something to show for the money. You might not sell your cards, but that's a dealer mentality.

[HRBAKER]

Derek can't either so the default position is that they all are and the little kids are runners. Sadly he'd be right as much as wrong IMO. You choose to spend XXX on a trip to Spring Training as I did, I had to measure it in terms of enjoyment not how many autos I got. The number continued to decrease every year as the crowds got larger and the players less and less compliant.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by packs

You might not sell your cards, but that's a dealer mentality.

Well, I disagree but I definitely see where you're coming from. The difference in my mind is if the guy signs 10 great, and if he signs 1, that's great too. I come prepared for multiples but at the end of the day I'm happy with what I get and I don't push, shove, yell out rude comments, etc. In fact, I've gotten to know several guys in the minors just by striking up conversation with them while they sign.

I guess my whole point of contention here is that making generalizations is usually dangerous, and there seems to be a lot of generalizations being made in this thread.

Originally Posted by packs

the guys with the binders trying to get 10 autographs while every around them is trying to get one.

I think it's up to the player. If the player is willing to sign ten, and in the process not shut out 5 other people, then so be it. You have to have some common sense, if it's a rush thing and you know the guy wants to get everyone, put out one item. If the guy is standing around talking and signing whatever, give him whatever. Sometimes I have 10 different cards of a guy, and I usually try to get as many different cards done as possible like someone else mentioned. But I won't jump in front of someone with one item, I usually try to go last. End of the day, as long as you're polite to the player and the fans around you, it shouldn't bother anybody.

[HRBAKER]

I don't think that the majority of the players understand the "hoarder" mentality. To them a guy with 8 cards on a board with photo corners is a seller. The ones that sign them all don't care. I can see where they are coming from. I do understand your POV as well. I have collected signed cards for years, have nearly 20,000 of them. I accumulated them to trade for others. I started out with ttm in the early 80's.

[dgo71]

Absolutely right HRBaker. I don't understand the hoarder mentality myself half the time, LOL. People ask me why I collect stuff and I just say it's what we (collectors) do...we amass stuff. But yeah, not only do players not understand the hoarding and trading aspects, they also have no clue what their signature is really worth, which in most cases is nothing. A lot of players see a certified, #'d to 100 insert auto on eBay for big bucks and think that's what ALL their signed cards go for, when that's very far from the truth.

The "50/50" and trading aspect...most players are amazed that there are forums like this one where collectors can meet all over the world and help each other. 95% of the players upon hearing this are immediately cool and sign whatever you have. I've been able to help a lot of folks by explaining this side of collecting to the players.

[theshleps]

The first few years I used to buy every obscure minor league card of every coach, etc and have 8 different cards of some minor league coach that never made the majors. It would take a month to go through rosters, buy cards off beckett and ebay as well as sets, etc. If I didn't have 100 cards signed in a day it was a bad day. It was quantity that mattered. As time went on instead of loading up on those same guys again I cut down but it was hard to let a guy walk by without getting him on something so until a few years ago I tried to have at least one card to get signed on everyone as well as all the minor league team sets for minor league spring training where I would do 10 days in late March. Last year I wasn't agressive and was more apathetic. I wanted to get Pujols on a picture of him and my son. I almost got thrown over getting him and he signed in blue sharpie on hs black shirt (if you tilt it in the right direction you can see it was signed). I met my goal though.
If you only concentrated on stars you could be shut out and get no one so this way it was more productive.
Our stuff takes up quite alot of room and we are trying to drastically downsize but it would take the rest of my life to list the items on ebay and I never intended on selling.
Alot of us "older guys" are packing it in as the cons of doing it outweigh the pros. I'd rather concentrate on my vintage collection.
When my son batboyed for Team USA and Frank Robinson was manager half the players on the team never knew that Frank had once played. My son might be happier if I get Pablo Sandoval than Elmer Flick but at least he knows who Elmer is.
My son when he worked at fall league would come home at the end of the season with 30 incredibly stinky hats and 20 pairs of stinky cleats and sometimes he had no clue who wore what. At least we got rid of some of that

[Exhibitman]

Given the ridiculous and dehumanizing nature of the autograph chase I think I'd rather just watch the game and enjoy my day then pick up a certified autographed card on Ebay.

One slight defense of DJ: in the article the person being the total flaming a-hole was actually the attendant telling the crowd the rules and insulting the crap out of them. Not necessarily even Jeter's bobo. I've been in other situations where an overzealous 'Paul Blart' security type takes the perceived power overboard. Of course, if I was Yankees management the worker in question would get a hell of a talking to and there would be significant 'or else' policies set for further fan interactions. Jeter may be free to alienate the customers but not the team's parking lot attendants.

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Originally Posted by EvilKing00

i did mention his 3000 hits and the 18 seasons hes played so far too.

As for his 5 gold gloves.....5 dosnt cut it

Keith Hernandez 11
Don Mattingly 9
Ryne Sandberg 9
Robin Ventura had 6
Mike Schmidt 10
Ozzie Smith 13
Luis Aparicio 9
Omar Vizquel 9

Id compare him to a yount / molitor player. Nothing wrong with that as they are both very good players, but far from what some people think of him

You have no what you're talking about. Measuring GG's is a joke. Your comparison with the other players is laughable because they are not even the same position, and you're comparing pure power hitters vs non, etc.

Funny how you say he's only a 'singles hitter' when he's ahead of WILLIE MAYS!!! When it's all said and done, Jeter will be a top 20 or even top 10 for more careers doubles. Yeah, guess he only hits singles though.

And don't even get me started how clutch he is. Do some research and really think twice about what you say before making yourself sound like an idiot.

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

a model of consistency tripping over his own feet, injuring himself in the playoffs after a come back season....Typical pussy baseball player. JETER IS DONE. Enjoy all the over priced signatures yankee fans

Wow...yep sure as hell makes sense.

[RichardSimon]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Given the ridiculous and dehumanizing nature of the autograph chase I think I'd rather just watch the game and enjoy my day
One slight defense of DJ: in the article the person being the total flaming a-hole was actually the attendant telling the crowd the rules and insulting the crap out of them. Not necessarily even Jeter's bobo. I've been in other situations where an overzealous 'Paul Blart' security type takes the perceived power overboard. Of course, if I was Yankees management the worker in question would get a hell of a talking to and there would be significant 'or else' policies set for further fan interactions. Jeter may be free to alienate the customers but not the team's parking lot attendants.

I started to collect autographs TTM about 25 years ago. Even Joe D would sign one item per month back then.
I chased autographs a couple of times at the Waldorf Astoria when they had a couple of sports banquets.
It was not something I enjoyed, so I stopped even though I had some success. I gave a friend of mine my SBIII program and he got Namath and Ewbank on the cover for me, at the Waldorf.
And in regards to the parking lot attendant in the Jeter story, that part of the story absolutely reminded me of the National Pastime NYC shows. My table used to be in front of the stage where the main guests were signing so I had a prime view of what went on with the signers and collectors. The guy running the lines there was a total jackass on the only power trip of his pathetic little life.
"Get on line,,, numbers 1-50, if you have #51 you don't belong here and your autograph ticket will be taken away, remember I said only 1-50." Wow, was that guy a jerk.

[EvilKing00]

Originally Posted by HOF Auto Rookies

You have no what you're talking about. Measuring GG's is a joke. Your comparison with the other players is laughable because they are not even the same position, and you're comparing pure power hitters vs non, etc.

Funny how you say he's only a 'singles hitter' when he's ahead of WILLIE MAYS!!! When it's all said and done, Jeter will be a top 20 or even top 10 for more careers doubles. Yeah, guess he only hits singles though.

And don't even get me started how clutch he is. Do some research and really think twice about what you say before making yourself sound like an idiot.

hmmmm ok....

1 - Nomar Garciaparra - 229 hr, 313 ave, - SS
2 - Paul Molitor - 234 hr - 306 ave, - not a power hitter
3 - Robin Yount - 251hr, 285 ave - SS, not a power hitter

[Runscott]

I enjoyed getting autographs personally, whether it was baseball players, band members or anyone else. If it wasn't fun, I wouldn't do it. The only bad experiences I had were with Dick Butkus, Pete Rose and Willie McCovey, all as a child. It confused me, as most professionals were very kid-friendly back then, but I was old enough to realize they were a-holes. The people who were super-friendly far outnumbered them.

The scenario with Jeter would not be fun and I can't imagine anyone putting themselves through it unless they were dealers.

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Originally Posted by EvilKing00

hmmmm ok....

1 - Nomar Garciaparra - 229 hr, 313 ave, - SS
2 - Paul Molitor - 234 hr - 306 ave, - not a power hitter
3 - Robin Yount - 251hr, 285 ave - SS, not a power hitter

Gotta look beyond the numbers, which you lack of understanding, I can throw out numbers all day long in certian categories in which Jeter is better than them

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

I'm 26. I grew up in Florida. When I was in middle school my aunt dated the son of a higher up in the Yankees brass. One summer I went to a game with my dad. We had great seats behind home plate. After the game my dad and I waited for the players in the player parking lot. I walked over and asked Jeter for an autograph. Jeter said "you don't have enough money, kid" and walked away. My dad has hated him ever since.

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by I Only Smoke 4 the Cards

I'm 26. I grew up in Florida. When I was in middle school my aunt dated the son of a higher up in the Yankees brass. One summer I went to a game with my dad. We had great seats behind home plate. After the game my dad and I waited for the players in the player parking lot. I walked over and asked Jeter for an autograph. Jeter said "you don't have enough money, kid" and walked away. My dad has hated him ever since.

Nice!

[Bored5000]

Originally Posted by mighty bombjack

Yankees fans and national media hoist Jeter above those in this list, but if Biggio had been a Yankee and Jeter an Astro, we could very likely see Jeter sitting out of the Hall after his first ballot, too, because he wouldn't have the rings or the constant front page stories that he has now.

I am not a Yankee fan at all, but Jeter is currently 11th all-time in hits. Two more productive seasons and he will get to fourth all-time in hits. He has a fairly decent chance of ending up third on the all-time list.

Short of an extraneous factor like a steroid taint or a gambling link, I can't see any way in the world that a guy that high on the hit list would be anything other than an overwhelming first-ballot inductee.

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by Bored5000

I am not a Yankee fan at all, but Jeter is currently 11th all-time in hits. Two more productive seasons and he will get to fourth all-time in hits. He has a fairly decent chance of ending up third on the all-time list.

Short of an extraneous factor like a steroid taint or a gambling link, I can't see any way in the world that a guy that high on the hit list would be anything other than an overwhelming first-ballot inductee.

Very true.

[36GoudeyMan]

I've been to every Nationals Spring training since 2005. Over the years, the team has gotten much worse, then much better. At the beginning, the place (Viera) was jammed because of the novelty; for several years it was quiet and empty, and now its busy as hell.

From what I've seen, the ebb and flow of the crowds is almost entirely opportunist re-sellers, dealers or not. This year, the autograph gatherers have set up a lawn chair gauntlet that players are literally forced to pass through when leaving the practice fields behind the stadium. for each of the last 3 years, we've been increasingly bombarded by people in other teams' gear asking us where Strasburg, Werth, Harper, Gio, Zimmerman, and any of several other players. They routinely held huge binders with cards of multiple teams and players. They did not know anything abut the player, except whose autograph was the most valuable and salable. Some did not even know the players' first names, just last name and number.

We've seen parents with massive binders launching kids with balls and cards into crowds to get someone to sign it, only to have the kid get yelled at for not being aggressive enough if somehow she/he failed.

I've half-jokingly suggested that everyone should have to register and disclose their eBay ID if they want to get autographs, so that the players would know who is more likely getting a signature for themselves or for resale.

I've also said that if every player would sign everything in sight, multiples, of anything, and make the supply so vast that demand could never catch up, then the problem would largely go away. Last week, I saw Gio Gonzalez, on several occasions, stop and sign literally everything stuck in front of him, for nearly an hour each time. he says its "part of his job," but that was way beyond any reasonable expectation. I still think flooding the market is the safest way for these guys to go, but I'm no economist.

The way it is now, legitimate fans who want the personal memento of a player by the interactive experience of a in-person autograph are being swamped by the growing hordes of re-sellers, and many real fans are being soured by the experience of trying to get the special, memorable moment when an idol or a hero or favorite does you the favor of shring a memento. Pity.