This is the problem with grading...

[Peter_Spaeth]

Well that is a completely different issue, David. If there were multiple examples of that, you might be onto something. i also could think of an innocent explanation but you probably don't want to hear it. That explanation would be that he won the card real cheap and thinks Rick can double his money for him on a BIN.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

That explanation would be that he won the card real cheap and thinks Rick can double his money for him on a BIN.

You're right, I do that all the time. I win an eBay auction and then tell the seller, 'You just keep that and re-list it for me with a BIN of double the price of what I won it for."

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

You're right, I do that all the time. I win an eBay auction and then tell the seller, 'You just keep that and re-list it for me with a BIN of double the price of what I won it for."

well David, you seem desperate for a conspiracy theory here, so maybe your third one is right, who knows

[Clutch-Hitter]

1. Same seller sold the cards both times
2. Sales occurred in a small time frame
3. Same buyer in original auctions
4. Cards appeared with grade increases second time
5. The original buyer was a dealer(?), yet had someone else sell
....what else? And a list for realistic explanations?

Well, too many to be called a conspiracy theory as it is...although an unfound conclusion can be reached. In this case, the conspiracy theory would rest on the positive side; the side trying to rationalize all the highly suspicious activity as normal, at least before the team spoke up with the truth as they saw it.

I don't believe that psa did favors specifically. I do believe they are unaware of who submitted, but they do know if one person submitted many cards. They would know specifically who submitted at a show, I guess. Sounds like they were cracked and submitted in bulk, with a single, busy grader dealing with all of them.

I would not think the sgc guy submitted to psa, sounds more like the seller doing that, possibly on behalf of the sgc guy, which could be articulated differently. I initially thought this was similar to that major auction house shilling on their own auctions, with this seller in business with the sgc guy, but was highly relieved when they, like the auction house, explained there was no wrong doing. Very relieved.

It never hurts to check things out since greed can enable people to rationalize unethical behavior as normal, necessary, etc, which may be followed through on...with a pre-meditated alibi...if, then BS. Thank goodness all of it added up to nothing, just a list of odd coincidences...

[smtjoy]

Im less concerned about PSA for all I know the grader at the National made a mistake and let a weak 9 at best get in a 10 holder or card could have gotten a micro shave after being cracked and then resubmitted and deserved the 10 or worse a grader is on the take with this seller (all theories but greed is powerful). The bad side of grading for sure, facts are an 8 going to a 10, ouch.

What still has not been answered is there was clearly shilling on the two cards and nothing from probstein123 about his policy towards when a consignor is caught shilling their auction and how he plans to handle the consignor? It clearly breaks ebay rules, possibly the law, the silence is deafening.

[eb548]

Probstein is the most stand up guy I know in the hobby and I believe many others can vouch for this (hence the amount of business he gets and the trust his consigners and buyers alike have for him). With that being said, the guy is simply huge on ebay. Look at the volume he does! He practically has 2 t206 sets running on ebay right now with thousands of other items. I don't see the issue when he resells a card he once sold prior since he probably sells half the vintage cards on ebay anyway (when you are that big I would assume this is bound to happen many times). And the fact that people get "bumps" is hardly novel. I don't get this thread at all.

Ethan Bous.kila

[Matthew H]

Lol, Leon, that's the first time I've seen you add someone's name for giving too much praise

[WhenItWasAHobby]

Wow. I hadn't read this thread in 14 hours and also looking at the similar CU thread it's become Bump-Up-Fest in PSA-Land. I noticed the bump-up on the '63 Nitschke shown in the PSA thread was initially purchased by "set-fillers".

Look at his feedback he left regarding the 1 item listed.

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAP...kLeftForOthers

Also reading Joe Orlando's latest article:

"For years, hobbyists have been discussing the potential of the high-end sports card and memorabilia market, wondering when the next major jump in values would occur. Well, I am here to tell you that after evaluating many of the prices recorded in the latest slew of auctions and confirming some pretty hefty private sales, the next level has arrived."

Joe's right again. Two grade bump-ups do tend to drive the resale prices significantly higher. Let's also not forgot that the news article regarding Dmitri Young's auction quoting Young to admitting that one of the high profile cards was a bump-up from a 9 to a 10.

http://www.psacard.com/articles/arti...ezine2012aug07

I don't know what to say about the Ebay consignment seller. Obviously we don't know all the facts. One thing is becoming obvious however, is that his auctions are becoming the hobby black hole for, in my opinion, what appears to be an alarming trend in over-graded bump-ups and staying silent on the issue doesn't help at all either in my eyes.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Matthew H

Lol, Leon, that's the first time I've seen you add someone's name for giving too much praise

What if this person praising him is an employee of his? Would that possibly make a difference?

ps....I am not saying the person giving the positive response in this thread is an employee of Rick's. I used it as an example of why a name would need to be in a post that is a positive response. I think it matters.