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#1
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Posted By: icecanuck
Just won an auction from an ebayer calling themselves "sportscarddirect". At first it appeared that I got a good deal but looking over their other auctions I have to wonder about the legitimacy of this seller. It appears as though they have all these great high end cards graded by some unknown grader. |
#2
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Posted By: MW
Which auction did you win? |
#3
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Posted By: Anonymous
one of the 53T Mantle's - hard to tell from the scan but card looks OK (if it's legit). Concerned about the no return on graded cards policy.....why the need to make that stipulation ? If I had it graded by PSA and it came back a couple of grades lower I wouldn't be pissed. If it came back being ungradeable I'd be pissed and I'd have a feeling the seller would know why.....of course these thoughts didn't come to me sooner |
#4
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Posted By: Jon Canfield
Someone better tell the seller that '33 ain't the Babe's rookie... |
#5
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Posted By: John(z28jd)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=642&item=2762716732 |
#6
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Posted By: Julie
Generically, that's such a great Mantle card! |
#7
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Posted By: leon
I would not buy a high graded card from a semi-unknown company. I would want a guarantee it would cross over to GAI or SGC....or maybe PSA (this last one to satisfy the masses but not for me). If you look in the last link that Ben put up it was for a card that came back trimmed. The seller does disclose this but I have to wonder if any of his trimmed cards got put into other company's holders (PCG)....again, this is all conjecture on my part. I still wouldn't buy real high condition cards in these holders though.....there's my 1/4 cent worth |
#8
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Posted By: Julie
a) it's a '53 mantle, not a '52 (Bowman), which is what I thought it was when I said what a great card it (generally) is. |
#9
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Posted By: Julie
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#10
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Posted By: John(z28jd)
I didnt say that it was the same card as he bought,i just pointed out that the seller knowingly bought a trimmed card(that the previous seller described as nrmt looking)and now he just happens to have the same card in an unknown companies holder graded 9. Thats why i provided the 2 different links,if it was the same card as icecanuck bought i wouldnt have given the 2nd link because he already posted the link to see that.That would be redundent. |
#11
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Posted By: Julie Vognar
The first "mistake" I commented on was mine (mistaking a '53 T mantle for a '52 Bowman Mantle--one of my favorite cards, and one I do not have). |
#12
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Posted By: Anonymous
... |
#13
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Posted By: leon
I mentioned it was Ben who put the links up and it was John Z-dude....sorry bout that....after continuing reading the posts on this thread I even more agree that I would be berry berry careful buying these PCG cards.....good luck |
#14
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Posted By: iccecanuck
Thanks for all the feedback, |
#15
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Posted By: runscott
Though it hasn't yet happened to me, I would never pay someone for something that I discovered had been misrepresented. I'm sure there are those who disagree with me on this and I would love to hear their opinions. |
#16
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Posted By: T206Collector
...tell him that I will pay him, but that I am going to have the card reslabbed by PSA or SGC. I would further tell the seller that if the card turns out to be improperly altered/non-authentic, that I will be returning it for a full refund. |
#17
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Posted By: leon
That seller "cardsnwaxsupplies" or something like that put up an E104 HOF- Baker with a BIN of $200.00....it had just gone up and I knew I didn't have time to ask questions so I hit the BIN. I then went ahead and asked for a scan of the card I just won. When the yoyo sent a scan it was of the same card that Greg (hey Greg) BOTN bought recently that is an unidentified card. The only other problem was this was the 1 of the 2 cards that had the name completely trimmed off of the bottom. I told the guy I didn't want it as it was not what he had advertised and I would pay half his relisting fee to help matters....(which I thought was more than fair as he had totally misrepresented the item). He came back and said "no way" and that he wanted a full refund of listing fees. He said he had looked in the 1700 page SCD and this was the best id he could do. I told him he was dead wrong, and by the way, he could look in the front of the book and see my name as a contributor |
#18
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Posted By: Aaron M.
"Thanks for all the feedback, |
#19
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Posted By: icecanuck
ouch, that's the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth......essentially all valid points what you're espousing is buyer beware which is totally valid.....a fool and his money etc. etc. |
#20
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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman
Leon, for what it's worth, the cutoff period to leave a neg feedback is 90 days and not 60. And I agree with scott that I would do my damndest not to pay for something that was misrepresented. Finally, to the first poster in this thread, you have to have rocks in your head to buy a "graded" card from an unknown grading company--unless you're paying small dollars for the card... |
#21
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Posted By: icecanuck
Not rocks in the head just some ignorance to the world of card grading and the mistaken belief that no card grading company would grade doctored cards ? Guess these guys won't be around long. Anyway, I'm learning quickly.....and taking my lumps |
#22
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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman
Ice, sadly you just need to assume that every ebay seller may try to rip you off at ever instant. Sad, but true. I've been there myself and learned the hard way... |
#23
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Posted By: Scott P
Why do you think they are in those unknown company holders? No doubt in my mind they are trimmed or altered in some way. Do you think the seller is so stupid not to use a real company for a card that would grade a 9 knowing they go for 10x as much? You will not make big bucks like you are thinking this way. |
#24
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Posted By: Anonymous
Hey Jeff, |
#25
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Posted By: ice canuck
"You will not make big bucks like you are thinking this way." |
#26
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Posted By: Hankron
From a practical standpoint, if the card is genuine but simply overgraded, even by a lot, that's not such an outrageous price for one of Mantle's nicest cards. |
#27
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Posted By: Hankron
Card collectors should find it desirable to buy from California sellers. Not only is it to against state law to knowingly sell altered items where the alterations are not detailed, but the ignorant seller is legally bound to take the item back if it misrepresented (It is perfectly fine to sell altered items if you detail the alterations). And I'm quite sure that the Sacramento legislature doesn't care one bit what PGS or PRO has to say about it. |
#28
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Posted By: Hankron
I do recommend that interested collectors refer to the specific statues and not rely on my few sentence post. In particular, the buyer has a specific, though reasonable, time frame in which to return an item (If you hold it too long, tough luck). Also, some of the unmention specifics apply to art, memorabilia and autographs of at least a minimum sell value (I'm pretty sure a $1,000+ Mickey Mantle is well over the minumum). |
#29
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Posted By: runscott
"Drunk, trimmed and altered is no way to go through life." |
#30
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Posted By: Anonymous
In case anyone was interested in hearing how this little saga ended. The seller was very reasonable when I told him a had reservations about the card. He assured me that it would be gradeable by PSA but agreed to not sell me the card if I didn't want it. So I passed, he contacted ebay saying that we decided to not complete the transaction and they are going to credit him for the fees. All in all it seems to have worked out OK for both parties - curious to see if it gets relisted....... |
#31
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Posted By: Aaron M.
Good to hear it worked out for you. That was probably the best outcome you could have hoped for. |
#32
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Posted By: Aaron M.
The seller, in your instance, was probably inclined to not bring attention to his sales because his sales history on E-Bay were so clear cut. |
#33
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Posted By: runscott
This guy is a thief, pure and simple - he receives 0 credits for trying to keep his ass out of the frying pan in your case. |
#34
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Posted By: NitroElite
I was actually the high bidder of the 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle #311 for $8k. I actually got the seller on the phone and he agreed to meet me in person and sell the card. |
#35
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Posted By: Aaron M.
Well, like the poster who originally started this thread, it's unfortunately too late to do what you should have done: not bid. |
#36
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Posted By: hankron
The card is not Mint. If a 1952 Topps Mantle is genuinely mint and graded, it will be in a PSA, SGC or similar holder. I don't care what justifications the seller may give (great service, close to home, Joe Orlando refused to pet his dog), no seller is going to throw away thousands of dollars of money to get a genuinely mint 1952 Topps Mantle graded by PGS. |
#37
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Posted By: hankron
I should add that once a seller lies significantly to the buyer about grade, authenticity, trimming, etc., the buyer is no longer under obligation to buy the item. Especially when it involves an expensive item. And yes, a seller can lie by omission. |
#38
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Posted By: warshawlaw
don't even look back. an obvious scam as a real Mantle in a condition worthy of the label would sell slabbed for $50,000 or more. No one leaves that much on the table. |
#39
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Posted By: NitroElite
Thanks so much everyone for your input and feedback. I had a feeling that it was too good to be true but hoping that it wasn't (because of the 5th party grading). I'm so glad that such a helpful forum like this one exists and I thank all of you guys for helping me in NOT losing $8,000.00 on this card. |
#40
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Posted By: Julie
..and, although I prefer the '52, the '53 Bowman Mantle is sort of the same type as the '52 Topps,--but nicer. |
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