A Collector, Mastro, PSA & Our Beloved Hobby

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Posted By: dan mckee

Thanks for the update from Doug and Leon. Doug has done his job as the president of a major auction house. And Leon, thanks for communicating. Dan.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

I wonder why Doug didn't take any action when he first received the card and was presented with its purported problems. No contact with PSA until just days ago according to him - even though he had his own personal experience with a Nodgrass fraudulent card.

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Posted By: John

First let me say I guess I can understand Doug not wanting to post, but then again I think some direct input via Mastro would go a lot farther than this arms distance via Leon.

Second I guess I should thank Doug for looking into this, but the other part of me says I shouldn’t be grateful about this. This is what should have been done long ago; nobody is doing anyone any favors here.

PSA needs to stand behind their product long discussions shouldn’t be needed here to have PSA review this item. We have a fake card in a holder which PSA deemed legit. They (PSA) should be jumping over walls to get this card back in hand and review… and Mastro should be seriously looking into why this card was ever placed up for auction in the first place and who approved this lot and disclaimer with or without Doug’s approval.

Also are you sure PSA has never seen this card?? Are we 100% sure of this?

To me this whole thing is a mess I can’t believe we all are so relaxed about this, Doug and Mastro have no prior knowledge of this card, yet this card gets a disclaimer? Funny the other Nodgrass cards auctioned as recent as the previous auction had no such disclaimer.

Nobody finds this the least bit odd? We can post till our fingers bleed about eBay scammers and reprints that wouldn’t fool Stevie Wonder, but this real issue is staring us in the face and we are all content with the "our bad will look into this" reponse??

Somebody’s not being 100% on the level with us (PSA, Mastro, and Consignor) IMO, and I think this really raises a lot more questions.

The questions aren’t really about the card or if it’s legit here folks, we already know the answer.

The questions are very clear and have been shuffled around or passed over IMO by the parties at hand Mastro included.

Here is what we should be asking and have asked which have really yet to be explained…

How did this card get into a holder to begin with?

Why did PSA stonewall or delay this card the first few times, and now only at this point is willing to review almost as if their doing us a favor?

How did this card end up in a Mastro Auction and end up being the only lot to ever carry such a disclaimer if Mastro really had no knowledge of this card and its history?

Regards,

John

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Posted By: dan mckee

"Also are you sure PSA has never seen this card?? Are we 100% sure of this? "

Comical that this is even a question.

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Posted By: John

Found this in my inbox today from Rob (Hi Rob) thought this was intresting to say the least!

"He has promised to reveiw it and get back to me. He indicated he has never been contacted or has to his knowledge seen this particular card."

PSA I think owes you and REA an appology Doug and us an explination…seems Joe is having some memory problems. This just into my inbox…from Rob Lifson..with his permission to post Leon.

__________________________________________________ _________________________________

From: Robert Lifson [info@robertedwardauctions.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 12:11 PM
To: wonkaticket@comcast.net
Subject: FW: snodgrass


Dear Mr. Wonkaticket, I have been directed to the Net54 thread regarding the Nodgrass card, specifically the recent post by Leon for Doug Allen. With reference to the sentence that suggests that REA did not contact PSA about this card, there appears to be a misremembance. In addition to referencing this card (and its status as being sent to the grading company) in a public interview with the Sports Collectors Daily published on November 1, 2007, REA also has emails, witnesses, phone records, and Fed Ex records that prove that we did communicate with PSA and send the card to them for review specifically because it was not real and we would not auction it.

As I read the post above, it is saying otherwise. I am writing only to correct this error. Also, attached is a copy of the executed PSA submission form that was sent back to us with the fake Nodgrass card when it was returned to REA by PSA (we then sent the card back to the consignor, and we have the Fed Ex records, as well as correspondence, documenting this return as well).

You are welcome to post this email and/or and the attached PSA submission scan if you would like, to clear up any misconception regarding the claims that have been posted implying that REA did not contact, email, personally speak with PSA, and/or send the card in for review, as we did ALL of these things, and we can prove it.

Sincerely,

Robert Lifson
President
Robert Edward Auctions, LLC

Here is the attached form


*Here is the second email Mr. Lifson sent*
__________________________________________________ _____________________________________

From: Robert Lifson [info@robertedwardauctions.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2008 1:08 PM
To: wonkaticket@comcast.net
Subject: FW: nodgrass

Dear Mr. Wonkaticket, In addition to the PSA submission scan, per your request is am forwarding this second email (with REA's scan of the fake Nodgrass card attached) that REA sent to PSA prior to sending the card in for review via Federal Express, and you are welcome to use this to further establish that an error has occurred with reference to claims implying that REA did not contact PSA about the fake Nodgrass card.

Sincerely,

Robert Lifson
President
Robert Edward Auctions, LLC

-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Lifson [info@robertedwardauctions.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 10:49 AM
To: 'Joe Orlando'
Subject: FW: nodgrass

Hi Joe! Here is a scan of the T206 nodgrass so you can check the cert # and see who submitted it and when in case this provides valuable info. I'll get this out to you today for tomorrow delivery. Here is the name and # of the consignor (below). He was fine with us sending it in for your review. The guy he bought it from was a guy named George Hober (don't know him but apparently this is not isolated with this guy). Happy to be out of the loop on this - the owner of the card's contact info is:

Nate Racine

P.O.Box ***

Zephyr Cove, NV. 89448

775-***-****

and his email address if you need it is: nbracine@****.net

Sincerely,

Rob L

Robert Lifson
President
Robert Edward Auctions, LLC
__________________________________________________ _____________________________

Note the email did contain consignors info I have edited it out for his privacy also a copy of the this card was attached FYI




I’m thinking of doing an investgative report called the Wonkaticket Hour I’ll be right on after Hugh Downs…all joking aside what's going on here???

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Posted By: Pennsylvania Ted

Currently on ebay, there is a graded (SGC 40) T206 Bud SHAPPE with an EPDG back.

Do we know if this silly printing flaw is compatible with an EPDG back ?

The normal Bud Sharpe card is found with an EPDG back.

We need for you to do some more of your fine investigative reporting on this card.

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Posted By: dan mckee

Ted, stay on subject here. Dan. I am chop busting u, I luv u.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

WHOA! PSA caught in a lie???

Shocking...

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Posted By: Phil B.

As Mr. Wonka so correctly points out- the appearance of impropriety here is disturbing and unmistakable. And for the offending parties to be unwilling to comment directly or to respond with continuing misrepresentations of the truth is unacceptable. Without meaning to turn this into a PSA bashing thread- PSA seems to have a deep seeded defect in their corporate philosophy. In an industry where reputation and customer service count for everything- they no longer seem to care about either of these things. Time and again they demonstrate a pompous(P), self-serving(S) arrogance(A). It seems to me the veterans on this board that are most respected are often cited for their honesty, integrity, availability and fair dealing. Once you lose these things- you can't really ever get them back.

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Posted By: MikeU

I wish everyone would just stop unjustly bashing on PSA.

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Posted By: leon

Be advised you need to be well known (by at least me) or put your full contact info out here if you want to post in this thread anymore. regards

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Posted By: Phil B.

I always felt I was well known at least in my own small circles. My wife very rarely lets me out of the house but one day when I am allowed to attend a National I will surely introduce myself to you. In the meantime I am Phil Bornstein and you can always contact me at gnaabstract@nyc.rr.com

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Posted By: leon

My apologies for not knowing you well. I am sure you are a stand up guy like 99% of the rest of the board. I look forward to meeting you at the National and shooting the breeze. Hopefully you will make our Net54 VBCF Dinner on Thursday evening too....It will be a few feet from the Convention at the Embassy Suites....more details coming on that in the future.....take care

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Is it possible that Mastro and PSA were separated at birth?

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Posted By: Rob D.

Jeff,

Please "stop unjustly bashing on PSA."

Thank you.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

True, true. That was a lowblow to PSA. There goes my shot at the HOF.

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Posted By: dan mckee

Have you heard if this has been resolved yet by PSA? Dan.

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Posted By: B.C.Daniels

what happened to:

a) the Matty portrait with the bogus Red Hindu back?

and/or

B) the bogus Drum Cobb batting pose card?

I thought SGC? destroyed the Matty maybe 6 years ago?

where did these two cards that sold for strong money in holders go?

BcD

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Posted By: John

Just saw the ad above, just curious if the best people & the best service have sorted this out yet?

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Posted By: DD

PSA Rule 1
a) Never admit to anything
b) it'll blow over
c) only 0.0x % of our customers read this board
d) the person who inadvertently graded this card (and coincidentally convinced everyone else that saw it during the review that it was real) has since left our employ (applicable for any grading error)
e) bury head in sand so that only Nicholas Cage or Harrison Ford can find us

PSA Rule 2 - When caught in a lie, see Rule 1

PSA Rule 3 - When Mastro is involved, take the blame by applying Rule 2

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

John, those pictures look like mug shots.

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Posted By: dan mckee

Bump to stay on top until PSA does what is RIGHT!

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Posted By: John

So do we have refund and a bad card out of the hobby yet?

Or will I be watching this on eBay later this year???

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Posted By: MikeU

John,

Take a look at this months SMR. I would at least bet a $1 that the editors commentary may have some genesis with yourself.

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Posted By: John

Really any details Mike?

Foolishly I’ve let my subscription to SMR & Cock Fighting Weekly both lapse.

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Posted By: Beavis

He said "cock"...he he

Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

John, your loss -- you'd be shocked to see who was the centerfold in this week's CFW. All I'll tell you is that he was completely buck naked with just a low grade E90-1 Jackson hiding the family jewels.

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Posted By: John

Jeff really? Wow that sounds spicy!

It's a shame I can't see it but it was either new snow tires for the home or the magazine sometimes life has choices ya know. I also know what an avid collector of the magazine you are so I wont ask you to forward when you're done.

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Posted By: leon

Enough about cockfighting!! Who would want a cock-tainted magazine anyway? Mostly people hoping to move up to triple wides I guess.....I hear they get good mpg though...so that's always a plus......

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Posted By: Rich Klein

Check the back of that card

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

swept.under.rug

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Posted By: John

PSA.....Mastro...Anyone....Nodgrass...out of the loop or onto the next poor fool?

I see the deadline for the auction is June 6th...I guess the deadline for this simple question which has been asked dozens of times now...is the 12th of Never.

I'll pay $75 for the answer...wait I dont have to Lichtman already paid it for me. LOL

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Posted By: Scott Sarian

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Posted By: dan mckee

Joe contacted the owner of the Nodgrass last week and said it would be taken care of this week. Today is Friday and I have heard nothing. I just do not understand why they wouldn't take care of this way back when to be done with it. Oh, yes I do, they should have done that with my Magie but elected to get destroyed in court by Perry Mason.

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Posted By: Ted

PSa buys the card, destroys it, and never mentions it again. I have a feeling that the issue is that if they didd indeed grade an altered card, they dont want to admit. So buy, even with a straw buyer with a TOP all bid, why not since your ENTIRE reputation is at stake right? Then destoy it or put it under the glass on the desktop. Just my 2 cent, but the card should be bought back somehow and destroyed

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Posted By: dan mckee

The card is in PSA's possession I believe and you will not see the alteration by putting a glass on it.