Would you open it??

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Posted By: Mike Mccullough

If it was the real deal I would open it.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=011&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=320078484864&rd=1&rd=1

This is not my auction and am in no way pimping it. (Sidenote) If this is a legit auction why wouldnt the seller have somebody with some freaking feedback sell it for him??? I apologize in advance if this is taboo thing to do while an auction is still active.

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Posted By: joe

There are lots of collectors on the board that can figure out if this pack would have a card in the pack. I'm not one of them. But if I had the pack I would open it.

Joe

Ty Cobb, Spikes flying!

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

WOW THIS COULD HAVE A HONUS WAGNER IN IT!!!!!!!!

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Posted By: joe

Dan, more likely an Ames.

Ty Cobb, Spikes flying!

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Posted By: Jim Dale

More about this "pack" or "box" or what ever it really is? How many cards in it? Are they all polar bear? Or, sadly, is a poor attempt at misleading everyone?

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Posted By: Myron

I don't think it's legit. The seller has 0 feedback. He says the T-206 cards are the oldest and rarest cards to find. Anyone who knows anything about vintage cards knows this isn't true. He's such a nice guy that he's giving the buyer the pleasure of opening the box,since he doesn't have the courage to open it even though he admits the possible card inside is worth more than his reserve price.

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Posted By: fkw

Im not an expert but the factory number (6), location (Ohio), and year (1910) on the box and taxstamp matches the Polar Bear cards exactly. Polar bear cards have 350 and 460 series cards But thats as much as I know.

Usually on unopened eBay packs something doesnt match up.

And yes Id open it.

But I also would never pay more than what an EX/NRMT T206 card sells for.

PS. A Polar Bear pack recently opened at a National Convention (in NY) was rumored to have 5 cards in it (page 41 issue #3 "Old Cardboard").

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Posted By: Myron

If it were real, a person would be crazy to sell it unopened, knowing the cards they could possibly find in it.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Man could you imagine your dad buying a Polar Bear carton in 1910 (did they even sell cigarettes by the carton back then?) - he smokes them up in a weeks time and hands over 50 T206 cards to you.

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Posted By: Dylan

I sent the seller a message explaining that the Wagner ofcourse doesnt come with a polar bear back. He asked me to help him write a description, so i sent him another email explaining the polar bear subset, and that if cards are included in your pouch its possible that multiple cards could be found. Will see if he edits his auction, he said he would...

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Posted By: fkw

Its not crazy to sell unopened. Est. Value if opened $100, not opened $2,000. And there have been 7 unopened PB packs found in the last few years (info from issue #3 OC).

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Posted By: Myron

Are there any cards with Polar Bear backs worth more than $2,000? If so, I stand by my assertion that it would be crazy to sell the box unopened. Plus, boxes are made to be opened.

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Posted By: David Smith

If I won it, I would NOT open it. However, I would try every conceivable way to "see" what is inside, ie medical devices.

I mean, what is the best possible outcome?? Wagner is not going to be in there. How about Plank, Magie or the Doyle error? Probably not. The rare Demmitt and O'Hara cards, I think, come with Polar Bear backs, so THAT would be the best outcome.

On the downside, you might get 1-5 common cards, cards of different subjects or NOTHING AT ALL. There would also be one less unopened pack in the world.

My thinking is, most of these packs will eventually be opened because of human nature, curiosity and greed. If you REALLY want to be greedy, leave the pack unopened and just wait. Just think what an unopened pack will bring twenty years from now??


David

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Posted By: fkw

There are 2 cards that anyone who opened it would be looking for, and its not Cobb or Mathewson.

Demmitt and O'Hara (StL) are only found with Polar Bear backs, and ea. book for $35,000 (NRMT).

If there is 5 cards per pack, your odds arent too bad to find one. The Demmitt and O'Hara are not rare within Polar Bear (not any rarer than other PB back), only rare within T206 as a whole.

Id open it now that its rumored that there may be as many as 5 cards in the pack. One card, na, Id sell it

But I would never own it, cause I wont pay that crazy money

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Posted By: John S

I would open it and smoke the 90+ year old tobacco...it will be interesting to see how this auction ends.

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Posted By: joe

So, after reading these posts, are the pack experts agreeing it is a good pack with cards in it?

Joe

Ty Cobb, Spikes flying!

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Posted By: scott hassel

I've owned 3 of these over the past 12 years. I've sold 2 and kept 1. I haven't opened the one I still own and I don't think the 2 I've sold have been opened. I found all 3 at an old tobacco auction in North Carolina. They had been owned by a gentleman that had a huge cigarette/tobbaco collection that had pasted away. I bought about 50 rare packs from that auction. In deed these packs and the 1 listed have the possibilty of have 1 or more cards inside. Haven't thought of opening any of my umopened packs ever. The collectability of these packs are in their original unopened form as the value would be 25% or less if opened...but then again my politics have moved far to the right. Great value on this pack at under $2500.
Oh , I'm a pack collector.

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Posted By: scott hassel

BTW , this is NOT a box but heavy paper ..in other words its a soft package. Plus if a card was inside best guess it would be heavily stained by the tobacco.

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Posted By: Dave

My brother and I opened a Polar Bear pack in 1995. The card inside was Maloney I believe, and it was hardly in Ex/Mt condition. The card was snuggly laying right against the plug of raw tobacco, and I have been told that that was the way all Polar Bear cards were packed. This card was stained pretty badly, and the corners of the card were not that sharp. I sold the card , but the new owner eventually had it graded at a 4 by PSA.
The antique shops where I liv e often get Piedmont and Old Mill unopened packs , and sell them for around $200. The shop owners that know about Ebay usually get twice or three times that much from what they have told me in the past.
there is a guy that used to set up tables at a local show, and he had several unopened packs and tins of Sweet Caporal. he is also the only person I know who owned an unopened packs of Lenox

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Posted By: fkw

The red flags are more with the feedback, LV seller, and private auction (shill).

The pack looks good, but you might never get it after winning

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Posted By: Chris Mc

I have had three unopened Sweet Caporal packs. None contained a card of any kind. Of course this goes back to the days before I knew which factory numbers might contain cards. Looking back I should have tried to see with a some tech devise to determine what if anything might be inside. On the upside, I ended up selling all three opened packs for almost as much as I paid for them.

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Posted By: Dave

I remember hearing some rumors that a former auction place used to x-ray unopened packs back in the 90's. I don't if that would work or not.

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Posted By: Bob

Why in the world would you open it? The card would be heavily stained and its provenance would quickly dissipate once removed from the pack and perhaps graded. You might be able to document the card's removal from the pack with photographs and affidavits but otherwise you'd probably be stuck with an SGC 20 common T206 card.

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Posted By: Mike

I agree with TBOB, the odds of getting anything other than a common are high. Probably stained, and or bent, as they laid loose in the pack. It's cool the way it is. leave it. You can always open it years from now. If it turns out to be a homerun, so be it. But leave it intact. That's what gives it it's uniqueness. The card is still in there.

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Posted By: basestealer b. basestealer

I have had the pleasure (or displeasure in retrospect) of owning some rare, unopened material. I eventually opened a few, and was never happy with the results. A couple tobacco packs, but mostly wax packs from the 50's (40 years newer than this pack). The cards are at best ex-mint straight out of the pack, and the front and back cards are disposable as they sat next to the gum and/or the wax. Tobacco cards, sadly, sit right on the tobacco and get the brunt force of any trauma the pack suffers. If at any time during this pack's existance it sat in the heat, the card is likely ruined. You have no idea where it's been in 90 years. Worse yet, water damage. If you get a PSA 4, you LUCKED OUT! It is definately worth more unopened, leaving it a mystery (unless it did contain a Wagner, which is not possible). Sort of like the '52 Topps issues. You pay upwards of $500 for a 1 cent penny pack where the card is going to be excellent or worse condition, and the only way you made your money back is if you pull a Mantle. That's slightly better odds than the lottery, but still a longshot. Yes, I would open it. I can't help myself. This is why it's best to keep me away from unopened material

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Posted By: Frank Evanov

"I remember hearing some rumors that a former auction place used to x-ray unopened packs back in the 90's. I don't if that would work or not. "

X-rays cannot distinguish the presence of a paper card in a tobacco pack.

Ultrasound might be helpful in differentiating paper from tobacco, but it would be dificult.

Frank

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Posted By: Joe D.

I recently opened up a 1951 Topps Red Back pack - and even though it may not be the best thing to do money wise - it is pretty exciting to open up a 60+ year pack of cards.

I think an 'unopened' vintage pack wouldn't remain unopened for more than a couple of days if I had it. Too tempting to take a look inside.

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Posted By: anthony

sorry for not reading every single post but i did read several...wouldnt this be the perfect item to own if you were involved in that "stock" ownership thing that was mentioned here awhile back???

anyone here have money to blow??? just buy the damn thing and open it and let us know...

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Posted By: Mike

Yes, this would indeed be a very cool market item for CardTarget if these do truly sell in the $2000 range. It would have to remain unopened though.

But I'd be in for $10 to buy it and open it at the next National in public. =)

What are the chances that something worth MORE than the $2000 this pack might cost comes out? 1%?

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Posted By: Cobby33

It lists a money back guarantee if the pack is returned unopened. So what is being guaranteed? I emailed to see if there is a refund if the pack doesn't contain cards...