Do You Read Payment Instructions?

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Posted By: Lee Behrens

First of all I want to say I am not going after anyone on this board, I just want to try and figure out how best to handle a situation I am in with Paypal.

I have a personal Paypal account and a business account that is under my name (paaypal does not allow more than one business account per name). I have my ebay auctions hooked up to my personal accoount (they only accept payment if there is money in the buyers account or echecks). I clearly state in my auctions that if you are paying by Paypal without funds in your account that you are to contact me and I will send them the business account address. Needless to say I am constantly denying payment because the instructions are not being followed or not being read.

My question to all "Do you read the payment instructions?" or just click the Paypal link? I like the automatic link but if this is the case I am going to eliminate the automatic link. All responses appreciated.


I prefer not to use the business account because it is a partnership and the less in that account that is not business the better.

I have had to deny many payment and want to try and minimize this.

Thanks

Lee


edited title to be more specific.....LL

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Posted By: Brad Green

I have been selling cards on eBay for several years. Until a few months ago, I also had only a personal PayPal account. I had to deny several PayPal payments because they were made from credit cards or debit cards. I did not even use the PayPal logo at the bottom of my auctions because it had credit card pictures in it. (At least one person found this misleading...) I was content to continue using eBay and PayPal with my personal account, until one day when one of my auctions was cancelled by eBay because it violated PayPal rules. (I deleted the cancellation email because I was so furious...) Basically, the email stated that my auction was cancelled because I put restrictions on how someone could pay via PayPal. If I accepted PayPal payments, then I must be able to accept credit card payments as well. I bit the bullet and upgraded to a commercial account. I think someone turned me in to eBay. I haven't actually found this rule listed on eBay, but it's probably listed there somewhere.

And no, people don't always read the payment instructions. As someone told me after I denied their payment, "Money is money." That is just not true with PayPal personal accounts.

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Posted By: Joann

Uh oh. Sorry guys. Buttons and icons, all day long. That's all I really look for. If the instructions are prominent in the description and the description is short, I'll probably find/realize it. But if the auction layout is "busy" with a lot of side comments and notes, etc, no way I'd catch the difference. I look for PP icons because I am chronically stamp-challenged (what's a stamp, anyway?), and after winning go back and hit the PP button right away.

Just the way I do it, but I'd probably be one of the causes of frustration for either of you - without meaning to be.

Joann


(Edited because I thought I should take another shot at correctly spelling my own name. Duh.)

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Posted By: leon

If I see a Paypal button I am clicking it...da** the rest of the instructions I am in a hurry. Sad fact...my guess is a lot of folks are like me. (in that respect anyway) I will read shipping fee info so if you could/do put something there I will read it...otherwise I am off to he races....

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Posted By: joe

I would say with 2 accounts it might be confusing. You would probably have to put these instructions right at the beginning of the description and repeat them at the end of your description for most people on EBAY to follow them.

Joe

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

If there are a very few instructions, I will read them.

If there are a bunch of instructions, I've come to the point where I won't even bid.

How much of your listing is taken up by instructions, boiler plate language, liability stuff????

If there are paragraphs of stuff, try one auction with bare bones, and see how it does.

Frank.

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Posted By: Josh K.

Ive had that problem as well - I almost always state in my auctions that I do not accept credit cards and that payment through paypal must be by bank transfer. Like Brad, I have had one auction cancelled as a result of this alleged policy violation. Like Lee, I find a lot of people do not read the description (which is where I state no credit cards) very carefully. I always email the person first to let them know that I will be denying payment and requesting that they submit a new payment or send a check. I also explain that I dont do this for a living and that the fees are too high for an account that permits me to receive credit card payments. Ive never had any problems and have generally found the buyers to be more than willing to make an alternative payment after they receive the explanation.

On a side note, I also have two accounts to my name and ended up upgrading one of them to a commercial account a few months ago when I was selling a long of cards - the $500 receiving limit was just too low to allow me to offer paypal on my auctions any other way.

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Posted By: Tom Boblitt

I click the button......guess I should read closer but as a seller too, I just accept payment however and try to build any fees into my costs to do business. I can barely keep up with one account without having to figure out what account I should be sending to someone. That also slows down the auction process as if you only had a single account, you could put the email address in the auction and it would be done and paid for. So many people click and pay RIGHT after the auction now. I just don't want to have that much intervention with figuring out how to pay. COMPLETELY understand why you're doing it but would be too confusing for me.

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Posted By: peter ullman

i, like others, do not take the time to sift through verbose postings...i just click on paypal when offered. i like quick and easy and have little patience for superflous nonsense!

pete in mn

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

Lee,

I click the paypal link and let it do it's thing. I had my paypal account connected to a savings account but I kept a minimal amount of funds in the paypal account. When it was time to pay there would be a few days lapse between the time I submitted payment and the time payment would be processed. I typically wouldn't read the fine print trying to redirect me to another paypal account.

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Posted By: warshawlaw

Don't accept paypal payments unless you are a full-time or high volume business. I decided not to allow Paypal payments precisely because of the high cost of credit card payments combined with the buyer's virtually limitless ability to screw with my account via spurious protests. The only exception is on book sales, where I am willing to "risk" a chargeback since the cost of it is only one book.

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Posted By: andy becker

i agree with adam. why accept paypal if you don't "need" the money right that very second?

ebay fees, paypal fees......too much.

imo, ebay sales are not affected by not accepting paypal.

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Posted By: Josh K.

That is the million dollar question Andy - Are ebay sales hurt by not accepting paypal? I seem to recall past threads in which many people on this board stated that they avoid auctions that dont accept paypal.

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Posted By: Bob

I have had that same reaction, that bidders said they avoided auctions which wouldn't accept Paypal.

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Posted By: Dustan Hedlin

Unlike a lot of the previous posters, I always try to find out if they take credit cards via paypal, or only balance transfers before I bid. I adjust my paying habits to fit their auction. Sometimes I won't bid on a higher dollar item if they don't take CC via paypal. Lately, I rarely bid on an auction that doesn't accept paypal. For me to write a check and send it off, it's gotta be something that I really want in my collection. It's much easier to click the button.

Just like Lee, I used to have to deny many payments before I upgraded. Even though I stated in big red letters that I didn't accept credit cards through paypal, at the top of the listing, I got plenty of credit card payments, which I had to deny and wait for them to pay me through a balance transfer or bank transfer. It was a hassle, so I bit the bullet and upgraded.

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Posted By: Joe D.

--I sometimes look at is a red-flag... most of the frauds don't accept PayPal, so not accepting PayPal can raise an eyebrow.

--If I have a choice - I will always choose a seller that accepts PayPal over one that does not (applicable to common items).

--And finally... sometimes my PayPal account grows nicely... and before my wife notices and asks me to send some money home, I get to go on a shopping spree.

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Posted By: Matthew

I have 2 Paypal accounts for the same reason Lee does & I can't understand why it should be so hard. I don't list very much but I decided to just take out the Paypal link & contact the buyer after the auction's end. It is very frustating when payments have to be constantly denied, then the buyers get upset & it turns into a big mess. Having auctions cancelled by eBay is a pain as well. (Separate thread -- why don't they crack down on some "real" offenses?)

I would rather not use Paypal at all, but I know it results in a higher final bid. As a bidder, I have gotten some nice deals on auctions that don't accept it.

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Posted By: warshawlaw

I don't think so anyway (I guess I wouldn't know if it did...). But then again, I don't start cards ridiculously low hoping for hot bidding action.

I shy away from auctions w/o paypal from new or unknown sellers. Established ebayers are a different story.

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Posted By: John S

I do not accept PayPal....don't want to be bothered with the potential issues and fees. I believe that I saw the stat on ebay that paypal auctions bring 5% more on average compared to auctions not accepting PayPal. If you are selling a 2005 shiny card numbered to 100000 I could see how it might affect sales, as potential buyers would have multiple options simultaneously for the same card. For the types of cards that we collect I don't see not offering PayPal as being an issue. In seven years on ebay I have never avoided an auction that does not accept PayPal.

I have been scolded by sellers a few times for not directing funds into the correct place. I just usually click on PayPal or write a check. Ebay has made it very simple for the buyer. I don't have the time to read through directions, as simple as they may seem to the person who wrote them.

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Posted By: warshawlaw

and paypal charges what % more?

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Posted By: Anonymous

I sometimes read payment "instructions," but I ignore them. I have only one instrument of payment, and that is my personal check. When I win an auction, I immediately email the seller, and tell him that my check will be in tomorrow's mail, which is the truth. I do not have PayPal, and I see no reason to get it.

Am I missing something? Why should I get PayPal?

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Posted By: Charlie O'Neal

Lee,

I have ran into this problem when buying from you a while back. Even though I read your payment indtructions, once the auction is over I like to pay for all of my items at once from my ebay homepage. It was difficult for me to remember your instructions for that specific auction when I was paying for items for 5 different sellers at once. Thought I would share with you what some people maybe doing when they make payments.

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Posted By: jay behrens

The thing that I find most interesting about this thread is that everyone is saying that they do not read the sellers instructions. This seems really odd since most people on this board seem to complain about about the lack of details or instructions regarding various aspects of an auction when things go wrong. Seems to me that you can't be compaining about about the lack of info in auctions when you aren't even reading them in the first place.

Jay

Growing old is not optional, growing up is.

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Posted By: Gilbert Maines

I have some rather old relatives who are anti-technology. As such, they have no faith in conveniences which I find commonplace, and they don't have nor want them. These outlandish new-fangled items include dreaded devices like microwave ovens and air conditioners.

The older I get the more I see them in my mirror. I don't have, want nor trust on line payment methods, nor am I very computer literate, and happy with that status (at most times). But it would be nice to post a picture sometimes, or even a link.

So paypal is out. And checks really take too much time to clear. I don't know why. They use computers now-a-days, don't they? So it is money orders. It seems that most sellers like those too. But I have to use trustworthy sellers. But that aint a bad idea, anyways.

Its Only that ol' hick, Gil

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

I think folks read instructions, if they are short. Sellers, keep it short!!!

I didn't see that thing about Paypal items sell for 5% more on average, but I believe it. I use Paypal both ways. First, it is quick. I can pay for a card and sometimes get the card 2 or 3 days later... I use Paypal because sometimes I've been able to fund a card purchase with a credit card. That allowed me to bid a higher price, which was good for the seller. And mindful of that, I think that I get more bidders and eventually a higher price for cards if I accept Paypal, and credit cards through Paypal.

So you guys who don't like Paypal and who don't accept credit cards, good for you. Don't go changing your mind. If you list a card identical to one I've listed one day, I'm confident mine will sell for a higher price.

Anyone up for a test of this??? I have an ungraded McIntyre Brooklyn and Chicago Sweet Cap 350 card laying on a shelf beside me, probably vg. Anyone else on here have one they'ed part with, someone who doesn't take Paypal??? If so, email me, we'll list the cards with identical wording, in the description and everywhere, and we can list them at the same time. Then we'll see how the bidding goes. (No Net54 shills to skew the results!!!)

Frank.

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Posted By: Anonymous

I avoid ebay sellers who don't offer PayPal click and pay. My life is just too complicated allready.

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Posted By: andy becker

hi guys (and gals),
i didn't have to sleep on my response ....my home internet connection is down .

i agree with john s. (hi john), 100%.

as a seller, if you are selling prewar cards and not shinny crap, paypal does not affect bidding.

as a buyer, i could care less if the seller wants payment in lira....or rubles.....or blood. if he has a card i want, i will make payment in whatever form the seller desires.

i will add that when i started selling on ebay, i did accept paypal. as my feedback grew (today it is 775 with no negitives and no neutrals), there was no need to "give" paypal any of my money.

99.9% of buyers understand my position and make no waves about my payment terms.

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Posted By: Lee Behrens

I am not overly fond of Paypal and it's fees but it seems a necessary evil. I for one not able to bid on many cards because I do not have cash liquid to pay for all purchases thus if no paypal no bid. I know I am not the only one out there.

How many times does accepting Paypal actually give you higher realized prices to make up for the cost of the fees? I personally believe that the extra bidding out weighs the cost.

There are times where I do not even put the option of Paypal for items under $50 because the cost is at it's highest on lower dollar items.

Lee

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Posted By: andy becker

hi lee,
responding to your question, i think that some bidders (like yourself) will shy away from auction that do not accept paypal. but, because prewar cards have become so liquid i do not think it affects sales.
ie; you may not bid, but there is someone else who will step to the plate rather than see an item go below market value.

the one example that i can think of paypal making a difference is in a very scarce, very high dollar card. those times buyers prefer the protection (and float) of a credit card company. and on a scarce card one bidder who shys away may make a huge difference in price.
you can combat that by starting your auctions at or about market value (like adam does). or give that stuff to the mastros of the world.

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Posted By: Rob

If you have a reasonably rare item where there was only 1 snipe bid at the end, with an item ending at $500 with no Paypal, have you thought about what that maximum bid COULD had been? There could had been someone bidding $1000 IF there was Paypal being accepted, and your $500 snipe bid's max could had been $800-1000. Bottom line, you got $500 where you could had got $1000 with Paypal drawing out that one bidder who didn't show up.

Got to admit the Paypal fees are annoying, and you'd better charge enough for shipping to protect yourself from a claim from an unscrupulous buyer. Which is why it's good policy to not give FB to a Paypal buyer until AFTER he's provided positive FB. Keep reading how there is going to be real competition to Paypal that will bring down fees, it's overdue.