Is this a joke? Was this card graded on April 1st?

[Archive]

Posted By: tbob

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31718&item=5159412560&rd=1

Man o man, age toning, rounded corners, paper loss on the back and he gets a PSA 4?????
Wow.........

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

Holy crud, Cardman. That card is in worse shape my Thorpe and it got a 20 from SGC

Jay

Wow upside down is Mom. Mom upside down is what dad wants to see.

[Archive]

Posted By: Shannon

Just another example that some people get special treatment when their cards are submitted, there other cards from this seller that dont deserve the grade they got.

[Archive]

Posted By: Robert A

There is something fishy with this one.

[Archive]

Posted By: Chris

I am quickly losing faith in PSA. The last two cards I have puchased were T205's graded by PSA. The first one a PSA 5 had a very small speck of paper loss on the back. Although it is small it is still there and noticable. A 5? Although I was a little disappointed I didn't let it get me too down. Then I got a 4 that had a ton of paper loss on the back. I guess that one bothered me more because the seller described the card as having a clean front and back. The seller though was a stand up guy. When I emailed to tell him I was disappointed with the back damage after saying the back was clean in his desription. He kindly replied to the email and said"sorry I missed the paper loss". What a great guy. How could I be upset with him for innocently missing this large amount of paper loss on the back. I truely feel like if others are getting bad PSA cards like this, their value will surely go down in the future. Maybe I have just been unlucky with these two cards.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jeff Drum

Is it sloppiness or has the increased competition from other companies (SGC/GAI) particularly in the realm of pre-war caused a relaxing of standards to encourage submissions? Favored Nation Status is most likely the answer.

[Archive]

Posted By: Bill Kasel

I just received this card a few weeks ago. It was discussed on the board as possibly trimmed, but slabbed by PSA anyway. It sure looks a heck of a lot nicer than that ugly PSA 4 listed at the top of the message string.

Now that I have it, it is OBVIOUSLY trimmed. It isn't even close to the designated dimensions. Unfortunately with most slabbed purchases it is Caveat Emptor as most won't take a refund. PSA is a steaming pile of (fill in the blank). If you'd like to know how I really feel just email me.

The Wagner screw up and the Bender E95/T206 Portrait debacle only emphasize my point. They cant grade, and they cant classify.




Bill Kasel

[Archive]

Posted By: Darren J. Duet

Be aware of counterfeit graded card holders.

[Archive]

Posted By: Robert A

Bill.
I think that willis is honestly one of the biggest "trim screwup" I've seen from a grading company.
That one is obvious from first glance, and if it wasn't trimmed, it would deserve a 7. What the hell are they smoking over there?

That being said, it still is a nice looking card and needs love like its fullsized brothers.
robert a

[Archive]

Posted By: tbob

Should I be getting paranoid because I am from the South, or have a French name, or what, because I sure am not getting any favored treatment from PSA. Not only are the trimmed ones returned "trimmed" I get ones which aren't trimmed coming back "trimmed," ones that measure correctly and don't have sharp cuts.
I just don't get it...

[Archive]

Posted By: Bill Kasel

It was a huge screw up, and yes the color, registration, crispness, and back of the card are great. I promise to love this disfigured child as if it were one of my own!

Bill Kasel

[Archive]

Posted By: Josh A.

I have a silly question, so please pardon my ignorance. How do you know the Wills is trimmed? By measuring it up with another untrimmed 206? Just curious. Thanks!

Josh

[Archive]

Posted By: Robert A

Josh.
Not a stupid question at all.
Not always easy to detect trimming with t206s, but after you figure out a few ways to detect trimming, you start to recognize it more and more. If you have never thought about it, you could stare at images on ebay for a year and not know the difference.

Its always easier to detect trimming in person of course.
Some useful methods I use for t206 and other issues:
Always consider the back. Does the back show even and "normal" discoloring or "nondiscoloring" (wear..whatever you want to call it)around all of the edges, or does one edge display as brighter than the others? That edge could be trimmed.

An obvious method includes measuring, but this is not failsafe because not all t206s are the standard size. I have shorter examples that are not trimmed and bigger examples too.

Another obvious method would include looking at the borders to see how big they are. There are some exceptions such as american beauties which are narrower than other t206s, but after you have studied them for a while, you will be able to detect altered cards with narrow borders just by looking at them.

One more essential would be to inspect the borders to detect if one or more is jagged.
Also, remember that these babies are old right? They will often show even rounding on the corners. If the card is worn, but has sharp corners, it could be trimmed. Not always, but maybe.
hope this helps.
robert a

[Archive]

Posted By: Bill K@sel

Josh,

It's actually a very good question. Once I received the card I took a caliper and measured the overall height & width (short on both), I then measured the the card edge to the frame of the picture. The gap between the two at the top right corner vs. the top left is off (angle cut, that doesn't follow suit on tht bottom.) The entire left edge appears trimmed. While it is straight, the corners on top and bottom "bat ear" or flare up a bit which is a telltale sign of trimming.

It is much easier to see in person. As much as they always preach it here "Buy the card, not the grade or holder", it can't be said enough. If this wasn't in a PSA holder I never would have bid. Fool me once (happened to me before) shame on you, fool me twice (this card) shame on PSA....I mean me.....no, I do mean PSA.

Bill

[Archive]

Posted By: dan mckee

The Willis pictured is blatantly trimmed as stated. Many PSA cards are trimmed.... No I won't say it again. The card in the title is no joke, the upper left 10% of the card is a VG/EX 4.

[Archive]

Posted By: Josh A.

Thank you very much to everyone who responded for your understanding and input.

[Archive]

Posted By: Bill Kasel

Does anyone want to pay a premium for one of the most obviously overlooked trim jobs by PSA? This Willis portrait has it all! Angle cuts, Olson twin thin borders, and the blessing of the leading grading company this side of the Wisconsin/Illinois border (stupid Illini bumping off my Badgers)! I'm asking the mere sum of $250.00. I plan on holding PSA hostage for that amount at a minimum. Send me an email NOW!

Sorry Bill, I should have posted this in the B/S/T thread.

Bill Kasel

[Archive]

Posted By: Jim Clarke

Wonder if your card is the tip of the iceberg?