311 Mantle - which would you rather have?

[ClementeFanOh]

Two beautiful Mount Rushmore cards, everyone wins with these:

1) I prefer the Type 2 of these examples

2) I think the Type 1 will fetch the premium

3) Is the greater premium "appropriate"? If that means "deserved", then
the proper answer is that it's up to the competitors. We shall see.

I'd love to own the "second place" card

Trent King

[raulus]

Since the responses appear to be slowing down to a trickle, for anyone who hasn’t already figured it out on their own by digging around at the various auction sites, I guess I’ll reveal that the first example is in a PSA 7 holder, and the second is in a PSA 8 holder.

And if you want them badly enough, there’s still a few weeks left to bid in the auction.

Disclaimer: I don’t own a 311 Mantle, so this wasn’t an attempt to drive bids to my item. But they did seem so similar that it seemed like it would be good fun to see which one was favored by the group. And now we know!

[BobC]

Originally Posted by raulus

Since the responses appear to be slowing down to a trickle, for anyone who hasn’t already figured it out on their own by digging around at the various auction sites, I guess I’ll reveal that the first example is in a PSA 7 holder, and the second is in a PSA 8 holder.

And if you want them badly enough, there’s still a few weeks left to bid in the auction.

Disclaimer: I don’t own a 311 Mantle, so this wasn’t an attempt to drive bids to my item. But they did seem so similar that it seemed like it would be good fun to see which one was favored by the group. And now we know!

Interesting, I thought from the scans you posted that there might have been some more surface/printing imperfection issues with the top/#1 card, but expected the centering issues to override that. I don't send anything in for grading, and therefore don't pay attention to and keep track of which TPG is currently more centering obsessed.

For the minions in the hobby that don't follow and live by the "Buy the card and not the holder!" mantra, that means my original guess as to these Mantle's hammer prices is likely backwards. Oh well, just another reason to be glad I'm not so obsessed with grading then.

[raulus]

ICYMI, the PSA 7 sold above the estimate at $468k.

https://sports.ha.com/itm/baseball-c.../50059-56369.s

And the PSA 8 sold below the estimate at $1.47M.

https://sports.ha.com/itm/baseball-c.../50059-56370.s

[puckpaul]

Well, I am just seeing this, but the second looks way better to me and i was surprised people said they preferred the top one. I guess i am more mainstream on these, and its not a card i have been looking for (I mean as a collector it’s iconic, and i do own a 51 Bowman PSA 4 i bought in a lot and had graded), mostly because he is a Yankee and I am NOT a Yankees fan (make exceptions for Ruth and Gehrig moreso, they are even more iconic and I cant ignore them).

But the picture and color and registration on the second are just way better to my eyes. The first also has a spot of color loss on the upper right area, no? Or is that on all of them?

[BobC]

Originally Posted by raulus

ICYMI, the PSA 7 sold above the estimate at $468k.

https://sports.ha.com/itm/baseball-c.../50059-56369.s

And the PSA 8 sold below the estimate at $1.47M.

https://sports.ha.com/itm/baseball-c.../50059-56370.s

Seems to indicate this was more of a "buy the holder and not the card" situation to me. Would have expected the obvious diamond cut/print on card #2 to be a bigger factor otherwise. Both are still great cards though.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by BobC

Seems to indicate this was more of a "buy the holder and not the card" situation to me. Would have expected the obvious diamond cut/print on card #2 to be a bigger factor otherwise. Both are still great cards though.

Maybe a little bit of both? Meaning buyers were buying the holder, but also making adjustments for the fact that it was a nicer 7 and a slightly less nice 8. Maybe?

I sort of look at the fact that the PSA 8 sold for a bit less than expected, and the PSA 7 for a bit more. If they were both raw, then I agree that they would probably sell for similar prices, probably even inverted. But at the same time, the fact that the nice PSA 7 sold for more than expected is a sign that buyers aren't just buying the holder. And the opposite is probably true for the PSA 8 coming in a bit lower than expected.

But obviously the fact that the PSA 8 sold for $1M more than the PSA 7 is clear proof that buyers are first and foremost focused on the holder, and then adjust up or down based on what's inside the holder.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by raulus

Maybe a little bit of both? Meaning buyers were buying the holder, but also making adjustments for the fact that it was a nicer 7 and a slightly less nice 8. Maybe?

I sort of look at the fact that the PSA 8 sold for a bit less than expected, and the PSA 7 for a bit more. If they were both raw, then I agree that they would probably sell for similar prices, probably even inverted. But at the same time, the fact that the nice PSA 7 sold for more than expected is a sign that buyers aren't just buying the holder. And the opposite is probably true for the PSA 8 coming in a bit lower than expected.

But obviously the fact that the PSA 8 sold for $1M more than the PSA 7 is clear proof that buyers are first and foremost focused on the holder, and then adjust up or down based on what's inside the holder.

Exactly why when i guessed I did have the prices inverted. Frankly, though I'm not into grading, I'm still surprised card #2 got an 8 with that diamond cut, and off-centering, front and back. I was expecting card #1 to have the better grade with what I thought was a better overall appearance. Of course, I should know better when it comes to TPGs and how anal they can be in regard to technical grading issues. Old Judge cards are to me the poster children of one of what I feel are the obvious deficiencies of TPGs and their grading processes and standards, the failure to take the overall attractiveness/appeal of the card and image itself into consideration. Just look at the fading that naturally can occur with many OJ cards, and the grades they get. You often see some mid- or higher graded OJ cards where you can barely make out the player's image, or even the writing on the card. Meanwhile, you'll find tons of OJs graded 1s or 2s with absolutely stunning and clear images. In my mind, and I'm guessing in the minds of many other OJ collectors as well, that image for me will almost always trump going after the same card with a crappier image, but a higher technical grade.