HOF Early Baseball Era Ballots are out

[Scocs]

I thought there’s a separate Negro League committee that’s meeting in December to examine the lists last looked at in 2006. Where are the names of Dick Lundy, Oliver Marcelle, Dobie Moore, Alejandro Oms, etc on the above list?!

[jingram058]

Some VERY deserving names not on the ballet, IMO. Kind of like the Rock & Roll HOF, I have lost interest anymore. I would hope Dahlen, O'Neil, O'Doul and Reynolds finally get in, but, realistically, after some of the discussions in the not too distant past around here about who ought to be in, I won't hold my breath in anticipation.

[molenick]

Originally Posted by Scocs

I thought there’s a separate Negro League committee that’s meeting in December to examine the lists last looked at in 2006. Where are the names of Dick Lundy, Oliver Marcelle, Dobie Moore, Alejandro Oms, etc on the above list?!

I think now that the Negro Leagues are considered major leagues, there is no longer a separate committee and the candidates have been blended in with the existing era committees. If anything, this list actually leans heavily towards Negro League candidates.

There can only be 10 candidates for each committee so there are going to be many, many candidates left off of the pre-1950 committee list that many of us would have liked to see nominated. It basically covers four eras in my opinion: the pioneer era, 19th century professional leagues, the dead ball era, and the live ball era pre-integration. The next committee by time period covers only 20 years (1950-1969) but will also have 10 candidates. I think at this point anyone hoping for people like Doc Adams, Creighton, Barnes, Browning, Caruthers, Glasscock, Jim McCormick, Magee, etc. to ever get in is out of luck unless the HOF creates committees more focused on a specific era.

Not arguing about this list in particular....just that limiting it to ten for about 100 years of baseball means many worthy candidates will not be included.

[mainemule]

I am much more familiar with the Golden Era group- from the HOF's web-site:

The Golden Days Era ballot includes Dick Allen, Ken Boyer, Gil Hodges, Jim Kaat, Roger Maris, Minnie Miñoso, Danny Murtaugh, Tony Oliva, Billy Pierce and Maury Wills.

I like Boyer as a sleeper as he has both offensive and defensive metrics. Is this finally Hodges time? Minoso and Oliva seem to have similar profiles. Allen has been much talked about since his passing. Kaat is interesting as he had 250 or so wins through age 38/39 and has 16 GGs ( i know as a pitcher but that's just impressive). Don't see Maris, Murtaugh, Pierce or Wills getting in over the other names.

[John1941]

I'm not an expert on the Negro Leagues, but John Donaldson seems like he should be in. Lefty O'Doul too.

[mannybb24]

Originally Posted by Scocs

I thought there’s a separate Negro League committee that’s meeting in December to examine the lists last looked at in 2006. Where are the names of Dick Lundy, Oliver Marcelle, Dobie Moore, Alejandro Oms, etc on the above list?!

They narrowed the list down to seven this year Scott, it's a shame they will only do this every ten years, the guys you mentioned especially Lundy and Moore are definitely Hall worthy.
Out of the 10 on the ballot only 4 will make it, I'd say there's a huge push for Buck and Donaldson so you'll probably at least hear their names called on December 5th.

[Scocs]

Steve,

Yeah, that was just the sound of me vomiting.

Say what you want but IMHO Dick Lundy > Andy Cooper and the earliest he can possibly be inducted is 2032?! WTF.

Scott

[mannybb24]

I hear you Scott, quite a few guys should have been in long time ago and way before Cooper.

Good thing I don’t collect guys that only make the HOF, not to keep knocking on Cooper but nothing makes me laugh more when collectors are shelling out thousands for his cards.

[Peter_Spaeth]

O'Neil's stats, such as they are, show a .258 hitter with no power. Was he in fact better than that as a player, or is his stature more a reflection of his being a beloved figure and contributor to the game?

[wolf441]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

O'Neil's stats, such as they are, show a .258 hitter with no power. Was he in fact better than that as a player, or is his stature more a reflection of his being a beloved figure and contributor to the game?

Agreed. Buck was the first to admit that he was an average ballplayer. I think he should be in for this contributions as a scout, and especially as an ambassador for the game and as someone who brought additional recognition to the Negro Leagues. If Selig can get elected, then Buck sure as hell deserves to be in there.

[mannybb24]

Buck goes in as a contributor and the voice of Negro League baseball.
He should’ve went in back in 2006 when 17 other players and executives went in and when he was alive.

I think what the Donaldson Network, particularly the founder Peter Gorton has done for John Donaldson and his legacy is tremendous. With help from hundreds across the country they have been able to piece Donaldson’s storied career back together and bring it to the forefront.
I think this is his year to get in and rightfully so.

Dick Redding has been overlooked for years, he’s one of the best pitchers black or white of his era.

Would’ve liked to seen Dick Lundy, Dobie Moore (please don’t argue with me about how many years he played, count the wrecker years and he’s one of the best all-around players of any era) and John Beckwith make the list but I guess their time will come at a later date.

[GaryPassamonte]

The overview committee was tasked with an impossible task, since the early era category covers such a long period of time. It is ludicrous that there are not multiple era committees from this pre -1950 time frame. My worst fears have materialized with this 10 player ballot. 19th century players have been basically omitted from the ballot. Dahlen is really a 19th-20th century crossover player. I am happy that the Negro leagues/players are now considered major league. I am not happy that 7 Negro league players are on a 10 candidate ballot ( I realize Fowler was pre Negro leagues). This is not meant as a racist statement because that's not what it is. It is just historically wrong to deemphasize 19th century players. Negro league players were elected in a special election in 2006. 19th century players have never had that consideration. I just feel that the space that was held by 19th century players is being filled by Negro league players now. Again, I'm all in favor of recognizing Negro league players, but not at the expense of 19th century players. Unfortunately, interest in the players of 19th century baseball is small at this point, and there is no movement to change that. They're just not in vogue today. One final point. Leaving Doc Adams off the ballot is like leaving George Washington off a list of American presidents. And Allie Reynolds? Wow!

[perezfan]

Was really hoping to see Dummy Hoy's name on that list. Hoping O'Doul and Dahlen finally make it in.

[peanuts]

I think it's safe to say that Buck will get in this time. There's been quite a bit of steam behind his campaign for years now. Given the added focus on the Negro Leagues that's happened this past year, I think the voters will be ready to enshrine him.

Dahlen is a toss-up, but will probably get in.

Lefty O'Doul is a very likely, but still room for being passed over. It will really come down to how much the voters value his contributions to spreading the game through Japan and how much credence they give to his PCL career.