PSA completely unethical

[Mark17]

Then there's this:

I hired a handyman to come out to my house Monday. He never showed. After waiting an hour and 45 minutes he finally replied to my texts with "Sorry, had problems with my truck." I asked him if he was still coming out and as of this evening, 32 hours later, no reply.

So I hired a different handy man to meet me at the house tomorrow.

You don't like PSA, for any reason, go with someone else. Simple.

And comparing having your electricity go out to not being able to get your cardboard evaluated in a timely manner is not a good analogy. Neither would comparing waiting for PSA be a good analogy to waiting for a heart transplant.

Perspective is important: PSA evaluates cardboard and ink.

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Then there's this:

I hired a handyman to come out to my house Monday. He never showed. After waiting an hour and 45 minutes he finally replied to my texts with "Sorry, had problems with my truck." I asked him if he was still coming out and as of this evening, 32 hours later, no reply.

So I hired a different handy man to meet me at the house tomorrow.

You don't like PSA, for any reason, go with someone else. Simple.

And comparing having your electricity go out to not being able to get your cardboard evaluated in a timely manner is not a good analogy. Neither would comparing waiting for PSA be a good analogy to waiting for a heart transplant.

Perspective is important: PSA evaluates cardboard and ink.

only problem is that this handyman already has keys to your house

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Then there's this:

I hired a handyman to come out to my house Monday. He never showed. After waiting an hour and 45 minutes he finally replied to my texts with "Sorry, had problems with my truck." I asked him if he was still coming out and as of this evening, 32 hours later, no reply.

So I hired a different handy man to meet me at the house tomorrow.

You don't like PSA, for any reason, go with someone else. Simple.

And comparing having your electricity go out to not being able to get your cardboard evaluated in a timely manner is not a good analogy. Neither would comparing waiting for PSA be a good analogy to waiting for a heart transplant.

Perspective is important: PSA evaluates cardboard and ink.

we are talking about good business practice. of course its just cardboard. so you are saying that makes it ok to be deceptive.

[jkm412]

just cardboard (tell them that):

The Newport Beach, Calif.-based company expects revenues for the quarter ended Dec. 31 of $35.4 million, with a gross margin of 64% and operating income of approximately $10 million.

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Then there's this:

I hired a handyman to come out to my house Monday. He never showed. After waiting an hour and 45 minutes he finally replied to my texts with "Sorry, had problems with my truck." I asked him if he was still coming out and as of this evening, 32 hours later, no reply.

So I hired a different handy man to meet me at the house tomorrow.

You don't like PSA, for any reason, go with someone else. Simple.

And comparing having your electricity go out to not being able to get your cardboard evaluated in a timely manner is not a good analogy. Neither would comparing waiting for PSA be a good analogy to waiting for a heart transplant.

Perspective is important: PSA evaluates cardboard and ink.

As President & CEO at COLLECTORS UNIVERSE INC, Joseph J. Orlando made $1,621,754 in total compensation. Of this total $362,500 was received as a salary, $340,750 was received as a bonus, $0 was received in stock options, $918,504 was awarded as stock and $0 came from other types of compensation. This information is according to proxy statements filed for the 2020 fiscal year.

[jkm412]

perspective is important

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Then there's this:

I hired a handyman to come out to my house Monday. He never showed. After waiting an hour and 45 minutes he finally replied to my texts with "Sorry, had problems with my truck." I asked him if he was still coming out and as of this evening, 32 hours later, no reply.

So I hired a different handy man to meet me at the house tomorrow.

You don't like PSA, for any reason, go with someone else. Simple.

And comparing having your electricity go out to not being able to get your cardboard evaluated in a timely manner is not a good analogy. Neither would comparing waiting for PSA be a good analogy to waiting for a heart transplant.

Perspective is important: PSA evaluates cardboard and ink.

I would say that Joe Orlando is closer to a utility than a handyman in terms of GDP

[vthobby]

Anyone who has been around awhile always knew PSA was unethical. Fact.

Many years ago, there was a 1948 Bowman Basketball low number find in an attic in Vermont. My buddy had been sending new cards to Beckett for years so he sent the find to Beckett. I did not care because they were razor sharp pack fresh. Over a couple years, I bought most in Beckett holders and slowly broke them out and sent to PSA. EVERY card graded with PSA and was usually within a half grade. Sometimes lower, sometimes higher in the new PSA slabs.

Here's the story.....at the end I got tired of breaking them out so I sent PSA my last 4 BVG 8's. Waited patiently and they popped one day! "did not meet min grade" which I had put down as 8 since they had been very consistent. I was mad. I called PSA and had them "admin hold the cards for re-checking".

2 days later they called, told me the head grader reviewed them, and sent them back to me. I basically paid about $160 at the time for PSA to look at my cards and tell me they were not 8s and they sent them back in the Beckett 8 holders!!!! $160 for NOTHING!

I was livid, broke all 4 out and resubmitted! Yes PSA is such a genius at getting our money twice. Take a guess what all 4 cards graded out as?

BINGO. PSA 8, PSA 8, PSA 8, PSA 8

Absolutely unethical and incompetent!

I knew they were 8s. Beckett knew they were 8s....... PSA had to get 2 rounds of cash to tell me that they were 8s!

UGH!

Mike

PS I have the 6th ranked Registry Set and the 3rd highest GPA due to this find. Highest grades were 9s. I only did it for the Registry! I wish SGC still had a registry! ugh

DSCN1003 (1).jpg. 002.jpg

001.jpg. DSCN1005.jpg

[samosa4u]

Originally Posted by vtgmsc

Anyone who has been around awhile always knew PSA was unethical. Fact.

Many years ago, there was a 1948 Bowman Basketball low number find in an attic in Vermont. My buddy had been sending new cards to Beckett for years so he sent the find to Beckett. I did not care because they were razor sharp pack fresh. Over a couple years, I bought most in Beckett holders and slowly broke them out and sent to PSA. EVERY card graded with PSA and was usually within a half grade. Sometimes lower, sometimes higher in the new PSA slabs.

Here's the story.....at the end I got tired of breaking them out so I sent PSA my last 4 BVG 8's. Waited patiently and they popped one day! "did not meet min grade" which I had put down as 8 since they had been very consistent. I was mad. I called PSA and had them "admin hold the cards for re-checking".

2 days later they called, told me the head grader reviewed them, and sent them back to me. I basically paid about $160 at the time for PSA to look at my cards and tell me they were not 8s and they sent them back in the Beckett 8 holders!!!! $160 for NOTHING!

I was livid, broke all 4 out and resubmitted! Yes PSA is such a genius at getting our money twice. Take a guess what all 4 cards graded out as?

BINGO. PSA 8, PSA 8, PSA 8, PSA 8

Absolutely unethical and incompetent!

I knew they were 8s. Beckett knew they were 8s....... PSA had to get 2 rounds of cash to tell me that they were 8s!

UGH!

Mike

PS I have the 6th ranked Registry Set and the 3rd highest GPA due to this find. Highest grades were 9s. I only did it for the Registry! I wish SGC still had a registry! ugh

Attachment 469988. Attachment 469989

Attachment 469990. Attachment 469991

Nice cards!

A few months ago I decided to complete this whole set in high grade. However, I didn't care if the cards had print lines on them or if they were off-centered. I had no idea how challenging it was going to be! A lot of raw examples that I purchased online from various sellers had light creases in them. A couple were under-sized as well. And finding the high numbers in good shape is a nightmare! They're expensive and many of them are hand-cut too. Do you have any high numbers? The Mikan is the big one, but there are a lot of other stars in the high number series as well.

[vthobby]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

Nice cards!

A few months ago I decided to complete this whole set in high grade. However, I didn't care if the cards had print lines on them or if they were off-centered. I had no idea how challenging it was going to be! A lot of raw examples that I purchased online from various sellers had light creases in them. A couple were under-sized as well. And finding the high numbers in good shape is a nightmare! They're expensive and many of them are hand-cut too. Do you have any high numbers? The Mikan is the big one, but there are a lot of other stars in the high number series as well.

Thanks!~ The high numbers are tough as you know. I sought to find ones that were off the charts eye appeal and overpaid at times but I'm happy now. I am missing less than 10 high numbers. All of mine are 8s or higher. No Mikan Not sure I'll ever see that in my collection in an 8 or higher unless there is another find! Here are a few I own! The Jeanette would be a 9 if centered. Absolute sharp factory fresh corners much like most of my low numbers from the low number "find". Please note also how these almost fill the PSA gasket. Full sized and fresh! Love the colors also on the set! Thanks and congrats on your completion! What grade is your Mikan?

lf.jpg DSCN0598_original.jpg

s-l1600_original.jpg s-l1600_originala.jpg

[vthobby]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

Nice cards!

A few months ago I decided to complete this whole set in high grade. However, I didn't care if the cards had print lines on them or if they were off-centered. I had no idea how challenging it was going to be! A lot of raw examples that I purchased online from various sellers had light creases in them. A couple were under-sized as well. And finding the high numbers in good shape is a nightmare! They're expensive and many of them are hand-cut too. Do you have any high numbers? The Mikan is the big one, but there are a lot of other stars in the high number series as well.

Here are a few more of my high numbers......the Knorek is so big it would not fit in the standard 1948 holder so they put in penny sleeve and slabbed it in a regular sized holder!

Mike

001_original.jpg 48budko8_original.jpg

20921975_f_lg_original.jpg s-l1600_original.jpg

[samosa4u]

Originally Posted by vtgmsc

Here are a few more of my high numbers......the Knorek is so big it would not fit in the standard 1948 holder so they put in penny sleeve and slabbed it in a regular sized holder!

Mike

Attachment 470136 Attachment 470137

Attachment 470138 Attachment 470139

Mike,

Sweet cards!

I wanted to complete the set, but I didn't! I ran into too many problems buying them and got fed-up! I don't have the Mikan card. Finding one with strong corners is going to cost a lot, and it'll probably be trimmed too! Like you pointed out, many of these cards came out of the factory over-sized and I'm pretty sure that some high-grade examples out there went through guys like Gary Moser!

[samosa4u]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/37365748279...oAAOSwHHtg-aD2

PSA should not have graded this card. If you see any of them missing color, then they were post-factory cut. If you look at the scan, then you can see how rough the top and bottom edges are, and that's not normal. Only the left and right edges are supposed to be rough, while the top and bottom are supposed to be smooth. You really gotta' know your shit when you buy these cards or you're gonna' run into so many problems, you know what I'm saying?

[glynparson]

This doesn’t make them unethical. So tired of people
Not understanding the process so they spout stupidity. In the holder their assessment was that it was not definitely worthy of crossing so they rejected it. Common sense would tell
A rational thinking person that it’s harder to see an entire card in a holder and since they can’t put it back in the other companies holder they have to error on the side of caution and only cross if positive it will cross. This isn’t unethical but smart business. It’s not their responsibility to cover for your laziness and it’s not their fault you don’t understand the process fully. But hey it’s net 54 so a good anti PSA conspiracy sounds like par for the course.

Originally Posted by vtgmsc

Anyone who has been around awhile always knew PSA was unethical. Fact.

Many years ago, there was a 1948 Bowman Basketball low number find in an attic in Vermont. My buddy had been sending new cards to Beckett for years so he sent the find to Beckett. I did not care because they were razor sharp pack fresh. Over a couple years, I bought most in Beckett holders and slowly broke them out and sent to PSA. EVERY card graded with PSA and was usually within a half grade. Sometimes lower, sometimes higher in the new PSA slabs.

Here's the story.....at the end I got tired of breaking them out so I sent PSA my last 4 BVG 8's. Waited patiently and they popped one day! "did not meet min grade" which I had put down as 8 since they had been very consistent. I was mad. I called PSA and had them "admin hold the cards for re-checking".

2 days later they called, told me the head grader reviewed them, and sent them back to me. I basically paid about $160 at the time for PSA to look at my cards and tell me they were not 8s and they sent them back in the Beckett 8 holders!!!! $160 for NOTHING!

I was livid, broke all 4 out and resubmitted! Yes PSA is such a genius at getting our money twice. Take a guess what all 4 cards graded out as?

BINGO. PSA 8, PSA 8, PSA 8, PSA 8

Absolutely unethical and incompetent!

I knew they were 8s. Beckett knew they were 8s....... PSA had to get 2 rounds of cash to tell me that they were 8s!

UGH!

Mike

PS I have the 6th ranked Registry Set and the 3rd highest GPA due to this find. Highest grades were 9s. I only did it for the Registry! I wish SGC still had a registry! ugh

Attachment 469988. Attachment 469989

Attachment 469990. Attachment 469991

[vthobby]

Originally Posted by glynparson

This doesn’t make them unethical. So tired of people
Not understanding the process so they spout stupidity. In the holder their assessment was that it was not definitely worthy of crossing so they rejected it. Common sense would tell
A rational thinking person that it’s harder to see an entire card in a holder and since they can’t put it back in the other companies holder they have to error on the side of caution and only cross if positive it will cross. This isn’t unethical but smart business. It’s not their responsibility to cover for your laziness and it’s not their fault you don’t understand the process fully. But hey it’s net 54 so a good anti PSA conspiracy sounds like par for the course.

Glyn,

That was pretty funny. I needed that! lol

LMAO!

Mike

PS I apologize. Maybe you have never had the thrill of seeing pack fresh cards pre-1950. I have and I still own most of them. The 4 cards I sent were the last of the 1948s. Most had already graded 8s or 9s so PSA was well aware of this "find". I literally sent them in small batches because I was afraid the post office would lose them! The cards I sent in BVG holders were BLAZERS. Hellen Keller would have given them 8.5s on feel alone (sorry Helen . That was uncalled for.
I understand because you have not seen the cards. They were dripping original 1948s. Sharp corners, pristine look to them. They almost appear oversized due to so many other 1948s being slabbed when I can clearly see "alterations" on alot of them that are out there. For PSA to not slab them showed me their true colors. I knew they were going to grade as 8s raw but it was almost a litmus test. You say I was lazy for not breaking 4 cards out of holders? That really made me laugh. You have a nice day Mr. Parson.
Peace, Mike

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Then there's this:

I hired a handyman to come out to my house Monday. He never showed. After waiting an hour and 45 minutes he finally replied to my texts with "Sorry, had problems with my truck." I asked him if he was still coming out and as of this evening, 32 hours later, no reply.

So I hired a different handy man to meet me at the house tomorrow.

You don't like PSA, for any reason, go with someone else. Simple.

And comparing having your electricity go out to not being able to get your cardboard evaluated in a timely manner is not a good analogy. Neither would comparing waiting for PSA be a good analogy to waiting for a heart transplant.

Perspective is important: PSA evaluates cardboard and ink.

Mark17 or whoever you are if its just "cardboard and ink" why is it so expensive to evaluate and why should you have 64% profit margin to do such "simpleton" work as you say. these people are worthy of criticism as are we all. then again i am a "simpleton" from pittsburgh

[Leon]

Originally Posted by jkm412

Mark17 or whoever you are if its just "cardboard and ink" why is it so expensive to evaluate and why should you have 64% profit margin to do such "simpleton" work as you say. these people are worthy of criticism as are we all. then again i am a "simpleton" from pittsburgh

His name is under his id.

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by Leon

His name is under his id.

thanks Leon (peasant / forum owner)

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by jkm412

Mark17 or whoever you are if its just "cardboard and ink" why is it so expensive to evaluate and why should you have 64% profit margin to do such "simpleton" work as you say. these people are worthy of criticism as are we all. then again i am a "simpleton" from pittsburgh

I work in IT and this is a simple logical choice:

1. Do business with PSA
2. Don't do business with PSA

What so many people here do is choose #1, and then complain ad nauseam, in thread after thread after thread, about how bad and over-priced and slow PSA is. Hasn't that horse been beaten to death yet?

I collect GU jerseys but if cards were my thing, I'd be into raw, or would've switched over to Beckett or SGC long ago. If I continued to use PSA, with all the problems so thoroughly and repetitively enumerated here, I would accept the reality of the situation rather than complain as I hand them more cash.

It reminds me of the guy who bangs his head against the wall and complains that it hurts.

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by Mark17

I work in IT and this is a simple logical choice:

1. Do business with PSA
2. Don't do business with PSA

What so many people here do is choose #1, and then complain ad nauseam, in thread after thread after thread, about how bad and over-priced and slow PSA is. Hasn't that horse been beaten to death yet?

I collect GU jerseys but if cards were my thing, I'd be into raw, or would've switched over to Beckett or SGC long ago. If I continued to use PSA, with all the problems so thoroughly and repetitively enumerated here, I would accept the reality of the situation rather than complain as I hand them more cash.

It reminds me of the guy who bangs his head against the wall and complains that it hurts.

make no mistake i will never go with psa again i just have cards that are stranded there and the fact that they are claiming to do their best but offering specials to the highest bidder is disingenuous and again its just cardboard and i have little in the game but they are making millions on "cardboard"

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by jkm412

make no mistake i will never go with psa again....

And given your experience, I would make that same decision. I found a different handy man, you will find a different grading company or choose to collect raw cards. We will both be fine.

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by Mark17

And given your experience, I would make that same decision. I found a different handy man, you will find a different grading company or choose to collect raw cards. We will both be fine.

agreed although while castle fried clams at 2 am on fordham road beats burger king

[JohnP0621]

Originally Posted by jkm412

make no mistake i will never go with psa again i just have cards that are stranded there and the fact that they are claiming to do their best but offering specials to the highest bidder is disingenuous and again its just cardboard and i have little in the game but they are making millions on "cardboard"

PSA is making millions on cardboard .
So are the people that sell their High Grade PSA cards.
Have you seen the latest Auction Prices.

That is the reason why they have so many submissions.
I collect Pre War but even all of the new stuff is getting record prices.
Glad that I bought mine before the latest surge.

PS . I agree that the long wait time is not what you sign on for based on the
Submission that you agreed on and that PSA should give something back to its customers like free subs but with the success they are having I don’t see it.
Also You will have to pay a heavy price to have cards graded at the National.

John P

[iwantitiwinit]

I don't know why anyone should be surprised by this. Bottom line is you have a choice to use PSA or not it's as simple as that.

[wondo]

Originally Posted by iwantitiwinit

I don't know why anyone should be surprised by this. Bottom line is you have a choice to use PSA or not it's as simple as that.

+1

[todeen]

Originally Posted by Mark17

I work in IT and this is a simple logical choice:



1. Do business with PSA

2. Don't do business with PSA



What so many people here do is choose #1, and then complain ad nauseam, in thread after thread after thread, about how bad and over-priced and slow PSA is. Hasn't that horse been beaten to death yet?



I collect GU jerseys but if cards were my thing, I'd be into raw, or would've switched over to Beckett or SGC long ago. If I continued to use PSA, with all the problems so thoroughly and repetitively enumerated here, I would accept the reality of the situation rather than complain as I hand them more cash.



It reminds me of the guy who bangs his head against the wall and complains that it hurts.

PSA brings the highest resale prices. People who don't care about resale will choose other TPG. People who want the highest return on investment will choose PSA and complain. If someone else started a registry that could compete against PSA, that would change the market!

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[Mark17]

Originally Posted by todeen

PSA brings the highest resale prices. People who don't care about resale will choose other TPG. People who want the highest return on investment will choose PSA and complain. If someone else started a registry that could compete against PSA, that would change the market!

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Right. So if someone does their own personal cost-benefit analysis, is aware of all the PSA related problems and frustrations, and concludes the upside outweighs the downside, why complain about the downside? It's their choice to do business with them.

I really do wish someone would start a cross-TPG registry for those people who are into that. I also hope other TPGs will enter the market with quality services. Competition is good.

[egri]

Mark, I agree with you, and I'll add that of all the questionable things PSA does that throw sand in my gearbox, having longer than expected wait times at a time when they've been so busy they had to stop taking new submissions doesn't make my list.

[bobbyw8469]

If anyone can feel your pain, it is me. Not many people can say that PSA has lost one of their orders. I can. I try to give people the benefit of the doubt and will reserve judgement for how they handle my situation. Right now, it isn't looking favorable.

[jkm412]

Originally Posted by todeen

PSA brings the highest resale prices. People who don't care about resale will choose other TPG. People who want the highest return on investment will choose PSA and complain. If someone else started a registry that could compete against PSA, that would change the market!

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Tim you are clearly missing the point. PSA just needs to be clear 1. our service sucks unless you are willing to pay top dollar 2. we are shameless and will make any statement to make it appear we care about service 3. we don't care about service

that should be their mission statement

they should not be offering any services until they get through the glut of submissions that they accepted knowing full well they were not going to be able to deliver

you can argue all your dog eat dog comments you want but most people on this board just seem to enjoy this as a hobby and then you have PSA that wants to monetize every opportunity and deliver crappy service

for gods sake i collect track and field cards i must have rocks in my head

[todeen]

Originally Posted by jkm412

Tim you are clearly missing the point.....

you can argue all your dog eat dog comments you want but most people on this board just seem to enjoy this as a hobby and then you have PSA that wants to monetize every opportunity and deliver crappy service

I'm not missing the point. I don't grade my cards. I am one of those collectors who collect for the enjoyment, like you. But I'm not naive either. I started collecting during the junk wax era 30 years ago when I was six, and I've known full well since elementary school that every facet of card collecting is based on economics. Beckett monthly publication. Dead on centered, mint, gem mint, eye appeal. Hot List / Cold List. LCS. Card shows. The National. Those are all terms of dog eat dog competition. And everyone on this board recognizes that. Some of us, like you and me, just choose not to get caught up in it. But all people on this board realize that this hobby is clearly the definition of capitalism, and has been since all of us were children. Except maybe TedZ who appears to be as old as Santa Claus.

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[Leon]

I agree Tim.
And PSA isn't doing anything unethical. It's business. Are they screwing a lot of customers over, absolutely. But it doesn't matter to them, or their customers apparently, as the more people submit the more money they and PSA make. It's not rocket science. I applaud them for taking advantage of the situation and just shake my head at the comments from those that can't wait to submit and complain too.
My prediction is yet another grading company comes to fruition soon. You heard it here first.
Why wouldn't someone enter the market with the chaos and money involved?
.

Originally Posted by todeen

I'm not missing the point. I don't grade my cards. I am one of those collectors who collect for the enjoyment, like you. But I'm not naive either. I started collecting during the junk wax era 30 years ago when I was six, and I've known full well since elementary school that every facet of card collecting is based on economics. Beckett monthly publication. Dead on centered, mint, gem mint, eye appeal. Hot List / Cold List. LCS. Card shows. The National. Those are all terms of dog eat dog competition. And everyone on this board recognizes that. Some of us, like you and me, just choose not to get caught up in it. But all people on this board realize that this hobby is clearly the definition of capitalism, and has been since all of us were children. Except maybe TedZ who appears to be as old as Santa Claus.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by Mark17

...complain ad nauseam, in thread after thread after thread, about how bad and over-priced and slow PSA is. Hasn't that horse been beaten to death yet?

That horse isn't dead. Apparently, it's a Timex watch.

[packs]

I think from now on onsite grading is probably the only opportunity I'll take advantage of to get my cards graded. So, may there be more!

[jingram058]

I think I'll just keep ALL my cards as they are...raw.

You guys are a bunch of investment brokers and speculators, not card collectors in the hobby. Stop, stop pretending.