SPORTS CARD RADIO (anonymus PSA "insider")

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by perezfan

SGC terminating their autograph division was at least a response... and a stealth admission of guilt to some degree. Certainly more than Orlando/Sloan/PSA have fessed up to.

An analysis of the altered vintage cards (to come to light so far) was conducted in one of the BO threads. Among other things it concluded that to date, nearly $1.8 million worth of fakes have been sold, with the breakdown by TPA as follows...

PSA 95%
SGC 4.5%
BVG 0.5%

Nice job by those guys! They have uncovered 1.8 million of the 1 Billion out there. Good luck finding the rest.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

Nice job by those guys! They have uncovered 1.8 million of the 1 Billion out there. Good luck finding the rest.

Well BO did uncover a ton more just yesterday and today...

Some of them trimmed so thin that it's inconceivable they passed authentication. PSA seems to be hypnotized by Moser's phony rough-cut borders, to the extent that they won't even measure the cards. In most cases, the original card (typically 2 grades lower) is the FAR better looking card.

Their randomly/incorrectly assigned numerical grading has caused the current hobby to become so twisted and backwards, with lots more cardboard on the cutting-room floor.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by perezfan

Well BO did uncover a ton more just yesterday and today...

Some of them trimmed so thin that it's inconceivable they passed authentication. PSA seems to be hypnotized by Moser's phony rough-cut borders, to the extent that they won't even measure the cards. In most cases, the original card (typically 2 grades lower) is the FAR better looking card.

Their randomly/incorrectly assigned numerical grading has caused the current hobby to become so twisted and backwards, with lots more cardboard on the cutting-room floor.

You said it...

[Peter_Spaeth]

IMO the vast majority of card doctoring over the years has been on cards purchased raw, which never will be traced unless TPGs release their submission records which they never will do publicly. And even for cards purchased graded, the universe is just too big to be able to find most of them.

We literally have seen the tip of the iceberg, from an overall hobby perspective.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

IMO the vast majority of card doctoring over the years has been on cards purchased raw, which never will be traced unless TPGs release their submission records which they never will do publicly. And even for cards purchased graded, the universe is just too big to be able to find most of them.

We literally have seen the tip of the iceberg, from an overall hobby perspective.

100% agree !! TPG will never be done by computers the customer base and grading company’s want crack outs, re submissions....it’s all a gamble sometimes worth thousand to the seller and worth millions to the company. Computerized modern grading of cards will never happen imo
Will be interesting to see what happens....

[egbeachley]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

Nice job by those guys! They have uncovered 1.8 million of the 1 Billion out there. Good luck finding the rest.

That happens in a couple years when the card doctors admit that “all” their submissions over the last 10-15 years contained alterations. Then the $@.8 million becomes $180 million.

[Johnny630]

How late till the graded card market tanks? Next bad recession or will numbers be much lower this time next year in regards to this ? I’m betting on the latter.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by egbeachley

That happens in a couple years when the card doctors admit that “all” their submissions over the last 10-15 years contained alterations. Then the $@.8 million becomes $180 million.

Anybody that doesn't realize there are WAY WAY more card doctors that have not been pointed out and that they all have been submitting loads of altered cards for the last 10-20+ years are clue less.

I still wonder why so many think PSA was just doing a horrible job.

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Anybody that doesn't realize there are WAY WAY more card doctors that have not been pointed out and that they all have been submitting loads of altered cards for the last 10-20+ years are clue less.

I still wonder why so many think PSA was just doing a horrible job.

Agree you’re 100% correct

I think it’s more so people don’t care or are covering because they’re holding or pumping/selling PSA slabbed cards. To those guys All that’s cared about is money, sad but factual.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Anybody that doesn't realize there are WAY WAY more card doctors that have not been pointed out and that they all have been submitting loads of altered cards for the last 10-20+ years are clue less.

I still wonder why so many think PSA was just doing a horrible job.

The card entire industry is forever tainted...especially PSA. the most trusted name in sports cards is in on the biggest swindle America has ever seen. It's bigger than Bernie Madoff, IMHO. My friend who is a Producer at Net Flix was asking me questions about the FAKE CARDS SCAM (as he called it) at our weekly poker game. We had 600K already raised for the project in 5 minutes after they heard what kind of wool has been pulled over the sheoples eyes.

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

The card entire industry is forever tainted...especially PSA. the most trusted name in sports cards is in on the biggest swindle America has ever seen. It's bigger than Bernie Madoff, IMHO. My friend who is a Producer at Net Flix was asking me questions about the FAKE CARDS SCAM (as he called it) at our weekly poker game. We had 600K already raised for the project in 5 minutes after they heard what kind of wool has been pulled over the sheoples eyes.

The Bernie Madoff scandal was somewhere around $50 billion. Do you really think this is bigger than Madoff? I'm not so sure about that.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

The Bernie Madoff scandal was somewhere around $50 billion. Do you really think this is bigger than Madoff? I'm not so sure about that.

If Madoff wasn't a PSA fan, you may be right.

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

If Madoff wasn't a PSA fan, you may be right.

Q: Why is Bernie Madoff like a slabbed card?

A: Because they are both entombed.

[Promethius88]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

The Bernie Madoff scandal was somewhere around $50 billion. Do you really think this is bigger than Madoff? I'm not so sure about that.

Yes, I believe that HE honestly believes it. He has stated in many posts that he will never purchase a card again, the whole hobby is tainted, nobody can be trusted, etc. It's obvious he his not a collector and just comes here for the drama at this point. If you aren't collecting there really seems to be no other reason to come to this forum multiple times a day. If there was something in life that got me so worked up, I guess I would find something better to do with my time.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Promethius88

Yes, I believe that HE honestly believes it. He has stated in many posts that he will never purchase a card again, the whole hobby is tainted, nobody can be trusted, etc. It's obvious he his not a collector and just comes here for the drama at this point. If you aren't collecting there really seems to be no other reason to come to this forum multiple times a day. If there was something in life that got me so worked up, I guess I would find something better to do with my time.

Chuck has to make up for all the people saying it is a small percentage of cards that are altered. IMHO they are WAY more delusional than Chuck. Maybe he is passionate about cards and the reason he posts about the fraud constantly.

I know I am baffled beyond belief how so many are trying to minimize what is going on. I do get their reason though. I sincerely hope karma is a real thing.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

The Bernie Madoff scandal was somewhere around $50 billion. Do you really think this is bigger than Madoff? I'm not so sure about that.

you're probably right, I stand corrected. Not even in my wildest dreams do I think it's 50 Billion but, who really knows? This "musical chairs" has been going on ad nauseam for 20 years now. You would agree the magnitude is HUGE?

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

you're probably right, I stand corrected. Not even in my wildest dreams do I think it's 50 Billion but, who really knows? This "musical chairs" has been going on ad nauseam for 20 years now. You would agree the magnitude is HUGE?

Yes, I do believe the magnitude is huge. I don't think it's a matter of just a few bad cards.