Edelman

[KMayUSA6060]

I hate Edelman because he went to Can't State.

Go Zips.

[steve B]

I think a lot of it has to do with how the player approaches things when they get caught, as well as the sport.

Mostly players where they have some nearly valid excuse but accept their suspension are treated a bit better than the ones who try to make up insane stuff to get out of it.


Lance Armstrong - I didn't dope, and I'll sue you back to the stone age if you say I did. ---- Proof after his career is over, still denied it. Lifetime ban.


Alberto Contador - I tested positive for what? It must have been in the beef the fans sent. (entirely plausible, as it was clenbuterol, and at a level 400x lower than the WADA wants people tested for. ) Some appeals and delays, finally a year suspension and a few race results from 2010 and 2011 annulled in 2012. Back racing in late 2012 as part of the suspension was retroactive somehow.

[D. Bergin]

Edelman is a nice, solid little player, but when I clicked on this thread I assumed it was going to be more about how so many Pats fans and others in the media seem all of a sudden be claiming that Edelman is a future HOF'er.

Almost as if it's a foregone conclusion.

Headscratching to say the least. I understand he's been on several teams that have won Super Bowls, and has performed well in the Playoffs, but when a guy like Isaac Bruce, with twice as many catches and 3 times as many yards, while playing in a less offensive friendly era, has problems getting in. I don't understand how Edelman has a chance, even if he has several more strong years left in him.

Maybe he's the Lynn Swann of our generation, and he gets in strictly because of his postseason exploits. I don't know.

At this point, he seems like a poor mans Wes Welker.......but with rings. Welker was pretty much done after his age 32 season, which Edelman is right now.

[pokerplyr80]

Edelman isn't as flashy or physically talented as guys like Moss, Beckham, and many others. But he gets the job done when it counts the most. 3rd down, and in the playoffs. What he did in that last drive against the Saints, and yesterday winning super bowl mvp, will be remembered for a long time. I am not a Patriots fan but I think that will get him into the HOF eventually, just perhaps not in his first year or two of eligibility.

As for the issue of his ped suspension not hurting his image as much as players in other sports others in this thread mentioned one of the main reasons. He accepted his punishment graciously, apologized, and took responsibility right away.

[packs]

Edelman isn't any different from Brady. Neither player has respect for the rules or the people they play against, so much so that they'll compromise their integrity for a cheap victory; as though it means anything to win a game you cheated in.

[obcbobd]

I believe Edelman was a first time offender who was suspended for four games.

Wasn't Mejía was supended three times and banned for life.

I do agree that it's odd that people have been up in arms about PEDs in more so in baseball, but not so much in football. I would assume steroid use in football is much higher.

[Peter_Spaeth]

I can't imagine Edelman is even close to being a HOFer at this point, and I like him a lot.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

Edelman isn't any different from Brady. Neither player has respect for the rules or the people they play against, so much so that they'll compromise their integrity for a cheap victory; as though it means anything to win a game you cheated in.

Deflategate lives!!!

[packs]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Deflategate lives!!!

Isn't it believed by many that Edelman's positive test was related to his treatment from Alex Guerrero, who is also Tom Brady's personal health guru?

[pokerplyr80]

It's my understanding that basically every qb who commented on deflate gate said it wasn't a big deal, and they all adjusted the pressure to their own personal preference. Rodgers would have the balls over inflated because they were easier to grip.

It's also my understanding the nfl "investigation" turned up no evidence the balls had actually been deflated and that scientists proved the difference in pressure could have naturally occurred due to change in temperature.

[buymycards]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Edelman is a nice, solid little player, but when I clicked on this thread I assumed it was going to be more about how so many Pats fans and others in the media seem all of a sudden be claiming that Edelman is a future HOF'er.

Almost as if it's a foregone conclusion.

Headscratching to say the least. I understand he's been on several teams that have won Super Bowls, and has performed well in the Playoffs, but when a guy like Isaac Bruce, with twice as many catches and 3 times as many yards, while playing in a less offensive friendly era, has problems getting in. I don't understand how Edelman has a chance, even if he has several more strong years left in him.

Maybe he's the Lynn Swann of our generation, and he gets in strictly because of his postseason exploits. I don't know.

At this point, he seems like a poor mans Wes Welker.......but with rings. Welker was pretty much done after his age 32 season, which Edelman is right now.

He needs to stay around a long time to get the numbers for the HOF. He has 499 receptions, which puts him in a tie for 148th all time. He has 5398 receiving yards, for 248th all time. 224th in yards per game. He is a solid player, and he benefits from having Brady and Belichek heavily involving him in the game plan. But HOF? I doubt it.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by buymycards

He needs to stay around a long time to get the numbers for the HOF. He has 499 receptions, which puts him in a tie for 148th all time. He has 5398 receiving yards, for 248th all time. 224th in yards per game. He is a solid player, and he benefits from having Brady and Belichek heavily involving him in the game plan. But HOF? I doubt it.

And that's part of the puzzle. What would he do on a team where he was the primary receiver instead of in a system where someone else will get more looks if the matchup is better. How open does he get if teams aren't double teaming Gronk?

Or, on another team does he take one too many passes over the middle into big hits because everyone knows where the ball is going and instead of having a good season after recovering from a knee injury, it's a couple knee injuries and a handful of concussions and he's out of the league after 5 years?


A lot of Patriots recievers don't put up amazing numbers, but might do well on other teams. Of course Moss was horrible in Oakland playing for a team that just wasn't good.


How to rate a solid player in a system that isn't geared towards making stars? I'm not sure that's answerable as far as the HOF goes.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Moss had head case seasons, but he was supremely talented, IMO other than Rice as good as anyone to ever play that position. Not just phenomenal athletic ability, but an uncanny ability to get effortlessly to the open space. Small possession receivers like Edelman and Welker before him are doubtless valuable, but I wouldn't put them in the category of game-breaking deep threats like Moss, Isaac Bruce who was mentioned previously, etc. As Steve mentioned, they also need the right team to thrive.

[egri]

Originally Posted by steve B

A lot of Patriots recievers don't put up amazing numbers, but might do well on other teams. Of course Moss was horrible in Oakland playing for a team that just wasn't good.

Moss was a star in Minnesota before he went to Oakland. His time with the Raiders was an aberration, not his time with New England.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by egri

Moss was a star in Minnesota before he went to Oakland. His time with the Raiders was an aberration, not his time with New England.

That's true, but there was some talk that he was on his way out. Which he obviously proved wrong.


When they traded for him, I thought they should have gone for Owens instead.

I'd seen a play during the last season a Minnesota where it was very late, team needed maybe 10 yards to try a field goal. The Play wasn't to Moss, but he was supposed to draw a defender or two away from midfield. He ran the worst route ever, so bad the second defender abandoned him and headed to midfield where he broke up the play. Bad like instead of going out about 1 and cutting on a slant or going downfield, he went out about 5 at half speed and made a big curving turn to the sideline. It probably cost them the game.

Didn't see any of that here. A lot of people were mad at him for saying mid season that he wanted to stay but wouldn't be around because the team wouldn't pay him. He was right, after the seasons he'd had a big payday was on the way, and the Pats weren't going to pay it, he knew he was getting traded all along as did anyone paying attention.