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#1
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Guarantee applies only to the grade assigned to the card and does not apply to the authenticity of any autograph nor the grade assigned to any autograph; and the Guarantee does not apply to, and cannot be utilized by, the original submitter (or the original submitter’s agents, employees, affiliates or representatives) of the graded card. .
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Leon Luckey www.luckeycards.com Last edited by Leon; 11-28-2018 at 11:00 AM. |
#2
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#3
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In my next life I'm coming back as a TPG.
If you pay for 15 day service and I get it back to you in a month, who cares. Screw you. If you pay me to put a card in a holder and I do it poorly and the card is swimming around crooked, who cares. Screw you. If you pay me to authenticate an autograph and I get snooked by some dude living in his mothers' basement with a few sharpee pens, who cares. Screw you. And I have so many people lined up out the door for this wonderful service and I can barely deal with them. God bless America. |
#4
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Steve, have you ever watched the movie "Goodfellas"... reminds me of that scene with Ray Liotta telling why he wanted to be part of the "gang".... Love the post! Edited to add this link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XGAmPRxV48
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fr3d c0wl3s - always looking for OJs and other 19th century stuff. PM or email me if you have something cool you're looking to find a new home for. Last edited by Fred; 11-28-2018 at 11:18 AM. Reason: Add link |
#5
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My limited experience with TPG is that even when handed a solid explanation why something is fake, they'll stand behind their opinion.
And that's a company I like.... |
#6
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but Liotta couldn't do it without Chantix
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#7
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hahahaha
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#8
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#9
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Nobody's perfect - see the following.... I got a kick out of it, kind of felt sorry for the guy that bought the ball with the "lifetime guarantee"... http://autographplanet.com/forum/rip...time-guarantee
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fr3d c0wl3s - always looking for OJs and other 19th century stuff. PM or email me if you have something cool you're looking to find a new home for. |
#10
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#11
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I've had it happen, Larry |
#12
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Ditto, Larry. As recently as two years ago. PSA turned a spectacular Maurice Richard (hockey player, for those who don't know) 1960 Parkhurst card into a less spectacular one with a hairline crease.
![]() And while I still love the card, it was a stone cold 8 when I sent it in.
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Read my blog; it will make all your dreams come true. https://adamstevenwarshaw.substack.com/ Or not... |
#13
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Live shot of cards being graded.
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#14
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For the record, I am not a lawyer.
As far as financial responsibility, to me, it seems that the TPA should only be liable for the auction price if the AH cannot get the money back from the consignor. Even then, it seems that the AH should be liable to refund the purchasing party. They could then possibly sue the TPA for restitution as they could attempt to prove that they accepted the item for sale only based on the opinion of the TPA. Had the TPA not approved it, they would have not sold it and therefore would not have a loss. IMO, AH and TPAs should be liable for criminal charges only if you could prove they knew the item was fake and either certed the item and/or sold the item with the intent to defraud the buyer. Again, this is a non lawyer's perspective and understanding. I wonder if someone with real legal knowledge could tell me if I am correct or not. Another thought: Officially, TPAs only provide opinions, so legally it seems they would be liable for the value of that opinion. I guess what I don't know is if their advertising stating that their opinions helps to improve prices and values of item could somehow make them have additional financial responsibility because they claim it does. Not sure.
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My signed 1934 Goudey set(in progress). https://flic.kr/s/aHsjFuyogy Other interests/sets/collectibles. https://www.flickr.com/photos/96571220@N08/albums My for sale or trade photobucket album https://flic.kr/s/aHsk7c1SRL Last edited by Lordstan; 11-29-2018 at 12:13 PM. |
#15
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#16
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![]() +1 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
#17
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I would hope that the TPGs would bend over backwards to protect their service because at this time, the signature authenticator is looking pretty bad.... Drawing attention to this can only do the hobbyists good by opening their eyes to the possibility of being scammed and being vigilant in their collecting so that they are aware there are assholes out there looking to screw them over.
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fr3d c0wl3s - always looking for OJs and other 19th century stuff. PM or email me if you have something cool you're looking to find a new home for. |
#18
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Yes, this is their card guarantee. My guess is this clause applies to the 1998-present pack pulled cards that are not evaluated for autograph authenticity because they came directly from the manufacturer signed. PSA does not currently require that those autographs go through PSA/DNA in order to grade the card, since the card company is already certifying the autograph as authentic.
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-- PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head PSA: Regularly Get Cheated BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern SGC: Closed auto authentication business JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC Oh, what a difference a year makes. |
#19
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Neither one of them have any responsibility related to the original purchase price of the item PRIOR to encapsulation/authentication, though. Yes, I suspect the recent buyers will send them back to the auction houses, who in turn will need to deal with the consignors, who then in turn need to return to who they purchased from, etc etc etc. TPAs are probably only on the hook for the grading fee to whoever submitted it. |
#20
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TPG's will never be held accountable becasue they're only rendering a opinion. It's up to the buyer to respect their opinion or not. I chose for the most part not to.
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#21
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“Buy the auto, not the flip”??!!
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#22
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hahahahahaha!!
buhahahaha ![]() |
#23
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If ever there was a time for a class action lawsuit to regulate or straighten out these AH's and TPG's it might be now...
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Successful B/S/T deals with asoriano, obcbobd, x2dRich2000, eyecollectvintage, RepublicaninMass, Kwikford, Oneofthree67, jfkheat, scottglevy, whitehse, GoldenAge50s, Peter Spaeth, Northviewcats, megalimey, BenitoMcNamara, Edwolf1963, mightyq, sidepocket, darwinbulldog, jasonc, jessejames, sb1, rjackson44, bobbyw8469, quinnsryche, Carter08, philliesfan and ALBB, Buythatcard and JimmyC so far. |
#24
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Opinions are like a$$holes... everyone has one.
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Successful transactions on Net54 with balltrash, greenmonster66; Peter_Spaeth; robw1959; Stetson_1883; boxcar18; Blackie |
#25
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I've gotten money back from TPG's due to misgrade/authenticity, so to me, sending items to a TPG (and buying items that are backed by a TPG) is definitely worth it as I've been treated very fairly. Saying that, I haven't done this for a bad autograph before, so no idea what will happen here.
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#26
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If any victim is stonewalled by PSA, I know a lawyer who might be willing to sue them...he's done it before.
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Read my blog; it will make all your dreams come true. https://adamstevenwarshaw.substack.com/ Or not... |
#27
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Since the buyer bought the card with a JSA LOA originally for $20,000+, I don't think that PSA would owe that much unless the owner sold it to someone for more. Now JSA would be on the hook for the value difference between the auction sale value and the original $200 price of the unsigned card, since that's what the loss would be. Right?
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-- PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head PSA: Regularly Get Cheated BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern SGC: Closed auto authentication business JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC Oh, what a difference a year makes. |
#28
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I would think that this is a big opportunity for one of the affected AHs or TPGs to step up and work with authorities to bring the forgers to justice. It's not a long trail. And make a statement that they are credible and responsible for the wares/services they are selling and set themselves apart from the crowd. Maybe they already are and it's going on behind the scenes. Sadly, maybe not.
My feeling is that all these forgeries point back to one person or group and that there is much more than what has been uncovered so far. T206s that have not been sold via web-based means (and therefore harder to track), Goudeys, Exhibits, etc. If/when we get to the bottom of this, 'there will be blood'. Not to mention numerous pre-war cards that have been defaced.
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Working Sets: Baseball- T206 SLers - Virginia League (-1) 1952 Topps - low numbers (-1) 1953 Topps (-66) 1954 Bowman (-3) 1964 Topps Giants auto'd (-2) |
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