Magie cards

[Leon]

This statement was made almost 12 yrs ago.....not in 2009, and I honestly don't remember what the circumstances were.....but it was 12 yrs ago, things can change.

"Despite these controversies Net54 moderator Leon Luckey publicly vouched for Schwartz in 2009 calling him a “recommended seller.”



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[TexasLeaguer]

So where is the outrage towards alleged card doctor Gerry Schwartz? It sounds like he was caught red-handed, but nobody here much seems to care! Is it because he has "friends" here, or is it because Peter Nash is not credible? This seems like a big deal to me, and should be straightforward to verify or debunk.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by TexasLeaguer

So where is the outrage towards alleged card doctor Gerry Schwartz? It sounds like he was caught red-handed, but nobody here much seems to care! Is it because he has "friends" here, or is it because Peter Nash is not credible? This seems like a big deal to me, and should be straightforward to verify or debunk.

I AM outraged...but who am I(a tiny little one celled organism in this large pond of sharks) to do anything about it besides be very careful about how I spend my money on cardboard.

When it's all said and done it will likely be revealed that most major players in the hobby have "blood" on their hands...I have zero doubt!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by TexasLeaguer

So where is the outrage towards alleged card doctor Gerry Schwartz? It sounds like he was caught red-handed, but nobody here much seems to care! Is it because he has "friends" here, or is it because Peter Nash is not credible? This seems like a big deal to me, and should be straightforward to verify or debunk.

I have no idea if Nash is right or not, but to put it in larger context, shill bidding is much more of an issue around these parts than card doctoring. Possibly because the truth about card doctoring is too depressing and guys would rather do the ostrich thing.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I have no idea if Nash is right or not, but to put it in larger context, shill bidding is much more of an issue around these parts than card doctoring. Possibly because the truth about card doctoring is too depressing and guys would rather do the ostrich thing.

I think the shilling gets more attention because until recently it was easy to show who was doing it on ebay. With altered cards it is hard to prove who done it or how long ago it was done.

From personal experience board members get seriously butt hurt when you point out their altered cards.

[ullmandds]

Shilling affects most who participate in auctions...whereas the # of people who may be candidates to purchase magie error cards is tiny in comparison.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

Shilling affects most who participate in auctions...whereas the # of people who may be candidates to purchase magie error cards is tiny in comparison.

I don't see your point. Card doctoring is a pervasive problem not limited to Magie error cards.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I don't see your point. Card doctoring is a pervasive problem not limited to Magie error cards.

You are correct Peter...I suppose I was referring to this example...and that shilling appears to be more rampant than doctoring.

[glynparson]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

Shilling affects most who participate in auctions...whereas the # of people who may be candidates to purchase magie error cards is tiny in comparison.

More cards than just magie errors. I think it's funny that people still think shilling is worse. Lol I would much rather have over paid by 10-20% than nearly the entire purchase price be wasted. I do not think some have any clue how much card doctoring has happened and some of the doctors are certainly shillers as well. It's scary honestly how much some of this stuff is all interconnected. It takes a lot of shill bidding to add up to the value of the Psa 8 Wagner, some of the bad Doyle errors and magie's in holders along with other high dollar altered card. Remember most felt the 1973 topps art shell psa 10 was both shilled and altered.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by glynparson

More cards than just magie errors. I think it's funny that people still think shilling is worse. Lol I would much rather have over paid by 10-20% than nearly the entire purchase price be wasted. I do not think some have any clue how much card doctoring has happened and some of the doctors are certainly shillers as well. It's scary honestly how much some of this stuff is all interconnected. It takes a lot of shill bidding to add up to the value of the Psa 8 Wagner, some of the bad Doyle errors and magie's in holders along with other high dollar altered card.

Glyn that's the good thing about auctions that sell largely dealer inventory. You can get an altered card at a shilled price!