What set sealed Bowman's fate?

[ALR-bishop]

Did not the Bowman owners make a home run in selling out to Topps when they did at their top market value. They "sealed" it themselves with a kiss

[nolemmings]

I too think Bowman ended up just fine on the deal. And as for '54, I think the Topps design is a winner, but have always thought the kids that year could have considered the set a real dog. There were 3 managers and 23 coaches in a 250 card set!!!! A better than 1 out of 10 chance you'd get some old coot in your pack. And sure, now we know Kaline, Banks and Aaron, but at the time these guys were mere prospects that Topps was just lucky to have signed. I wonder how many of the kids saw these guys as phenoms at the time.

[the 'stache]

Originally Posted by nolemmings

I too think Bowman ended up just fine on the deal. And as for '54, I think the Topps design is a winner, but have always thought the kids that year could have considered the set a real dog. There were 3 managers and 23 coaches in a 250 card set!!!! A better than 1 out of 10 chance you'd get some old coot in your pack. And sure, now we know Kaline, Banks and Aaron, but at the time these guys were mere prospects that Topps was just lucky to have signed. I wonder how many of the kids saw these guys as phenoms at the time.

That's an interesting question, Todd. Back then, people didn't have the internet, or cable TV. Baseball fans then didn't have the exposure to up-and-coming prospects the way we do now. They didn't have access to scouting reports, nor did they know what the hell a 20 to 80 scale was. Ted Williams surely wasn't on the "radar" two years before he stepped onto the field at Fenway for the first time. Kids around America weren't watching him as a San Diego Padre, and they sure weren't watching him blast 500 foot home runs on Youtube.

I returned to the hobby two years ago. Since pretty much day one, I've known about Bryce Harper, and Mike Trout. Their baseball acumen, and raw physical tools, has been written about, and analyzed ad nauseam in Baseball America, Sports Illustrated, etc. I've been watching video of these guys doing their workouts, and taking batting practice, since they were 16 or 17 years old. So before they won the Rookie of the Year Award, I pretty much expected that they'd do it. Their performances at 19 (Harper) and Trout (20) didn't come as a surprise. If I open up a pack of cards now, I not only know who the prospects are, I know where they went to college (or what high school they went to). I know what position they play, I know their floor and ceiling, their relative risk, their injury history, etc. So, I know who the phenoms are going to be a lot of the time. Back then, the only people who really saw greatness early on were the scouts.

[nolemmings]

And one thing more--I may have ranted about this before either here or on another board. Suppose you're a young Cleveland Indians fan in 1954, your team is about to break the Yankee stranglehold of five consecutive World Series appearances in a big way, knocking off the Bombers and winning a record 111 games. Season to remember forever, and the bubblegum cards will help you relive it for all those years.

Your pitching staff includes Bob Feller, Bob Lemon, Early Wynn, Mike Garcia (19-8) and Art Houtteman (15-8), and future HOFer Hal Newhouser is in the bullpen with Ray Narleski and Don Mossi. Stud staff--and Topps gives you cards of exactly ZERO of these hurlers. None, nada, zip. The one Cleveland pitcher shown on a '54 Topps card is the world famous Dave Hoskins, who appeared in all of 14 games for the Tribe that magical year. Are you flippin kidding me? If I'm growin up in Cleveland I'd tell Topps to pi$$ on their cards--remember, no checklists, so you keep rippin those packs and coming up with.....Dave Hoskins?

I'm not an Indians fan, but a few years ago I thought about starting a '54 set. There clearly are some iconic rookie cards, two Teddie Ballgames and some cool shots of Berra, Ford, Mathews and Spahn among others. Still, for some reason I just didn't think the set deserved my attention given the lousy player selection and spate of old men, and I spurned it almost as an homage to those kids in '54 who had to endure it.

There, off my soapbox now. I know I'm a bit of a hypocrite, as I chase some prewar sets that don't always have the best player selection and for which maybe some of the same arguments could be made. Still, it seems different for the '54 Topps cards, as the preceding two years had to have built up the young collector's expectations if not hopes and Topps came out and pretty much laid an egg IMHO.

[Harliduck]

Great comments by all, and great thread.

I am three cards away from finishing my 54 Topps set, so knee deep into this at the moment. I agree, they did get lucky with Banks, Kaline, and Aaron and as a kid all the coaches and unheard of players would have been a major bummer. I do believe there was enough stars at the time (Mays, Berra, Spahn, Ford, Ashburn, Rizzuto, Jackie, ect) to keep the interest of the kids and the design by far eclipses Bowman. Advertising Ted Williams in two series was big as well. To me the 54 Topps is one of the most iconic looking sets of the back half of the century.

With that said though, and the reason I will be doing the 54 Bowmans next, is they truly whipped Topps butt with players. No doubt hands down Mantle was the most exciting player of the time so right there enough said. The Indians team players comment was something I hadn't really thought of and have to admit that is spot on for who was hot in 54...if I was an Indians fan I would have felt completely gypped. While i think the Bowmans are truly a beautiful set in their own right, they are smaller and the pictures do not compete. Neither had checklists so that alone was a killer. Does anyone know who Bowman advertised on their wax boxes to entice the kids? I know Topps was all over advertising their rights to Williams. I think that was about the only way a kid could pre determine who had what before they actually spent their money.

As a 54 collector, I am choosing to do both sets to feel like I am completely covering the year. Did the 54 Topps put a nail in Bowmans coffin? I believe history says yes, but as mentioned, they sold at a high to their competition so who really won? I can add this too...as an 11 year old kid when Fleer and Donruss came into the picture in 1981, it was exciting to go into my corner store and have all three on the shelf. I LOVED it. I collected all three and traded off buying packs and hand coalated all three sets in 81, but admit back in then I still would have chose Topps over the others if had to. I have always thought if I was a kid in 54 I would have bought both, and loved trying to get my favorite player in two different cards. I think I would have been dissapointed in 56 to learn I no longer had a choice...that's just my guess coming from my 11 year old experience.

[Paul S]

In an effort not to replicate many of the astute comments above and focusing on the vibrancy of the card sets, unless a person went to a game, they were otherwise relegated to seeing players in black and white -- whether the occasional game on TV or in newpapers. I still can't choose between the '55T or B sets because the T still pops out with color and the television B was such a great idea (who had a color TV back then?). Personally, although I have alot of 54Bs and enjoy them for the player selection, I find it a drab set, especially compared to the 54Ts. Regardless of quality players in the repsective sets, the Topps, being so colorful, must of had an impact on the buyer. I think Bowman dropped the ball that year -- maybe they were still making up the cost of their gorgeous color 53s (the last series B&W being a tell-tale sign).

[Brianruns10]

Yeah, the 54 Bowman is the weakest Bowman set...it looks like a weak carbon copy of the 52 Topps, and sort of represents a creative hesitation on their part. If they'd stuck with perfecting the full color process they tried in '53, they could've been years ahead of Topps and their '57 set.

Though they made an admirable recovery with the 55 set, and I would've loved to have seen their 56 set, with it's fence-hole concept, come to fruition. It was certainly more intriguing that Topps' 56 carbon copy of their own '55s.

[Volod]

[quote=nolemmings;1109367]And one thing more--I may have ranted about this before either here or on another board. Suppose you're a young Cleveland Indians fan in 1954, your team is about to break the Yankee stranglehold of five consecutive World Series appearances in a big way, knocking off the Bombers and winning a record 111 games. Season to remember forever, and the bubblegum cards will help you relive it for all those years.

Your pitching staff includes Bob Feller, Bob Lemon, Early Wynn, Mike Garcia (19-8) and Art Houtteman (15-8), and future HOFer Hal Newhouser is in the bullpen with Ray Narleski and Don Mossi. Stud staff--and Topps gives you cards of exactly ZERO of these hurlers. None, nada, zip. The one Cleveland pitcher shown on a '54 Topps card is the world famous Dave Hoskins, who appeared in all of 14 games for the Tribe that magical year. Are you flippin kidding me? If I'm growin up in Cleveland I'd tell Topps to pi$$ on their cards--remember, no checklists, so you keep rippin those packs and coming up with.....Dave Hoskins?

I'm not an Indians fan, but a few years ago I thought about starting a '54 set. There clearly are some iconic rookie cards, two Teddie Ballgames and some cool shots of Berra, Ford, Mathews and Spahn among others. Still, for some reason I just didn't think the set deserved my attention given the lousy player selection and spate of old men, and I spurned it almost as an homage to those kids in '54 who had to endure it. quote]

Todd - Well, after all, Topps was and is located in NY, so no huge surprise that the good folks in that company did not appreciate the Cleveland Indians trying to stop their heroes from owning every title in sight. Kind of ugly, though, to let childish rooting bias govern their publishing judgement - did they feel that the nickels of kids in the midwest were not as important to their profit picture as their institutional grudge against the infidels? I wish I could say that as a kid, I boycotted Topps for giving short shrift to the Tribe, but at the age of seven or eight, I had no clue why the great Indian hurlers were left out of the 1954 Topps set. Not that I bought much of it - had moved on to building model airplanes after '53.

[toppcat]

There were two categories of players established once the Topps and Bowman suits started being decided: exclusive players and non-exclusive. I forget the year without checking my notes (1954 I think) but at one point Bowman had hundred of exclusive players compared to a few dozen for Topps with a handful, mostly stars, having non-exclusive deals. So Topps started signing prospects and using coaches and managers to round out their sets. It was unrelated to where each company was domiciled.

I have a section on all of this in my new book: http://www.scribd.com/doc/126643197/...m-1938-to-1956

It's a free download so no worries!

[Volod]

Originally Posted by toppcat

There were two categories of players established once the Topps and Bowman suits started being decided: exclusive players and non-exclusive. I forget the year without checking my notes (1954 I think) but at one point Bowman had hundred of exclusive players compared to a few dozen for Topps with a handful, mostly stars, having non-exclusive deals. So Topps started signing prospects and using coaches and managers to round out their sets. It was unrelated to where each company was domiciled.

I have a section on all of this in my new book: http://www.scribd.com/doc/126643197/...m-1938-to-1956

It's a free download so no worries!

Thanks again Dave. According to the year-by-year account provided in your excellent history, 1953 was the year that Topps really struggled to sign players to exclusive deals: just 26 to Bowman's 388. You state that the next year, 1954, things had almost evened out, with Topps holding 124 exclusives to Bowman's 136.
I suppose that the Cleveland pitchers might have had exclusive contracts with Bowman after 1953, as all but Lemon appeared in Topps' '53 set, but none of them in the '54 or '55 sets, and all reappeared in the Topps '56 set. If it were possible, it would certainly be interesting to compare which players the two gum pushers targeted for exclusive deals in those years.