1 pitch velocity
2 contemporaries
1. OK... we aren't going to know, we will argue with our biases and perceptions. I think Walter Johnson and Smokey Joe Wood could pitch in the 90s. I think Matty could pitch in the 90s, IF he chose to do so. (I think he pitched to win games, not to dominate hitters.) I also think that they could pitch today and shut down modern hitters who do have some success against modern pitchers who are throwing in the high 90s. I think that Padres pitcher, Randy Jones, could shut down some modern hitters with that stuff he threw in the low 80s, unhittable stuff. Pitch velocity in not the sole indicator of pitching success. Among other factors, the ability to deceptively change speeds, is something that can make a difference.
2. More importantly, Johnson and Mathewson weren't exactly contemporaries. But there was some overlap. Matty was 7 years older and died 21 years earlier than Johnson. But think about the league they pitched against. Matty started pitching in 1900, pitching with his arm and his brain, 1914 was his last significantly effective season. Walter's first effective season was 1910, and his last 20 win season was 1925.
Ten years doesn't seem like much... but golly, what happened to the game during that time? In 1900 the balls stay in the game forever, foul balls being retrieved out of stands, brown with dirt and tobacco stains, soft... but midway into Walter's career he's throwing better baseballs, lively baseballs, but now against batters that are using slightly shorter bats with bigger diameter barrels and thinner handles. Bat physics changed drastically. The bats Babe Ruth used as a Yankee slugger would occasionally break. The bats Hans Wagner used would last a season or two. Most of Matty's games were pitched with the turn of the century. Walter's pitching is primarily with the lively clean baseballs and "slugger" bats. Walter pitched in over 100 more games.
From our perspective, without being a student of baseball history, it is easy for us to think of Walter and Matty as spot on contemporaries; after all, both are in T206 and Cracker Jacks. But they aren't.
Hmmm... who can throw heat now? I don't know, pick half a dozen of them. Put them on trains, crap lodging and diets, less adequate health care, no air conditioning, and then see how well they pitch.
I don't think any of us could now hit any of those guys. I think Walter had the better fast ball. I think they both coasted through their games at times, bearing down when necessary (something that would not be tolerated in this time of distinguishing pitches as either competitive or non-competitive). Walter and Matty pitched so as to start and finish the game. That was expected, 115 years ago. Nowadays, you seldom need a second hand to count a pitcher's complete games in a season with your fingers.
Who here associates something with the number 1.12? If that doesn't, how about 1.12 ERA??? Now you're thinking Bob Gibson's 1968 season. I'm a Cardinals fan, and saw Gibson pitch several times, including game 7 of the 1964 World Series. As much of a fan as I am of Mr. Gibson, I'm aware that Walter's 1913 ERA of 1.14 would have been less than Bob Gibson's, IF he had been throwing his best stuff at the end of the 1913 season. The Athletics had clenched the pennant in 1913, Walter pitched in a game where he grooved a few pitches for some of his friends, on the opposing team, the game was a light-hearted affair for both teams, I think a coach or two may have gotten an at bat. It could have been the last game of the season, Washington won, about everyone pitched, Walter gave up 2 runs recording 0 outs in a late inning. You can read about it in "Baseball's Big Train," by Henry Thomas, a gentleman who knows a right smart about baseball. A singularly knowledgeable baseball scholar. If you haven't acquired a copy of that book and read it, you should stop reading this and order a copy of that book. Back to Bob Gibson, what he did on the mound in 1968 was powerful. But he'd have fallen a point or two short of surpassing what Walter did in 1913, IF Walter had either been competitive, or simply stayed out of that game that was a fun time for the players.
If you think Walter could only muscle up to about 90, fine. I think he could throw significantly harder, approaching 100, if he wanted. But for not wanting to hit anyone with a pitch, I'd think he could put a 90 mph fastball in your ribs, and then put a 100 mph pitch in your side, a rib or two lower, and then you could tell us which one felt faster.
Last edited by FrankWakefield; 02-26-2024 at 09:42 PM.
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02-26-2024, 09:30 PM
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