1952 Star Cal Complete Set Value

[rand1com]

Ideas on value of a 1952 Star Cal Complete Type 1 and Type 2 Set in VG/EX condition?

I'm not sure if any complete sets have ever changed hands.

I know there are VCP values for the star cards but about half of the cards in the set have no graded examples that have changed hands.

Thanks

[raulus]

You mentioned the condition, but my experience is that often condition isn't a big factor for these pieces, simply because there's so few of them, and most of them aren't in top shape. It doesn't help that PSA grades them all as Authentic if they're still in the envelope, which tends to further reduce the condition as a serious factor, unless they're really severely thrashed, to the point where the buyer pool will be reduced dramatically.

Obviously it's not that hard to ballpark the stars who have changed hands, and sort of get to an estimated value for those pieces.

When you get to the pieces that have never changed hands, there's two approaches you can take:

1) Assume that they've never changed hands for a reason, because demand for these is almost certainly really thin on the commons, which means that it could be challenging to find a buyer at any price when you go to sell yourself. Although sometimes you get lucky with finding the one buyer who desperately needs just that common and is willing and able to pay handsomely for it, simply because he's not going to find it anywhere else. My experience is that this is unlikely, often because people who collect those players aren't used to paying top dollar, and there often aren't many of them, so they know that they can usually dictate their price.

2) Attempt to interpolate a value for the commons. Some people look at a % of the star card value, often based on a relative % from nearby baseline sets. Certainly this is one way to go, although I would honestly be worried about such an approach overvaluing the commons, simply because there will be even fewer collectors jonesing for the commons from such an obscure set, compared to the buyer population for the baseline set, particularly because these are from the early 50s, and the nearby baseline sets are all heavily collected (including the commons), whereas this set is not.

My guess is that these two approaches should give you a good range, although it might be a little wide, which is a nice starting point to think about value. Then it's just a question of finding a point where you and the seller can agree, which might be within the range, or might not.

[rand1com]

Thanks for the input.

[nat]

Some results for type 1 sets (or near sets) that might be relevant (I didn't see any type 2 sets):

https://collectrea.com/archives/2018...mickey-mantle/

https://bid.robertedwardauctions.com...?itemid=175748

[raulus]

Originally Posted by nat

Some results for type 1 sets (or near sets) that might be relevant (I didn't see any type 2 sets):

https://collectrea.com/archives/2018...mickey-mantle/

https://bid.robertedwardauctions.com...?itemid=175748

That 2018 auction price at $42k seems incredibly strong. Makes me wonder if a couple of bidders decided they couldn’t live without it. The 67/70 set at $5.4k seems like it’s more in line with what I would expect at auction, and it’s not like it’s missing a crazy expensive HOF player. Maybe add $2-3k to pick up the missing cards and you’ll have a complete set.

[Lucas00]

Some of the type 2s are incredibly rare. I believe a few go for more than some big hofers in the set.

Because none have been shared yet.. my type 2 for my Red collection took about 4 years to find. No envelope, but I can always buy a cheap player and just swap them. But I kind of like being able to see the back, I'm sure many collectors never have.

PSA 1 is of course laughable, but what can you expect.

[raulus]

My personal favorite, although I think it’s a Type 3?

[hcv123]

I believe this one is considered the hardest to get of the type 2's! Available if anyone is interested.

[Lucas00]

Originally Posted by raulus

My personal favorite, although I think it’s a Type 3?

Type 3s are so rare I think they were probably used for advertising at point of purchase, or something similar.

[rand1com]

Originally Posted by nat

Some results for type 1 sets (or near sets) that might be relevant (I didn't see any type 2 sets):

https://collectrea.com/archives/2018...mickey-mantle/

https://bid.robertedwardauctions.com...?itemid=175748

Yes, I was aware of the $42K Type 1 set but cannot use that for a barometer. Two rich collectors battling to the end and winner way overpaying. VCP average for all cards that traded hands in both types was about $17K with 48 examples (mostly commons)with no sales. It is a rare set but determining value is relatively difficult especially since PSA grades the ones in envelopes A.

Thanks for all replies.

[raulus]

Interesting VCP data.

For better or worse, with rare stuff like this, the price is whatever a seller is willing to let it go for, assuming they can find a buyer willing to pay that much.

And often the market doesn't clear for a long time, simply because the seller wants more than interested buyers are willing to pay at present, at least until the right person comes along. And unless the seller is motivated to sell, there's often no pressure for them to be willing to compromise on price, so it goes back into the sock drawer.

If you're looking to buy stuff like this, then often your options are to be willing to overpay, or else plan for a really long road to pick it up, which could stretch for decades. But then again, maybe you'll get lucky and pick up a 67/70 set at auction for $5.4k! Assuming it doesn't go for $42k, that is...

[UKCardGuy]

Originally Posted by raulus

Interesting VCP data.

For better or worse, with rare stuff like this, the price is whatever a seller is willing to let it go for, assuming they can find a buyer willing to pay that much.

And often the market doesn't clear for a long time, simply because either the seller wants more than interested buyers are willing to pay at present, at least until the right person comes along. And unless the seller is motivated to sell, there's often no pressure for them to be willing to compromise on price, so it goes back into the sock drawer.

If you're looking to buy stuff like this, then often your options are to be willing to overpay, or else plan for a really long road to pick it up, which could stretch for decades. But then again, maybe you'll get lucky and pick up a 67/70 set at auction for $5.4k! Assuming it doesn't go for $42k, that is...

Part of the reason why the VCP data is incomplete is because there are a number of very tough short prints that are so rare they don't come up often.

• For the Type 1's: Dick Gernert, Jim Busby, Sam Mele, Bobby Shantz, Richie Ashburn, Curt Simmons, Warren Hacker, Gerry Staley and Wally Westlake are all tough short prints.

• For the Type 2s, Zarilla/Busby and Richie Ashburn are the toughies.

Those short prints bring up the set price quite a bit. Then there's the stars. Mantle, Mays, Williams, Robinson attract premium prices. Mantles will easily bring $5000+. Mays $1500+, Robinson $1500 and Williams $750+

In my experience condition does matter on Star-Cals. Many decals suffer from parts that have rubbed off or purple stains. A Star-Cal in a pristine envelope, that moves freely in the envelope and with no visible defects (creases, stains, scratches, etc) will attract the highest price.

That 67/70 set for $5.4K includes a Mantle that was cut in half and it was missing the Mays and Robinson Type 1s. 8 of the collection were missing their envelopes and a number of the decals had condition issues. If I adjust the price for a Mantle was intact and adding the Mays and Robinson decals, the price might have been $6K higher. Add another $500+ for the missing envelopes and some adjustment for the lower grade decals and you can easily get to $13,000. I still think that was a really good buy for whoever picked that up.

By my calcs, the full Type 1 set in EXMT condition with envelopes would cost $20K+ to assemble.

I reckon the full Type 2 set in excellent condition with envelopes would cost between $8K to $9K to assemble.

I'd hazard a guess that in VGEX condition, that might be $15K for the Type 1s and $6K for the Type 2s.

As others have mentioned, you can assemble it for less money if you willing to put in the time and wait over a number of years. But the advantage of buying a set is that you don't have to do all that work.

[rand1com]

Interesting information.

Still wondering how that raw Type 1 set in 2018 brought $42K when REA had the high estimate at that time at $2500. I suspect the underbidder is happy he lost!!

[raulus]

Originally Posted by rand1com

Interesting information.

Still wondering how that raw Type 1 set in 2018 brought $42K when REA had the high estimate at that time at $2500. I suspect the underbidder is happy he lost!!

Could be. Although he might wish he had the full set.

Usually my go-to assumption is that you’ve got some Mantle collectors who were willing to go nuts just to get their man. But that might just be a lazy assumption, and we’ll probably never know unless the bidders come on here and share why they bid so much.

[REG1976]

It's only value/worth is what a collector will be willing to pay for that at the time of purchase, whether it be higher or lower of past sales