1991 Topps Mark Whiten

[deweyinthehall]

Any known issues with counterfeiting this error card? Any tell-tale signs in the portion of the hand extending over the border? Interested in obtaining this card for the first time, and want to be cautious. Thanks!

[sbfinley]

I've never seen it counterfeited, but I have seen corrected versions marked up with ink to look like a hand over border error. They are obvious just from scans however.

[jacksoncoupage]

No counterfeits for this card. While it is nearly impossible to pull, even when you know what packaging type, it isn’t that scarce as usually a few are on eBay at any given time. Hence the drastic price fluctuation.

[ALR-bishop]

One of the more interesting variations in a set with a boatload of them

[Bigdaddy]

Just reading his name makes my blood boil. He hit four dingers (with 12 RBI) in a game against my Reds and he is not forgiven.

[slidekellyslide]

I'm just starting to get back into modern cards after I stopped buying new cards around 1990..I had no idea this card even existed.

[swarmee]

One of a small handful of rare variations in the 1991 Topps set, along with the Chris Hoiles wrong border color and the Oil Can Boyd full flag/ribbon.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by swarmee

One of a small handful of rare variations in the 1991 Topps set, along with the Chris Hoiles wrong border color and the Oil Can Boyd full flag/ribbon.

You guys are going to make me start sorting boxes of "junk" cards instead of not giving them even a glance like I have been doing for the past 30 years.

[slidekellyslide]

Well, that was easy. Sorted through a box of about 2500 1991s and found it right away.

[swarmee]

Nice. Hiding all these years.

[hockeyhockey]

i have a couple of them, willing to sell 1. PM if interested.

[jacksoncoupage]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

You guys are going to make me start sorting boxes of "junk" cards instead of not giving them even a glance like I have been doing for the past 30 years.

Even the Hoiles and Drabek are fairly common now. It used to be a while between listings and now you can nab one for $20-30. Same for Boyd but the rare version doesn’t come up as frequently, just can be had cheaply these days.

There are much scarcer true variations in 1991 Topps than those but until the general hobby/collector picks up on them, they won’t sell for much of/when they ever get listed.

[slidekellyslide]

FWIW this same batch of cards that yielded the Whiten card did not have a Hoiles or Drabek white line error. Just two of the corrected versions of each.

[jacksoncoupage]

As of 9/15/2020 there are currently fifteen (15!) copies of this card available on eBay. Including a nine (9!) card lot of them. The card is a difficult pull today (from only one packaging type) but they are out there in boxes/collections/sets.

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by jacksoncoupage

As of 9/15/2020 there are currently fifteen (15!) copies of this card available on eBay. Including a nine (9!) card lot of them. The card is a difficult pull today (from only one packaging type) but they are out there in boxes/collections/sets.

what type of packaging do you find them in - just cello? the 99 cent cello or rack packs?
i got a few whiten cards off a guy i know. been crushing wax packs of these for a while, think i should
change gears.

[slidekellyslide]

I think there are probably tons of them out there but people just don’t know about the variation. I mean I had one so it has to be easy to find.

[jacksoncoupage]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

I think there are probably tons of them out there but people just don’t know about the variation. I mean I had one so it has to be easy to find.

I had probably sorted through 100 or so 3200/5000 ct boxes, opened boxes, factory and hand collated sets over a span of 5 years before I saw a copy.

Then I started focusing on specific packaging types. 100s if boxes later, still not a copy.

Finally in a random box at Goodwill, found my first copy. From there, I started again on unopened. Found one copy. Since then I will occasionally buy the type they come from but have yet to pull another. Only found additional copies in misc lots/commons boxes.

I think the opposite is true. The card is a tough variation, say on a scale of 1-10 for 1991 Topps but for the last 5-7 years, they are very well known as decent sellers and they get tossed on eBay frequently. Eventually they will dry up again.

[slidekellyslide]

Good to know. Usually if I find it I doubt it’s rarity. I would love to know more about why they changed this card in the first place considering so many of the 91s have photos going over the borders.

[jacksoncoupage]

Good question. And they corrected it twice. The black line can be found over or “under” his hand where it meets the border.

[ALR-bishop]

On some of my copies, the uniform, particularly his sleeve, is clearly blue and on others seems purple

[jacksoncoupage]

Ink variance. Almost all cards in that set showing blue uniforms (Jeff Kunkel, Luis Sojo, for examples) can be found in heavy purple versions too. Seemed to really hit the blue jays and royals players.

The purple sleeve on whiten also reveals a fake desert shield card since all DS were one print run.

[vintagebaseballcardguy]

I had NO idea that this card even existed or the other variations for that matter. Like someone else mentioned, I collected during this time but had largely stopped buying cards of my era around the time this set came out. Now, nearly 30 years later, I feel like I could get sucked back in!

[hockeyhockey]

i found another whiten error this morning in a rack pack. it was like christmas morning.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

i found another whiten error this morning in a rack pack. it was like christmas morning.

Too bad it wasn't showing on an unopened rack pack.

Cool error card but prices are way too high for me with the amount available.

[HRBAKER]

This post moved me to check my 1991 Topps commons.

[swarmee]

Check out your Oil Can Boyds and Chris Hoiles cards while you're there.

As a fun experiment, I actually bought about 100 copies of each card on Sportlots (paid shipping to the SL box) just to see whether or not these sight unseen cards in their stock might be the variations and they just don't realize it. Figure for a couple hundred bucks in cards and shipping costs, it would be worth it as a test. If I pop a couple of error/variations, then I add more of them from the same group of sellers.

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Too bad it wasn't showing on an unopened rack pack.

Cool error card but prices are way too high for me with the amount available.

how much you think someone would pay for an unopened rack pack with the error showing?

i actually had one with whiten showing on the back - knew it was possible it might be the error card, since i've already found a bunch. but you never know.

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Check out your Oil Can Boyds and Chris Hoiles cards while you're there.

As a fun experiment, I actually bought about 100 copies of each card on Sportlots (paid shipping to the SL box) just to see whether or not these sight unseen cards in their stock might be the variations and they just don't realize it. Figure for a couple hundred bucks in cards and shipping costs, it would be worth it as a test. If I pop a couple of error/variations, then I add more of them from the same group of sellers.

pretty sharp idea. do you have pics of the boyd variations? i still can't figure out the difference. found 3-4 of them in the past week, but they all look the same to me.

[jacksoncoupage]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

pretty sharp idea. do you have pics of the boyd variations? i still can't figure out the difference. found 3-4 of them in the past week, but they all look the same to me.

You can find a comparison image of them on my site junkwaxgems

Plenty of other images online too if you image search “1991 Boyd banner error” or some variations of that.

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by jacksoncoupage

You can find a comparison image of them on my site junkwaxgems

Plenty of other images online too if you image search “1991 Boyd banner error” or some variations of that.

thanks. can you link me to your site where that is located? i looked around but just wound up in circles for a little while.

[jp1216]

That took 10 seconds to find and link

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by jp1216

That took 10 seconds to find and link

thank you, sir! i'm old and suck at the computer stuff.

which one is the hardest to find?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

thank you, sir! i'm old and suck at the computer stuff.

which one is the hardest to find?

The black tipped one.

[hockeyhockey]

i finished opening all of my 1991 packs today. my final count is 3 whiten error cards. i found ZERO whiten regular cards, which was surprising since i had wax, big cello, and rack packs. probably upwards of 150 packs. i guess it is a really hard card to find in packs, error or otherwise.

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Check out your Oil Can Boyds and Chris Hoiles cards while you're there.

As a fun experiment, I actually bought about 100 copies of each card on Sportlots (paid shipping to the SL box) just to see whether or not these sight unseen cards in their stock might be the variations and they just don't realize it. Figure for a couple hundred bucks in cards and shipping costs, it would be worth it as a test. If I pop a couple of error/variations, then I add more of them from the same group of sellers.

how did that experiment go for you?

i finally pulled a non-error whiten this week, found 2 of them. one blue jersey color, one purple. still have lots of racks left.

[swarmee]

In a couple of groups, I bought approx 40 each of Oil Can, Whiten, Hoiles, 1990 John Morris, and two Topps Heritage cards with hard to see intentional errors. Out of the 300 I looked through, none were the valuable error cards. There were some of the purple and blue jersey of Whiten, and two of the common Oil Can Boyd variations.
I did only select sellers who had multiples of the cards I was looking for at the same time, and did discounted box shipping costs to make it at least reasonable for the treasure hunt. At the same time, I found about 10 cards listed around $10 each on Sportlots that I also purchased which I should be able to flip with a profit that will cover buying the other 300 cards.
Those larger dealers are probably the ones that are more likely to either have already found the errors *or* realized that I was purchasing cards for the chance at a variation and may have screened them before they mailed them to me. I also didn't buy any from the sellers that had over 8 of each card, figuring they would have also done what I was trying to do in the first place.

TLDR: It was fun once, but I probably won't do it again.

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by swarmee

In a couple of groups, I bought approx 40 each of Oil Can, Whiten, Hoiles, 1990 John Morris, and two Topps Heritage cards with hard to see intentional errors. Out of the 300 I looked through, none were the valuable error cards. There were some of the purple and blue jersey of Whiten, and two of the common Oil Can Boyd variations.
I did only select sellers who had multiples of the cards I was looking for at the same time, and did discounted box shipping costs to make it at least reasonable for the treasure hunt. At the same time, I found about 10 cards listed around $10 each on Sportlots that I also purchased which I should be able to flip with a profit that will cover buying the other 300 cards.
Those larger dealers are probably the ones that are more likely to either have already found the errors *or* realized that I was purchasing cards for the chance at a variation and may have screened them before they mailed them to me. I also didn't buy any from the sellers that had over 8 of each card, figuring they would have also done what I was trying to do in the first place.

TLDR: It was fun once, but I probably won't do it again.

gotta love the hustle. sounds like a fun time.