My national find--M116 Bates (Cincinnati)

[obcmac]

Was thrilled to find this beat up rarity at the National!

Mac

[ullmandds]

WOW! Congrats!

[Jobu]

Holy crap --- nice one Mac!

[caramelcard]

Very nice Mac. Probably only a handful of those if that.

Congrats.

[Tim Kindler]

Mac,
Congrats. Couldn't have happened to nicer guy. But please educate me and others on what makes this m116 so special. I am ignorant when it comes to certain issues, but always willing and anxious to learn something new.
Best wishes,
Tim Kindler

[RedsFan1941]

As a Reds collector I must say bravo!!!!!!!!!!!

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Originally Posted by Tim Kindler

Mac,

Congrats. Couldn't have happened to nicer guy. But please educate me and others on what makes this m116 so special. I am ignorant when it comes to certain issues, but always willing and anxious to learn something new.

Best wishes,

Tim Kindler

+1

[obcmac]

Originally Posted by Tim Kindler

Mac,
Congrats. Couldn't have happened to nicer guy. But please educate me and others on what makes this m116 so special. I am ignorant when it comes to certain issues, but always willing and anxious to learn something new.
Best wishes,
Tim Kindler

I'm fairly new to the set myself...so I rely on the great info by Tim N and info from Andy C. as well. Basically an extraordinarily rare late series team name variation. This particular variation was discovered about 10 years ago...and not sure if any have been discovered since then.

[Tim Kindler]

Wow! Then this is a super rare find. Thanks for sharing the pic and educating us with the information. I'll have to look into this and other late team variations in the set.
Best wishes,
Tim

[Jobu]

Here is the background of the card, courtesy of Lew Lipset who sold the first known copy:

http://www.oldjudge.com/archive/2006.../headliners/5/

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Originally Posted by Tim Kindler

Wow! Then this is a super rare find. Thanks for sharing the pic and educating us with the information. I'll have to look into this and other late team variations in the set.

Best wishes,

Tim

+1, again. Thanks Tim for saving me time on asking the same question and thanking! LOL

[brass_rat]

Congrats, Mac! That surely took some educated digging!

[slidekellyslide]

Wowza!!! Congrats!

[JustinD]

Amazing find.

I have to ask, did the dealer know what he had or was this a case of educated buyer finding an treasure?

Is this the classic 100 dollar card in the dollar box story multiplied by a 1000?

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by JustinD

Amazing find.



I have to ask, did the dealer know what he had or was this a case of educated buyer finding an treasure?



Is this the classic 100 dollar card in the dollar box story multiplied by a 1000?

I'm curious as well - did he know?

This is definitely the find of the show.

[obcmac]

Originally Posted by JustinD

Amazing find.

I have to ask, did the dealer know what he had or was this a case of educated buyer finding an treasure?

Is this the classic 100 dollar card in the dollar box story multiplied by a 1000?

Priced as a regular beat-up m116.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by obcmac

Priced as a regular beat-up m116.

haha...that IS AWESOME!!!!!! So you paid like a few bucks!!!!! I love it! Great find!

Like finding a doyle error T206 in a bargain box..but 2-3 times more rare...and unfortunately a bit less valuable!!!!

[JustinD]

Originally Posted by obcmac

Priced as a regular beat-up m116.

That makes the story a hundred times better!

[Northviewcats]

Congratulations. Great eye.

[Exhibitman]

That's why I love picking at a big show. You never know...

Congrats!

[brianp-beme]

Congrats Mac...the M116 set seems to be an especially good one to make these type of finds, as they are not too heavily collected. It also helps that there are variations that are not widely known and are extremely rare. A couple of years ago I came across one completely by accident, not at a show, but on ebay. No one noticed the previously undiscovered team variation on the Smith card...not even me until later.

Sounds like you were on top of this one though...congrats again.

Brian

[unamuzd1]

"Hey Bert - what's that sound?"

"Ernie, my friend, that's the sound of 320 people simultaneously setting an alert for 'Bates Cincinnati M116' on eBay."

"Oh. Thanks, Bert!"

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by unamuzd1

"Hey Bert - what's that sound?"



"Ernie, my friend, that's the sound of 320 people simultaneously setting an alert for 'Bates Cincinnati M116' on eBay."



"Oh. Thanks, Bert!"

Now that's funny.

[T206Collector]

Congrats! Great find and great story!

So.... What's it worth?

[HercDriver]

Based on the last sale? Maybe $15.

That is a great story!!

[Wite3]

Mac,
Really nice find...congrats.

Joshua

[Michael Peich]

Mac--Sorry to be so late to the party, but as someone who used to collect M116s, you have made a sensational find. Congratulations!

Cheers,
Mike

[tbob]

Mac- congrats, couldn't happen to a nicer guy.

For those who are wondering about variation rarities, for many, many years McConnell and McQuillan were the only two different team variations and I paid a pretty penny for each to complete my set. Since then the Bates Cinn. has surfaced and I believe Brian Parker discovered an F. Smith Boston (as opposed to the common F. Smith Chicago). Both are extremely rare and I think The F. Smith is a one of a kind. Brian bought a lot of off-condition M116s and stumbled on it. There is also a Seymour variation as I recall which surfaced a few years ago and may also be a 1 of 1.
These are the 5 toughies. Much rarer than anything in the T206 set unless you count the handful of never released proofs Keith Olberman bought a while back.

[frohme]

FWIW, Old Cardboard has an M116 reference checklist that includes rarity. It looks to have been updated to include the F. Smith (Bos) which ranks an 8 on their rarity scale. Bates (Cinn) and Seymour (Balt) the other two of the 3 cards at that level.

Surprisingly, there are also 3 cards at a 9: Beck and Lobert (Phillies) and H. Lord (WhiteSox). Not sure how those rates are determined.

Regardless, great find, Mac!!

--
Mike

[Leon]

Thanks for posting the link Mike. It looks like the rarest cards are commons .

BTW, Mike, If I recall correctly you and I played in the same little league a few years ago, in the early 1970s in Clear Lake City, TX. I was sitting next to a new guy on our softball team a few weeks ago, here near Dallas, and it turned out to be Pat Ray, our centerfielder on the All Star team when we went to State in 1974. I couldn't believe it. He played center and I played right, back in the day.... Small world....

Originally Posted by frohme

FWIW, Old Cardboard has an M116 reference checklist that includes rarity. It looks to have been updated to include the F. Smith (Bos) which ranks an 8 on their rarity scale. Bates (Cinn) and Seymour (Balt) the other two of the 3 cards at that level.

Surprisingly, there are also 3 cards at a 9: Beck and Lobert (Phillies) and H. Lord (WhiteSox). Not sure how those rates are determined.

Regardless, great find, Mac!!

--
Mike