Tale of Two Green Cobbies(REA)

[ullmandds]

I was just cruising REA to make sure I'm in where I want to be...and I noticed this oversized green cobby...graded 70 by SGC...and it is a beauty. I was a little shocked by the current price...$22K.

http://bid.robertedwardauctions.com/...e?itemid=39535


Moving along...I then came across this green cobby graded ex-mt by PSA...and it is at $14 K.

http://bid.robertedwardauctions.com/...e?itemid=39397


I just thought this was...interesting!

[nat]

The centering on the expensive one is better. Don't know that it's a PSA vs SGC thing at all.

[CMIZ5290]

delete..

[Stonepony]

At least a couple bidders have fallen in love with those huge borders, but $22k, yeesh!

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Stonepony

At least a couple bidders have fallen in love with those huge borders, but $22k, yeesh!

I like the big bordered one twice as much as the psa 6....

And Kevin, don't you think that was kind of a rude comment?

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Stonepony

At least a couple bidders have fallen in love with those huge borders, but $22k, yeesh!

Maybe someday moneybags Kevin will buy the sgc 70 after it's been cut down to size and reholstered by good old PSA as a 7.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Leon

I like the big bordered one twice as much as the psa 6....

And Kevin, don't you think that was kind of a rude comment?

delete...

[ullmandds]

Its Saturday night...FIGHT NIGHT!!!!!!

[Leon]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

No, I sure as hell don't. This prick sabotages all of my threads. What about his rude comments Leon????

Well, I do.
Yours was a mean comment out of left field. Next time he does that to you PM me. Otherwise, please cut the crap out.

Oh, and I am not stirring the pot, only calling out what I see as unnecessary rudeness.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

Its Saturday night...FIGHT NIGHT!!!!!!

delete, thans....

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

No, it's ice night. I figured you would already be on the lake....

is that really the best you can do? i'm not even a native minnesotan and I don't fish?

[drmondobueno]

Thanks for the look-see on my favorite White Border, Peter. Very nice. And I do like the wide bordered card for its registration. Buy the card...

OK, got popcorn, Dots and Dr Pepper. Carry on.

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by drmondobueno

Thanks for the look-see on my favorite White Border, Peter. Very nice. And I do like the wide bordered card for its registration. Buy the card...

OK, got popcorn, Dots and Dr Pepper. Carry on.

Yeah, those big fat borders always slay me.

I got Raisinettes and Mountain Dew. I think someone else brought the bad whiskey.

[ullmandds]

you guys!!!!! i had grilled cheese and bacon sandwhich...and am likely done eating for the night!

[ajjohnsonsoxfan]

thanks for the thread...I noticed the same thing and had the opposite reaction. I thought the oversize borders weren't as attractive. Although I'm not a true t206 guy. Interesting seems like bigger is better eh?

[drmondobueno]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

you guys!!!!! i had grilled cheese and bacon sandwhich...and am likely done eating for the night!

Leftover ribs, baked beans, slaw and homemade apple sauce, in recognition of the fishing season opener I do not participate in because guys in boats run over guys with fly rods in float tubes.

But the food is good.

[sgbernard]

Make that 25k! But I do agree that Cobb is a beautiful card.

[philliesphan]

Closes at nearly $40k w/vig

[glynparson]

I always have to laugh when an SGC card actually outsells a similarly graded PSA card this board often goes crazy promoting the sale but ignores the countless PSA sales that crush SGC numbers every single day. This oversized card probably went to a card doctor and will reemerge the correct size. I hope I am wrong and it was just purchased by a well heeled collector who fell in love with the big borders but I have been around long enough that I am skeptical.

[nsaddict]

The SGC is better visually, but NOT for nearly 2x the price imo.

[ullmandds]

my intent wasn't to start another "discussion" about PSA/SGC so much as to highlight the "large" sums of $$$$$$ difference between similar cards...despite the grade.

but I am sure we will see this card again...and it will be shorter!!!!

[e107collector]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

my intent wasn't to start another "discussion" about PSA/SGC so much as to highlight the "large" sums of $$$$$$ difference between similar cards...despite the grade.

but I am sure we will see this card again...and it will be shorter!!!!

Pete, BINGO!!

In my opinion, I bet the winner thinks they can trim down the card, and try to get it in a high grade slab. This has never been done before...correct?

Tony

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by glynparson

I always have to laugh when an SGC card actually outsells a similarly graded PSA card this board often goes crazy promoting the sale but ignores the countless PSA sales that crush SGC numbers every single day. This oversized card probably went to a card doctor and will reemerge the correct size. I hope I am wrong and it was just purchased by a well heeled collector who fell in love with the big borders but I have been around long enough that I am skeptical.

Cynic.

[pawpawdiv9]

Well, atleast I know where to put my oversized 'red' cobb double print name, if I were to sell it.

[jl9999]

mmmmmm, the borders on that SGC Cobb are so fat and juicy. Reminds me of a really nice, thick crust pizza

[Touch'EmAll]

The PSA 6 green Cobb is no better than 80-20 centering bottom/top, maybe even 85-15. Thats the tale for me.

The SGC fat boarder Cobb - question: would it fit in a PSA slab with interior edge grooves? Or they would probably oversize interior pocket it with that extra cello?

[CMIZ5290]

In all the years I've been collecting T206s, this SGC 70 green Cobb hands down blows me away the most, mainly because I feel like the card was accurately graded (especially corners). $40K after the juice?? I bet if you had guaranteed the consignor a price of $15K before the auction, he would have been very, very happy. This is just insane to me....

[CMIZ5290]

As far as the card going to a card doctor, I would ask everyone to look at close scans of this card. Corner wear alone was not the reason for the grade. There is a very noticeable spot in the green background, and there appears to be some minor issues on the back. Perhaps very faint paper loss at the bottom? Just saying....4 sharp corners will still have to deal with these things.....Still a very nice card....

[pokerplyr80]

The card was pretty unique. With the prices people pay for various t206 oddities, miscuts, misprints etc., I'm not that surprised this sold at such a high price. It could be one of a kind. I've never seen another green Cobb with huge borders like that. I certainly would expect it to sell for more than an off center psa 6.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

The card was pretty unique. With the prices people pay for various t206 oddities, miscuts, misprints etc., I'm not that surprised this sold at such a high price. It could be one of a kind. I've never seen another green Cobb with huge borders like that. I certainly would expect it to sell for more than an off center psa 6.

Could be that, or could be someone who thinks they can get it into a significantly higher holder. Think Mastro and the Wagner as purchased from Alan Ray.

[Pat R]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

As far as the card going to a card doctor, I would ask everyone to look at close scans of this card. Corner wear alone was not the reason for the grade. There is a very noticeable spot in the green background, and there appears to be some minor issues on the back. Perhaps very faint paper loss at the bottom? Just saying....4 sharp corners will still have to deal with these things.....Still a very nice card....

There are several Green Cobb's with the same exact spot including this
PSA 8

[pokerplyr80]

That PSA 8 almost looks like it was cut from the big bordered SGC card. Not a stretch to think another might be. I guess we'll have to watch the population reports in the next few months to see if another high grade Cobb is added.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Pat R

There are several Green Cobb's with the same exact spot including this
PSA 8

You're referencing a Harris card? Holy cow....That card is thinner than Barney Fife on a hunger strike....

[Pat R]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

You're referencing a Harris card? Holy cow....That card is thinner than Barney Fife on a hunger strike....

No I was referring to the spot

[CMIZ5290]

Pat- I was'nt just talking about the print spot. The back of the card had questions towards the bottom of the card. Even having said that, the corners on the card are 5's or 5.5's at best. Again, this card was by far the biggest surprise I have ever seen at auction. The upper left corner and the bottom two corners are slightly rounded!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

You're referencing a Harris card? Holy cow....That card is thinner than Barney Fife on a hunger strike....

Not much different to my eye than this one that everyone here was oohing and aahing about not too long ago.

[benchod]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Not much different to my eye than this one that everyone here was oohing and aahing about not too long ago.

That Green Cobb looked noticeably short when it was recently auctioned

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by benchod

That Green Cobb looked noticeably short when it was recently auctioned

What can I say, most people don't look past the label these days.

[Luke]

Most 8s look like bad hack jobs to me. I don't understand paying a bunch of money for an obviously trimmed card. I'm sure I'm not the only one.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by LukeLyon

Most 8s look like bad hack jobs to me. I don't understand paying a bunch of money for an obviously trimmed card. I'm sure I'm not the only one.

To loosely paraphrase Robert Duvall in Apocalypse Now, if I say that's an 8, Captain, then that's an 8!!

[uniship]

Not that I have ever trimmed a card in any way - and not that I endorse scammers that do so - but 2 things

1 how exactly do these trimmers have the balls to do it?

2 how exactly do they do it? Can't be scissors. Can't be paper cutter. How do these trimmers actually trim the cards? I've heard " Laser " cutters? What is a laser cutter?

[Joshchisox08]

Originally Posted by uniship

Not that I have ever trimmed a card in any way - and not that I endorse scammers that do so - but 2 things

1 how exactly do these trimmers have the balls to do it?

2 how exactly do they do it? Can't be scissors. Can't be paper cutter. How do these trimmers actually trim the cards? I've heard " Laser " cutters? What is a laser cutter?

1) Good question
2) Yet another good question. I think for the most part, most of us can detect a trimmed card (typical trimmed card that is) from a mile away. Holding it in our hand would be easy. But seeing the paper stock on the edges and the color or dis-coloration would be an easy way to tell as well.

I'm sure if someone were to cut the SGC card up and resubmit to let's say PSA. PSA "should" be able to tell that the card had been cut. Do they not look along the edges? Would the paper stock not be obscenely more light than it should be? Or does PSA not even bother looking into each and every single card that could be trimmed? They sure as hell do with the low grade stuff, why not the high grade? Do they really need to believe that there's a bunch of Cobb 8s out there? Or do they really need to have it on their pop reports over everyone else, (well SGC) when they're already the monopoly.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Joshchisox08

1) Good question
2) Yet another good question. I think for the most part, most of us can detect a trimmed card (typical trimmed card that is) from a mile away. Holding it in our hand would be easy. But seeing the paper stock on the edges and the color or dis-coloration would be an easy way to tell as well.

I'm sure if someone were to cut the SGC card up and resubmit to let's say PSA. PSA "should" be able to tell that the card had been cut. Do they not look along the edges? Would the paper stock not be obscenely more light than it should be? Or does PSA not even bother looking into each and every single card that could be trimmed? They sure as hell do with the low grade stuff, why not the high grade? Do they really need to believe that there's a bunch of Cobb 8s out there? Or do they really need to have it on their pop reports over everyone else, (well SGC) when they're already the monopoly.

I believe you are underestimating the sophistication and skill of the elite card doctors. Yes, if you or I were to trim a card it would be obvious. Not these guys.

[Joshchisox08]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I believe you are underestimating the sophistication and skill of the elite card doctors. Yes, if you or I were to trim a card it would be obvious. Not these guys.

Why yes I am. Laser cutting? That's why I was wondering what the hell does someone do to make a non-detectable trim where a "Professional Grading Company" is unable to detect foul play?

Perhaps if they cant' beat the crooks they hire em like in "Catch me if you Can"?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Joshchisox08

Why yes I am. Laser cutting? That's why I was wondering what the hell does someone do to make a non-detectable trim where a "Professional Grading Company" is unable to detect foul play?

Perhaps if they cant' beat the crooks they hire em like in "Catch me if you Can"?

There have been posts over the years about microtrimming and how difficult it is to detect. I really don't know the techniques used.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Joshchisox08

Why yes I am. Laser cutting? That's why I was wondering what the hell does someone do to make a non-detectable trim where a "Professional Grading Company" is unable to detect foul play?

Perhaps if they cant' beat the crooks they hire em like in "Catch me if you Can"?

You are giving the grading companies way too much credit. Grading and detecting trimming is not a science. There are some common characteristics of trimming but at the end of the day most of it, unless really obvious, is a crap-shoot. That is my personal experience.

.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by uniship

Not that I have ever trimmed a card in any way - and not that I endorse scammers that do so - but 2 things

1 how exactly do these trimmers have the balls to do it?

2 how exactly do they do it? Can't be scissors. Can't be paper cutter. How do these trimmers actually trim the cards? I've heard " Laser " cutters? What is a laser cutter?

The answer to question 1 in cash and lots of it.

They can be trimmed with a paper cutter, many high end graded cards got resized using one. The most famous trimmed card ever was supposedly trimmed with an exacto knife.

[T205 GB]

No mater what you can't reproduce the edge roll with common cutters of any type. They just don't do the same job and that's what you have to look at. Just my opinion on what I have seen on altered trimmed cards.