1948-49 leaf #1 joe d. ( orange background)

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Posted By: marty q

this may be a question for ted z, or anybody else who can help! how hard is this version compared to the green or puke background?? thanks in advance...........marty

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

MARTY

This color printing error is seen quite often. The normally Green background on the Joe DiMaggio
card is found with a pale Yellow color.

The Yellow ink is the 1st color pass in the 4-color printing process of these cards. This DiMaggio
card simply didn't get the final Blue ink pass.

Two examples of this type of printing error are shown in the scan in the my lower post, note the
Billy Johnson and Dick Wakefield cards......they exactly the same color errors.





TED Z

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Posted By: Paul

Ted, if Billy Johnson didn't go through the blue ink pass, why are his sleeves blue? Was the background printed separately?

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Posted By: Pennsylvania Ted

At some stage (most likely the very last) in the process a Light Blue ink was applied. Look at the Dillinger card in the
middle for this color.

Also, here is a Stan Musial with this same Light Blue color....this Musial card is normally has a Dark Blue background.



TED Z

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Posted By: boxingcardman

Each of the primary colors -- black, cyan (blue), magenta (red), and yellow -- has a separate plate. Even though you see many, many colors in the finished product, only these four colors are used. The amount and intermix of the inks is what creates the different colors.

The only processes I am aware of that allow for different colors of ink to be directly applied to the prints are older processes like hand-printing or stone lithography.

Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

ADAM W

Yes, the 4-color process has been around for quite a while. Before that, late 19th and early 20th Century BB cards
were printed using a 6-color process. These 1949 Leaf BB cards, however, are found with a variety of strange back-
ground colors. The various shades of Blue, and especially the Light Blue colors on these cards are puzzling.

You cannot create a Light Blue from....Black, Yellow, Magenta and Cyan. The Light Blue must of been a 5th ink pass
in the process. I have 100's of these Leaf's and it is very interesting to compare the color variations between same
player cards.

This same Light Blue coloration can be found on 1949 Bowman BB cards as a prime background color by design.

TED Z

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Posted By: Al C.risafulli

.

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Posted By: Anthony N.

<<You cannot create a Light Blue from....Black, Yellow, Magenta and Cyan.>>

Actually, according to my pantone swatch book, this shade of light blue can be achieved in the 4 color process by using 48% cyan, 21% magenta, 28% yellow and 0% black.

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

That really surprises me, because CYAN is a Dark Blue ink.

TED Z

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Posted By: Joe D.

Ted - I would consider Cyan to be a 'baby blue' even at 100% strength.

The mix of colors that Anthony is talking about would give something like a light greenish blue (I think, I don't have a swatch book with me right now) - something in the Seattle Mariners family color-wise, but a lighter.


admittedly - I am not completely following the gist of this thread, so my apologies in advance if my comments are not on target.

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Posted By: Al C.risafulli

I don't usually post over here, but my understanding is that the blue in four-color process (the CYAN) is a light blue, and it is darkened by adding black and magenta in various degrees.

Just trying to help out a bit.

-Al

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

If the CYAN ink is a Light Blue then I can understand that the Light colored blue cards are the
result of incomplete color printing. However, the dictionary definition of CYAN is "dark blue".
It is derived from the Greek word "kyonos", which translated is deep blue....as the color of the
Aegean Sea.

The CYAN ink cartridge in our printer is a deep blue color. Joe, you are the printer, please cla-
rify this.

Meanwhile, I'll scan some Leaf BB cards with different coloring.

TED Z

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

Here are more Leaf color differences. I guess the Leaf printers were somewhat sloppy in mixing their ink ?











TED Z

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Posted By: Joe D.

I would most definitely categorize CYAN as a light blue.


As far as the color variances.... even with the correct ink on press - especially in the beginning of a run.... you can run colors light and heavy.

A pressman's adjustment - using the same ink and the same plates can make for very different results.

I would guess the variances here are from 'waste sheets' that should not have made there way into circulation.
Or, as Ted mentioned, maybe just sloppy press work.



edit to say: Ted - bring the Billy Johnson cards to Philly - they are the most compelling of the bunch.

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

I usually have them with me at the show. But, you are the first to want to see them.

So, we have concluded that CYAN is the ink color that is seen on my light blue colored
Stan Musial, Bob Dillinger and Kent Peterson (dark cap) cards ?

And, that these cards missed the final printing phase to create the normal dark blue
background. What ink color is applied to create this dark blue background ?

Thanks for your expertise.
TED Z

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Posted By: Joe D.

Ted,

For the Musual....

The ink that would be added to make the dark blue background is red (by red I mean Magenta).

That is how you would create that deep blue.

The fact that there already is red on the 'light blue' version means either this was a purposeful variation - or a bad magenta plate.
Perhaps when they were on press - they thought the the blue background looked too light and decided to make a new magenta plate.


If I had the cards in front of me and had a chance to examine them in person - I would definitely be able to give better answers.

I look forward to seeing you and the cards at Philly.

I will bring whatever 50s, 60s cards I have (a binder or so) to see if you think there is anything cool in there (stuff passed on to me by family).
Maybe there is a gem or cool variation in my binder


Regards,
Joe

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Posted By: Ted Zanidakis

I acquired the light Blue colored Musial way back in 1981 at the Valley Forge (PA) Show.
I have seen only one more with this light Blue background in all these years. I would say
it's definitely a color error (and not by design).

As I said in a prior post here, I think Leaf employed more phases in the printing of these
cards than the standard 4-color process. I've seen too many color variations in the 101
cards in this set....implying that there had to be at least a 5 phase process.