Submitted 118 T206 PSA 8 for review

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Hope to get 10-15 8.5s and at least a couple 9s. We'll see.

Also submitted 60s superstar cards I had in 8.

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Posted By: David Atkatz

We're all waiting with bated breath, Jim.
What a marvelous addition to your collection.

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

bated breath... whispered humblenesse.

Realistically, those who await the results do so exactly opposite of that.

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Posted By: Lee Behrens

Why not send them to SGC and see what they think? Basically a second opinion, that would be alot more interesting.

Lee

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Posted By: Scott Levy

who was it that said PSA is going out of business?

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Sorry to disappoint you disgruntled professor but I did not go bankrupt.

My collection is PSA and will stay so....although Dave is a good friend and I wish him well.

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Posted By: Steve F

*Other pic was too mean-spirited for the holidays.

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Posted By: Fred C

Just out of curiosity, how many of these cards are from the Harris Collection? If they change the grade I assume the label would still reflect the provenance of the card, is that correct?

Can PSA "downgrade" any of the cards? Or do they strictly only perform "upgrades"? I don't want to sound like I'm peeing in your Cheerios but wouldn't it make sense that if there's a chance of an upgrade that it's also very probable that there would be a chance for a downgrade also?

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Posted By: Matt

Fred - I guess you weren't around here when PSA came out with the half point scale - that policy (only possibility for upgrades) caused some consternation.

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Posted By: MVSNYC

Fred- Jim has his hands over his Cheerios...

PSA does not downgrade when they review.

good luck Jim, keep us posted.

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Posted By: Marc S.

When reholdered, PSA removes the "Harris Collection" designation from the flip. If for not other reason, now that PSA recognizes the advertising back on T206s, there is not enough room for that and the Harris Collection notation. Either way, it is removed.

I have a single [FULL sized] PSA 9 example from the Harris Collection, that I have since had reholdered, and I'm slightly happy that the designation is no longer there, as there seems to be an air of suspicion about some/many of the higher-grade examples.

M

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Posted By: Al C.risafulli

Good luck, Jim. Keep us posted on how it goes; it will be interesting to see how a potential increase in pops in high-grade T206s impacts the market for those cards.

-Al

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Posted By: John

I think it's silly they dont downgrade but I understand why purely business, keep guys like Jim happy and wanting to spend money at no risk.

Sort of like asking your grandma or mum if your a good looking guy...gee wonder what the answer will be..

Good luck Jim, I also dont really think it's that wrong he posted. Heck what's the old joke "telling you I'm telling everyone!"

Jim has some nice stuff no reason to be ashamed I can understand why he's proud of his stuff he should be.

John

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Posted By: rand

hey jim, i am glad you made this post, it will be interesting to see how many cards come back at a better grade. i am sure most of the readers on this board do not have the amount of cards to send in for the experiment, and perhaps not the extra funds it takes to pay for 120 cards or so. what is the turn around time for the re-grades? did you keep a record of your own to see what card you thought would get bumped? it will be interesting to see if PSA agrees. no different then when i send my stuff to SGC to see if their opinion is the same as mine.

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Posted By: Anonymous

Jim

We wish you the very best.

We recently had two rare T cards upgraded by PSA, from 8 to 8.5




Bruce Dorskind
America's Toughest Want List

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Posted By: jay wolt

Jim, Good Luck w/ your upgrade quest. Never re-submitted any for bumps
myself but its an option that can be exercised. Hopefully a few deserve
upgrades to make it worthwhile for your time & expense.

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Posted By: Ted Sherman

Since my cards really arent worth too much, I crack them and resubmit. So far 2/3 have gone from 7 to 7.5

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Posted By: Tom Boblitt

I laugh every time I see that Beyonce commercial..............guess she got paid well to cram that thing in her mouth..............(that's what she said........couldn't resist.......I love The Office..........)

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Posted By: JimCrandell

John, Rand,



Who says I am spending money? Maybe if I did the brinks truck 25,000 card thing but not this way. Only downside is it goes slow.



Still--get to meet Anabelle or Bill at the airport or a hotel and personally hand them to him or her.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Bruce,

Submitted 2 pop 1s, a few pop 2s and a bunch of pop 3s. Also about 15 HOFers. It is here where I am hoping most for bumps to 8.5 or 9.

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Posted By: sagard

Jim-

Did you screen them this time or are you going with another random sample?

Good luck either way and please report the results if you get a chance.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

No screening--just submitted them all--easier that way.

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Posted By: John

"Who says I am spending money?"

So the reviews are free??? I dont follow you Jim....

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Posted By: JimCrandell

You can e-mail me for more details if you wish--I don't think Joe would be comfortable disclosing our deal in public.

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Posted By: John

Nah don't need to bother you Jim I'm sure it's a good deal, best of luck.

P.S. Even if you were paying it's not a bad thing you're a good customer of PSA nothing to be ashamed of etc.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

I'm not ashamed --in fact I am delighted with the deal--win/win for me.

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Posted By: John

Jim I was only pointing out in my comment above that offering reviews and half grade bumps was smart business on PSA's side especially since theres no chance of downgrade...

You dropped the I'm not paying hint which if you're not good for you.

I was only saying that even if you were no issues you're a good customer of PSA with a nice collection so who cares if you wantred to pay for extra reviews.

Cheers Jim have a great holiday, sorry for any confusion I thought I was clear. Wow even when I compliment you and your collection we seem to butt heads or get wires crossed..LOL

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Thanks John--same to you--Happy Holidays.

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Posted By: Fred C

I remember the thread about PSA doing half grades (up). I still don't understand the philosophy but hey, if it means .5 up on the label then more power to you. If it gets rid of that Harris label then you're doing even better...

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

So what's the deal with the "Harris label"...Why is it a bad thing?

And good luck Jim...I'm interested in hearing what your success rate is.

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Posted By: John

Many of the Harris cards came from the Copeland collection. Its a commonly discussed topic that many dealers trimmed cards to sell to Jim Copeland. Jim was one of the first big wallets in the hobby and had a passion for stellar cards and would pay top dollar. Unfortunately many dealer and sellers took advantage of this trimming cards to sell to him.

IMO the PSA 7 Plank from the Copeland collection is trimmed along with many others, the bad thing is because of this even legitimate high grade cards from that collection now carry a question of doubt due to these past issues or rumors.

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Posted By: JimB

Dan,
Some people believe that a good percentage of the T206s that were pedigreed with "Harris Collection" back about ten years ago were, in fact, trimmed. It was a complete set (minus Wagner and Doyle) that was incredibly high grade - mostly 8's and 9's - that Sportscards Plus auctioned off for "Harris" back then. I met him at the National a few years ago by coincidence at a booth. He was a nice guy.
JimB

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Thanks guys...Does anyone know if PSA has ever had to buy back any Harris cards they encapsulated due to trimming?

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Posted By: John

The 2 above are mine; I have doubts on one I'm an honest guy. When I get time I plan on having all my cards checked by SGC for a second look see. However since I'm not really into the whole graded card thing I havent made it a priority and since these both are in my set since and I'm not looking to sell anytime soon back burner.

However if I ever sold them and the person wanted a second opinion I would have no problem offering that I wouldnt hide behind a plastic holder and grade like some folks would do. If they turned out trimmed I would ask PSA but who knows if they would do anything...

I dont have any money in them per say the Needham was bought during the orginal auction, the Mullin years later on ebay. I can say that the orginal price paid on the Mullin was way higher than what I paid on eBay...for what it's worth. In fact the mullin was fluke I put in a stupid low bid and won...

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Posted By: JimCrandell

I have only one Harris card in my collection.

Thanks Dan--will keep everyone posted--usually I get a pretty quick turnaround from PSA.

Jim

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Posted By: Mark McKernon

"Who says I am spending money?"

"usually I get a pretty quick turnaround from PSA"

Free and fast. Nice combo. Good luck with the reviews.

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Posted By: Fred C

Wonk,

I knew there was a reason everyone that liked you for more than just the great pics you used to post! I still forward to seeing a really good Wonk photo display!

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Posted By: JimCrandell

3 bumps to 8.5 out of 118--not so good. So much for arguments big submitters get favoritism. On the positive side, my 3 bumps are all pop ones with none higher --Hartsel, Hinchman and Paskert--so its good to at least have the best of these on the planet which should be pretty good for value.

I submitted 26 others--all superstar cards from the 60s and got 4 bumps including Seaver RC earning valuable set registry points for
my 65 and 67 Topps sets.

Gave them another 300 including 1941 Play Ball set --complete in 8 or better except for 3 cards--1957 Topps and 1961 Fleer Bskbl and other miscelaneous cards.

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Posted By: Fred C

Jim,

Do they only charge for the cards that are upgraded or do they charge to review all cards?

I assume that they only crack the cards out the holders that will be upgraded.

Only 3 out of 118. I'm guessing your cards are high in grade so getting bumped to 8.5 isn't so bad. Just having a large quantity of 8's has to be pleasing.

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Posted By: David Atkatz

" ...its good to at least have the best of these on the planet... "

How can you be sure there doesn't exist a raw card (or cards) in better condition than yours?

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Fred,

1)I have a special deal with PSA--Joe has asked not to disclose.
2)Correct--only upgrades
3)I have over 20,000 8s--going to be submitting them to PSA for a long time. Actually, I am trying to accelerate my submissions in case a new president comes in and changes my deal. I was hoping to get more than three though.

Jim

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Posted By: Kyle

Hey Jim,

You own probably more graded cards than anyone else I know or have heard of. How do you store them, where do you store them, do you showcase any in an office, den, rec room? Just curious.

-Kyle

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Posted By: dennis

" ...its good to at least have the best of these on the planet... "
as far as high grade collecting goes this statement is very true. sure there maybe raw cards out there nicer (probably not).but, collectors who collect in high grade cards like this, do it for the known graded cards and enjoyment of the registry. it is a competition of owning the best available cards.it is not for all collectors but lots of collectors do enjoy trying to have one of the best available sets.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Jim- sounds like PSA gave you a fair and unbiased review as only three cards were bumped. That's good to know.

Deleted second part- didn't make sense.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Kyle,

I have a massive room in my basement--on the walls in 6 rows around the perimeter are A few thousand of my best cards and then I have about 25 long tables inside with stacks of cards for the 400 or so graded sets I collect and binbers for another 250 or so I have not sent in to be graded. Collection was profiled in cover story with pictures in a 2006 SMR writeup.

Dennis, For me its owning every card in the set PSA 8 or better--while for several sets I have the best on the planet for some of best known(T206, 33 Goudey, 52 Topps etc) I am chasing the leaders.

Barry--yup, graders have no idea they are grading my cards....despite the fact I snuck into the grading room when they were grading them and announced that they would all get a special bonus if they gave me at least 255 BUMPS.

Jim

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Posted By: JT Burchfield

"earning valuable set registry points for..."

What makes set registry points valuable?

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Posted By: Peter

Thank you for sharing this information - very interesting project to follow. Congratulations on your great collection.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

Thanks Peter

JT--why for the competition on who has the best sets of course--in my world its all about the competition--

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Posted By: Marty Ogelvie

Congrats JimC..

How close are you to the 8 or greater T206 set?

Marty

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Posted By: Eric Brehm

Jim C.,

Thanks for sharing the results of your review submissions here.

I have submitted about 30 PSA 8 cards for review, mostly star cards of the 1950's and 1960's, and received a total of 5 bumps: 3 from PSA 8 to PSA 8.5, and 2 from PSA 8 to PSA 9. (I was surprised by the bumps to 9, as I assumed that very rarely happened.) I didn't 'cherry-pick' the cards in advance, but rather sent in pretty much everything I owned in PSA 8 of certain players that I collect, to see what I would get. (But I'd like to think that most of the PSA 8's I bought were 'high end' examples anyhow.)

In any case, it appears that PSA is being very stringent in awarding the grade bumps. I guess that means that if you do get a bump, say from 8 to 8.5, that you've got a card that is definitely very strong for the grade, at least in PSA's opinion.