ebay vs catalog auction

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Posted By: kevin 

How do you think that the prices on ebay compare to a catalog auction?

Each auction catalog has several high tier items that of course do better than they would do on ebay, but it seems that once you get below that high to mid tier, lets say $5000 or more, the prices on ebay are consistent with those in the catalog, or often times higher on ebay.

It also seems that many of the large lots can be purchased and broken down for a nice profit, which is how I suppose most of the dealers stay in business.

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Posted By: Aaron Michiel

E-Bay are consistently lower than in the catalog auctions (Mastro, Lelands, Grey Flannel, countless other smaller auctions, etc.).

One experience that I'll go into more detail about in the "one that got away" thread, was about a year and a half ago there was an authentic "Keep The Dodgers In Brooklyn" pin on E-Bay. (Reproductions abound of this particular pin issued in 1957--to not much success!) After a seven day auction, it sold for about $600. A year later, a better conditioned example (but not that significantly) sold for close to $1,500 on Inside The Park's auction.

Another example was a pristine unused 1920's Ban Johnson Reach OAL baseball w/o the box I bought in a Mastro auction for just under $800. A few months later a similar conditioned example WITH a solid conditioned box sold on E-Bay for about $750 (had my Ban Johnson baseball had the box, it would have sold for closer to $1,200 - $1,500 on Mastro).

Recently an original (not a printers proof) Lou Gehrig Memorial Game FULL ticket from 1941 in NM condition sold on E-Bay for under $1,100. A similar PROOF ticket sold about two years ago on Mastro for over $2,500. (The original Gehrig on E-Bay would have sold for close to $3,000 on Mastro--at least.)

I could go on with countless other examples (including cards), but the crux is, if you find a high-level item that would warrant selling in a catalog auction, you almost definitely will get a much better deal on E-Bay.

Another note would be don't count on extremely rare items to appear repeatedly, so if you see something appear there, bid appropriately knowing it might not pop up again and you're paying much less than you would were you buying a similar item in a catalog auction. (Though there are always exceptions to the rule.)

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Posted By: Hankon

From the lots I've followed (non-cards) and only in my opinion, MastroNet's prices are nuts .... As far as other auctions go, I largely agree. An auction house like Leland's is likely best suited for handling real expensive items that a normal person wouldn't offer or otherwise have trouble offering on eBay (Lou Gehrig's watch, for example) ... For many of the more 'pedestrian' lots, the prices are quite reasonable especially when they are broken up. One has to judge the pricing lot by lot, and not make a random stab assuming you will get a good deal, but there are always many reasonably priced lots.

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Posted By: Hankron

One thing I do add, as far authenticity, expertise and experience goes, the big auction houses (MastroNet, Leland's, Sotheby's, to name a few) are about five cuts above the average eBay auction. I like autographs, personal items and esoteric memorabilia, and I'd prefer to buy those types of items, when expensive, from one of those types of places.

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Posted By: Aaron Michiel

If you are buying an autographed item on E-Bay, assume it is a forgery (whether the seller is aware of this or not) unless accompanied by a very reputable and individualized certificate of authenticity (such as PSA/DNA). Same goes for game-used items. Dave Bushing/James Spence, Grey Flannel or PSA/DNA offer trustworthy and marketable (for those interested in resale) C of A's for game-used jerseys, caps, gloves etc.

These types of CofA's and reputable provenance are standard when buying an item off of a catalog auction. That level of comfort in their bidders might also explain some of the price discrepancies between E-Bay and auction catalogs.

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Posted By: kevin

It could just be that my opinion is skewed as I only have the time to watch the biggest sellers, but their prices always amaze me. I have to wonder though, if they could do so much better in a catalog auction, why sell on ebay?

I do collect memorabilia as well, but there are only a couple of people who have good vintage memorabilia on any type of regular basis. The only person on ebay that I buy autographs from is scgaynor.

I guess it just depends on who is selling the item as much as anything.

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Posted By: Aaron Michiel

"It could just be that my opinion is skewed as I only have the time to watch the biggest sellers, but their prices always amaze me. I have to wonder though, if they could do so much better in a catalog auction, why sell on ebay?"

I think you have several factors:

1. An item might not be valuable enough for an auction house to sell as an individual lot, so it is rejected. (Conversely, the consignor is reluctant to group a collection of items into a single lot, believing it will diminish the eventual price he might see.)

2. A potential consigner might feel that the higher realized price on an auction catalog might not matter as opposed to E-Bay when considering his shipping costs and 15% buyer's premium. (You have to figure a consignor must feel he can make at least 20% - 30% higher on an item through an auction catalog in order to justify going to the trouble.)

3. A potential consignor might not want to wait for an item to be offered in an auction catalog. On E-Bay, you can start an auction anytime you want. Literally. If you want to consign through Hunt or Leland's or Grey Flannel who only offer two auctions a a year, you could wait as long as six months before your item is finally offered. Then another month before the auction closes. And then another several weeks until you receive funds from the auction house. That's as long as eight months from sending the item off until you receive a check in the mail. Mastro, at 3 auctions a year is only slightly better.

4. A potential consignor might not want to sacrifice control. On E-Bay, you can decide if you want a reserve, if you want to end an auction early or make a side-deal, what and how many pictures you want to include, how you want the description worded, what category it's listed under, what extra features, etc. For an auction catalog, you are taking the risk of a nominal reserve and the rest is completely up to the auction house. They decide what picture to use, the text, etc.

5. So basically, you have to wait for funds, sacrifice control of your item's auction and incur considerable additional fees. With all that in mind, you then have to feel that if offered through an auction catalog, your item will bring such a higher premium so as to justify the trouble. It's no wonder many don't.

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Posted By: warshawlaw

Bad lot descriptions. I love catalogue auctions because I know that larger lots of cards are frequently misdescribed. I have picked up some really great stuff in the past, with great break-up value, due to these mistakes. I'm talking full sets labeled assorted lots, misidentified rare cards, etc.

As a seller, I can definitely second the issues of premiums and loss of control. First the premiums: Don't forget the buyer's 15%, but don't forget the seller's 15% too. Every $1 spent on an item at a major auction house nets the seller around 70%. That's a pretty big bite. Especially with really nice vintage cards, I can take them to a major show and sell them for cash to dealers at a 30% discount (and not have to deal with any of the hassles of a consignment auction), or I can post them on ebay at 20% below market and keep more of my money.

As far as loss of control goes, that is perhaps the biggest reason why I would be loathe to ever again consign anything to an auction house. I lucked into a major cache of Hollywood memorabilia many years ago, some of which I consigned to a major auction house. I got royally ****ed. They established ridiculous minimums on my items, screwed up the descriptions, and they sold for near those levels. After the commissions and fees were deducted, I netted only a fraction of what the items should have brought (and I know this to be the case because I sold comparable items directly at Hollywood memorabilia shows and made tons more). Look at the idiotic opening bids on the lots in any auction. I realize that the auctioneers hope to create "action" with these lowball numbers, but this ain't a casino, and even if it is, it is my money they are betting with. I want more of a say on how my money is "bet".

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Posted By: Lee Behrens

I think there is some different clientel at the auction house that don't spend any if no time on ebay and they seem to be big spenders.

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Posted By: leon

Your math might be off, at least in my view. If the auction house gets 15% on both sides the seller still nets 85%...as he/she is only responsible for the front end not the back end....unless he/she bids on their own lots so they don't go too low, and wins them....but that's a whole nuther story.....regards and happy hannukah....(which I've seen spelled 50 different ways)