Hottest Player To Collect...And Why?

[MattyC]

Flawed argument? Not at all. The problem is that your defensiveness over what you collect (invest in) blinded your eyes to even seeing my rather innocuous point.

That point was simply this: there are many paths to the goal of collecting and investing satisfaction. My statement was fact, depending of course on cards chosen. And it proves that not one sector of our shared hobby is the sole answer, or a better answer than another.

I think you need to search inward, if it bothers you to know that a card of someone other than Cobb (even, GASP, a modern player) may generate more hypothetical dollars within a certain period of time, if the sale is timed properly. And of course to realize funds from a modern sale, it must be timed— whereas a long dead or retired player does not have that risk. That is no revelation.

You also seem to overrate the ability to flip the cards you selected. Where modern player cards can be bought and sold in a day trading fashion with substantial price swings in the comparatively short term, try winning one of the cards you highlighted in a top AH and selling it a month or two later, let alone a week. In that short a time span, it is hard to profit. There are different potentialities and exploitable facets to all types of card: the older and newer, the thinly traded and highly liquid.

End of the day, choices like a Cobb rare postcard are fantastic if that is what one likes to collect— such a card is also a great store of value now and into the future. Yet depending on one’s predilections and investment goals, if any, there are certainly other equally worthwhile cards. Accept that.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by toolman tj

Sorry for the error, I read the Cobb HOF info in a book years ago and it stuck with me. I should have fact checked that, so thanks for the correction.

Not every book is accurate...especially (IMO) about Cobb - the more recent bios of him, with far more research, paint a very different picture than the previous ones.

Call it revisionist history if you want to, but those books may have helped spur the new interest in collecting his cards.

[orly57]

I think that maybe if you read some of my past few posts, you will find that I've been very vocal about supporting any form of card collecting: modern or vintage. I hope the hobby flourishes on all ends. As for my post, well, you made an intellectually dishonest argument and I pointed it out. It's really that simple.
Speaking of "searching inward," judging from your posts, it appears that it is you who is overly sensitive about your modern cards. You flip out on anyone who disagrees with you. You nearly imploded when someone pointed out there are 24,000 Trout cards on eBay. Settle down. It's only cards.

[MattyC]

You call that an implosion? You’re seeing things.

We both know that data about Trout was cited in a pejorative way, and that type of superciliousness is indeed something I am tired of seeing, when I try to take a break from work and chat card collecting.

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

1. Babe Ruth (no question; unfortunately most of his cards are ugly)
2. Cobb
3. Mantle
4. Wagner (the t206 alone keeps him in popular culture)
5. Lou Gehrig
6. Cy Young (his name is mentioned each year in the award of the best pitcher)
7. Joe Jackson (so long as field of dreams and other black Sox scandal-lore is popular)
8. Walter Johnson (unbeatable record)
9. Joe DiMaggio (unbeatable record and sung about by Simon and Garfunkel)
10. Eddie Plank - bc I just picked up his t206 card and wanted him on this list (I don’t really think he belongs)

IMO, Mantle is the only postwar card (not player-card) on this list. Other players may be more iconic - certainly Jackie Robinson, Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Pete Rose, Cal Ripken- but their cards are so plentiful that I just don’t think their cards make the list.

Then of course their are iconic cards of great players 1933 Goudey Lajoie, 48 Leaf Paige, T206 Magie (error), 1914 CJ Matty, 1888 Anson, etc... but that was not the topic.

Jackie Robinson surely lands somewhere in the top 10 most collectable players of all time and probably top 5 on my list

[Hxcmilkshake]

Originally Posted by packs

There are literally millions of cards out there for Judge and Jeter collectors though. They'll never reach the same level. For ANY career-contemporary Cobb card it's going to cost you, which is what sures up the value of his more expensive options.

They dont have to reach the same level. If you bought 100 93 SP Jeters 10 yrs ago you will have done well for yourself. You dont need to flip Cobbs to do well. Thats where I'm coming from ....thats what i thought this thread was about. *shrug* So, maybe buy some undervalued Ryan RC or some 2013 Judges and see what happens.



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[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by Gobucsmagic74

Jackie Robinson surely lands somewhere in the top 10 most collectable players of all time and probably top 5 on my list

I think Jackie is top 3-5 all time iconic baseball player (hell athlete), no doubt, and I basically state as much in my initial post. I just think that there are so many of his cards out there that when it comes to player-cards to collect for investment (and I think this thread intended investment) I think the much less populous, prewar studs are the ones to collect. But, admittedly I am totally biased bc I love the old old and rare stuff.

Regarding old vs new- nobody wins that fight. Everyone has their opinions. The good news is we are all on the same team bc whether it’s a t206 Wagner, a 1952 Topps mantle PSA 9, or a 2017 Judge, they are all cards and their success keeps the hobby and investment relevant and thriving. Go cards (regardless of era)!

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by MattyC

You call that an implosion? You’re seeing things.

We both know that data about Trout was cited in a pejorative way, and that type of superciliousness is indeed something I am tired of seeing, when I try to take a break from work and chat card collecting.

Curious, what’s your full name?

[tjb1952tjb]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Eddie Gaedel - unlimited growth potential with minimal downside risk.

Frank.............you always crack me up.

[joshuanip]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

I think Jackie is top 3-5 all time iconic baseball player (hell athlete), no doubt, and I basically state as much in my initial post. I just think that there are so many of his cards out there that when it comes to player-cards to collect for investment (and I think this thread intended investment) I think the much less populous, prewar studs are the ones to collect. But, admittedly I am totally biased bc I love the old old and rare stuff.

Regarding old vs new- nobody wins that fight. Everyone has their opinions. The good news is we are all on the same team bc whether it’s a t206 Wagner, a 1952 Topps mantle PSA 9, or a 2017 Judge, they are all cards and their success keeps the hobby and investment relevant and thriving. Go cards (regardless of era)!

Modern cards are vintage’s hope for new blood. Kids want heroes not history. That’s in the modern cards of judge trout and now Ohtani. Got no dog in this fight except I hope modern cards stay popular for my vintage collection.

[joshuanip]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

I think Jackie is top 3-5 all time iconic baseball player (hell athlete), no doubt, and I basically state as much in my initial post. I just think that there are so many of his cards out there that when it comes to player-cards to collect for investment (and I think this thread intended investment) I think the much less populous, prewar studs are the ones to collect. But, admittedly I am totally biased bc I love the old old and rare stuff.

Regarding old vs new- nobody wins that fight. Everyone has their opinions. The good news is we are all on the same team bc whether it’s a t206 Wagner, a 1952 Topps mantle PSA 9, or a 2017 Judge, they are all cards and their success keeps the hobby and investment relevant and thriving. Go cards (regardless of era)!

Modern cards are vintage’s hope for new blood. Kids want heroes not history. That’s in the modern cards of judge trout and now Ohtani. Got no dog in this fight except I hope modern cards stay popular for my vintage collecting

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by joshuanip

Modern cards are vintage’s hope for new blood. Kids want heroes not history. That’s in the modern cards of judge trout and now Ohtani. Got no dog in this fight except I hope modern cards stay popular for my vintage collecting

You can say that again.

[Snapolit1]

Are the Trout and Otani cards being coveted by kids? Doubt it highly as the father of two boys who love baseball. Average collector of these cards is probably a 35-55 years old man. Next time you are on line at a store or show waiting to pay for something look at the person standing in front and behind of you. That’s what we call today a “grown ass man”.

[Snapolit1]

As a former little league coach making an educated guess, I’d say the level of interest in baseball cards in those under 15 is essentially non existent. Yes there are some young kids at shows with their fathers who collect. Young kids today ain’t playing with cardboard pieces believe me. Some interest in Magic and other card games. Baseball cards? With amazingly rare exception, no. Ask your friend the school teacher the last time he or she saw them on a school playground.

[tjenkins]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Are the Trout and Otani cards being coveted by kids? Doubt it highly as the father of two boys who loves baseball. Average collector of these cards is probably a 35-55 years old man

This is an excellent point. A player that is collectible is very subjective to different individuals. The almighty dollar plays the biggest part in most of these forums on who is collectible (profitable).

[midmo]

I setup at a 3 day show in St Louis last weekend. While most of the collectors were older, I was pleasantly surprised by the number of young kids who were looking over the new cards on the tables next to me. I noticed kids with want lists who were really excited when they found cards they were looking for.

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by MattyC

More desirable to whom? This is all completely subjective; there will be people who like Jeter and not Ryan. People who like Gehrig and not Cobb. Judge collectors who don't have any interest in Mantle. And on and on.

The OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of collectors. There is very little subjectivity for this board on this topic. Have you read the other posts? Have you followed the hobby for any amount of time? Ruth and Cobb reign supreme atop all others when it comes to collecting... and whether or not you agree with it... is inconsequential.

[Snapolit1]

No one is arguing what is subjectively nicer, cooler, better, more important to collect. Those are not factual arguments. That's personal taste. If you want to collect every Mackey Sasser card every printed, go for it. Sounds like fun to me. If you want to open up a museum to Kevin Maas or Bake McBride, go for it. Sounds cool. But if someone is going to argue that modern era cars are a good investment I beg to differ. Yes, there is the occasional amazing obscure piece that someone is going to pay boku bucks for. But what is driving sales of cards today is a lottery aspect of burying supposed relics in boxes and people rushing to find them and make money.

People line up at 6 am in the morning outside the sneaker store in my neighborhood a few times a month. Like 200 people deep. It's because there is some new Jordan shoe or something being released. People line up and buy a dozen pairs and sell them to grateful people in Japan for 10 times the sticker price. Cool. Nice business model. God bless. It doesn't mean they are Michael Jordan or foot ware fans. I have seen people in card store literally cracking open cases of the Topps Heritage card and throwing them into garbage cans as quickly as they can looking for the supposed rareties.

[trdcrdkid]

My 13 year old nephew collects baseball cards, primarily recent cards with an emphasis on the Cubs. I gave him Javy Baez and Willson Contreras rookie cards for Christmas, along with a Donruss blaster box, and he was very happy. A few years ago I gave him a bunch of my doubles from the late 70s and early 80s, and he went through them picking out the Hall of Famers, which he put in his album. So this is a kid who collects current cards but is also interested in older cards.

I would assume that most of the people buying high-end recent cards at shows (autographs, relics, refractors of Trout, Bryant, Ohtani, etc.) are adults, simply because they're the ones with the money for that stuff. Same goes for the people paying $100-$150 for hobby boxes. But I'm sure there are plenty of other kids like my nephew, buying individual packs with what money they have and picking up a nicer card if the opportunity presents itself.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by trdcrdkid

My 13 year old nephew collects baseball cards, primarily recent cards with an emphasis on the Cubs. I gave him Javy Baez and Willson Contreras rookie cards for Christmas, along with a Donruss blaster box, and he was very happy. A few years ago I gave him a bunch of my doubles from the late 70s and early 80s, and he went through them picking out the Hall of Famers, which he put in his album. So this is a kid who collects current cards but is also interested in older cards.

I would assume that most of the people buying high-end recent cards at shows (autographs, relics, refractors of Trout, Bryant, Ohtani, etc.) are adults, simply because they're the ones with the money for that stuff. Same goes for the people paying $100-$150 for hobby boxes. But I'm sure there are plenty of other kids like my nephew, buying individual packs with what money they have and picking up a nicer card if the opportunity presents itself.

Or getting their parents to pay for the boxes.

[53Browns]

Yeah upper deck ruined it by starting the trend to price kids out of the hobby!

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Are the Trout and Otani cards being coveted by kids? Doubt it highly as the father of two boys who love baseball. Average collector of these cards is probably a 35-55 years old man. Next time you are on line at a store or show waiting to pay for something look at the person standing in front and behind of you. That’s what we call today a “grown ass man”.

I sure they are coveted. Why wouldn't they want the biggest star or the hottest rookie? Those are the players I hoped to pull in a pack as a kid. The kids aren't the ones paying 4 or 5 figures for the rare autos or superfractors. But I bet they'd be very excited to find one in a pack.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Hxcmilkshake

They dont have to reach the same level. If you bought 100 93 SP Jeters 10 yrs ago you will have done well for yourself. You dont need to flip Cobbs to do well. Thats where I'm coming from ....thats what i thought this thread was about. *shrug* So, maybe buy some undervalued Ryan RC or some 2013 Judges and see what happens.



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I am curious as to the time frame and price you think they were 10 years ago and what they are now. I know at some point more than 10 years ago when I was doing shows they were over 100.00 each and looking at EBay today, I see plenty of them selling for less. So, if there was profit to be made on Jeter, it is just fluctuation in price. On the other hand A-Rod SP rcs were also over 100, how did you do on those investments? I sold all my Mcgwire rcs for 100-200 back in 1998. Do you think those buyers are happy with their investments?

Modern cards are a game of hot potato. You have to get in at the right time and out at the right time. Even Hofers can see a loss if you aren't careful. Non-Hofers are pretty much guaranteed to lose you money long term. Of course there are a few exceptions such as Michael Jordan or Tom Brady whose cards just keep going up. I thought this thread was about who to buy and not lose money on. If that's the case, then Ruth, Cobb, Wagner and Gehrig are the best bets.

[Peter_Spaeth]

If you happen to catch them VERY early a modern player's cards can of course go way up. But once they have a strong year or two, or are considered an elite prospect, the market seems to price them as though they already have had a HOF career and it seems (to me anyhow) there really isn't that much room to grow. Perhaps a bad example because of overproduction, but look how cheap Pujols rookies are for the most part -- and he is about to get his 3000th hit to go with 600 HR, very few careers are going to match that.

[bigfanNY]

I started going to baseball card shows in 1973 I was 12 and most of the people in the room looked like adults to me. I met some other kids Rob lifson stands out. And it seemed like a long time until that changed but in the mid 1980's kids made up at least half of the crowd.
Now there were collectors of every type I knew guys who would not buy a card newer than 1920. I knew a lot of collectors who collected Goudey's and play ball's as kids who loved 1930's cards. I grew to love them too. It was very personal stories of games guys went to Gehrig Joe D Dean Hubbell ( William's but I don't many red sox fans) Teams they saw 35 tigers gas house gang 36 thru 39 Yankees. Then Mantle and May's
Card collecting is a personal thing. Those guys who collected in the 30's are very old now or passed on. And those sets do not get the attention they once did. I see that happening one day to the 50's and so on. Baseball has trouble drawing kids. Not my kids they go to games. But they don't collect. I collect more memorabilia now than cards. Things change over time but iconic cards are just that not just name but image. Wagner Ruth 33 Cobb t206 52 Mantle rookie is best example Jackie 47 Griffey rookie. They will always endure. I hope..

[Hxcmilkshake]

Originally Posted by rats60

I am curious as to the time frame and price you think they were 10 years ago and what they are now. I know at some point more than 10 years ago when I was doing shows they were over 100.00 each and looking at EBay today, I see plenty of them selling for less. So, if there was profit to be made on Jeter, it is just fluctuation in price. On the other hand A-Rod SP rcs were also over 100, how did you do on those investments? I sold all my Mcgwire rcs for 100-200 back in 1998. Do you think those buyers are happy with their investments?

Modern cards are a game of hot potato. You have to get in at the right time and out at the right time. Even Hofers can see a loss if you aren't careful. Non-Hofers are pretty much guaranteed to lose you money long term. Of course there are a few exceptions such as Michael Jordan or Tom Brady whose cards just keep going up. I thought this thread was about who to buy and not lose money on. If that's the case, then Ruth, Cobb, Wagner and Gehrig are the best bets.

Jeters on ebay less than $100?? Do send me a link

And you can overpay on any card and lose $$$

What about guys out there that are undervalued? With some luck you can do ok.. buy em cheap, raw, slab em, etc.....thats why I say Ryan in a previous post...Lemieux, Messier (in NY especially) and even Gretzky in the hockey world...

Value!

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[BobC]

As of right this moment, i would have to say Ohtani cards. There's a new Bowman product just being released right this week i think that has a 1 of 1 superfractor (or some similar designation) rookie card of Ohtani's in it that already has a standing offer of $60,000 for it, even before it is pulled from a pack. As long as it grades at least a 9.5 and Blowout Cards gets it by May 11th, as I understand the conditions. And as the old saying goes, "all boats rise with the tide", so all Ohtani's other rookie cards are going ballistic right now.

As pointed out by other posters though, with these modern cards your best bet is to get them directly from packs, if possible, and then quickly dump them for a big profit. This is exactly why the Breakers are in control of the new card distribution market out there and why Topps and Panini are gearing their products to create these manufactured rarities that drive modern collectors insane with prices and values. It is essentially nothing more than a legalized form of gambling in my opinion.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Not bad for a guy with a 4.40 ERA so far.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Hxcmilkshake

Jeters on ebay less than $100?? Do send me a link

And you can overpay on any card and lose $$$

What about guys out there that are undervalued? With some luck you can do ok.. buy em cheap, raw, slab em, etc.....thats why I say Ryan in a previous post...Lemieux, Messier (in NY especially) and even Gretzky in the hockey world...

Value!

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Just go to EBay, type in 1993 SP Derek Jeter, then sort by completed auctions and lowest price. There are plenty that have sold for less than 100.

[Hxcmilkshake]

Youre right. Dings, creases, and 6's. Not what i was talking about ...we are talking about cards you can make money on. So yeah i agree lower end modern cards are not a good investment .....

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[rats60]

Originally Posted by Hxcmilkshake

Youre right. Dings, creases, and 6's. Not what i was talking about ...we are talking about cards you can make money on. So yeah i agree lower end modern cards are not a good investment .....

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I count 153 that sold for under 100 and many of those aren't lower end. You can find them with a little effort. Of course, your claim was vague without any facts to base it on. When I asked for details, you didn't provide any.

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by rats60

I count 153 that sold for under 100 and many of those aren't lower end. You can find them with a little effort. Of course, your claim was vague without any facts to base it on. When I asked for details, you didn't provide any.

+1

[Hxcmilkshake]

Originally Posted by rats60

I count 153 that sold for under 100 and many of those aren't lower end. You can find them with a little effort. Of course, your claim was vague without any facts to base it on. When I asked for details, you didn't provide any.

And you provided Cobb, Ruth, Gehrig, and Wagner in your argument. I hear the 52 Mantle is a good card to have too.

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[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by vansaad

I'd say the guys that transcend the sport: Babe Ruth and Jackie Robinson.

+1. Can't do any better than these two. Non-fans know who they are and non-collectors are impressed with their cards: whenever a non-collecting acquaintance asks me about my cards, they always ask about Babe Ruth, Jackie Robinson and Muhammad Ali.