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#1
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There was an interesting post in the "Charleston vs. Clemente" thread that got me thinking. I am a huge history nerd, not just sports history, but history in general. I am curious to see some thoughts on what percentage of the general population posters on here believe are familiar with various old timey athletes. Most of the names I have included are baseball players, but I have thrown in a couple other names, since they have iconic cards in their respective sport.
I have included my personal thoughts for what percentage of the general population is familiar with a particular athlete, but I fully admit that some of my opinions could be way off. I am interested in other people's opinions. A few of the people I listed are still alive, so I realize that may skew the percentage a bit compared to someone who has been dead for 50-75 years. Babe Ruth 99% Muhammad Ali 99% Jackie Robinson 99% Pele 99% Lou Gehrig 95% Mickey Mantle 95% Joe Frazier 80% Roberto Clemente 80% Joe DiMaggio 75% Ty Cobb 75% Shoeless Joe Jackson 60% Wilt Chamberlain 50% Bill Russell 50% Jack Dempsey 30% Joe Louis 30% Rocky Marciano 30% Jim Thorpe 30% Jack Johnson 25% A.J. Foyt 25% Richard Petty 25% Honus Wagner 15% Satchel Paige 15% George Mikan 10% Rogers Hornsby 3% Christy Mathewson 3% Walter Johnson 3% Bobby Jones 2% Bronko Nagurski 2% Josh Gibson 2% Georges Vezina 1% Last edited by Bored5000; 03-07-2018 at 04:21 PM. |
#2
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Interesting concept. At first blush, my gut tells me, with the exception of Ali, the boxers and Pele are probably too high in your percentages. And I think that Honus Wagner might have a higher awareness just based on "The Card."
Vezina is low, but probably known to anyone who knows hockey, so I imagine it might be a bit higher. |
#3
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Too high on Frazier. Too low on Johnson and Mathewson. Too high on Pele. Jordan would also be right at the top.
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Net 54-- the discussion board where people resent discussions. ![]() My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 03-07-2018 at 04:12 PM. |
#4
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![]() I think the biggest test is who is still famous decades after they have been dead or completely out of the public eye. Last edited by Bored5000; 03-07-2018 at 04:21 PM. |
#5
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Is your definition of "the general population" closer to 300 million people or 7.5 billion people?
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#6
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I was thinking United States, so 300 million.
Last edited by Bored5000; 03-07-2018 at 04:23 PM. |
#7
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As the saying goes, never underestimate the stupidity of the American people.
When you are out and about, try casually asking random people (at the checkout counter, in McDonald's, etc.) about some of the people on your list, especially (aside from the names that would obviously be lesser known) players like Roberto Clemente, Rocky Marciano, Pele and others. I'm thinking familiarity with many of those guys will be significantly lower than you imagine. Older people, of course, will look at you like you're stupid, but the relatively younger ones?? I'm sure you'll get a lot of blank stares (but the moment you say 'Rocky,' most people will immediately say, "He's a boxer, right?").
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Elm's Adventures in Cardboard Land ![]() https://www.youtube.com/@TheJollyElm Looking to trade? Here's my bucket: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152396...57685904801706 “I was such a dangerous hitter I even got intentional walks during batting practice.” Casey Stengel Spelling "Yastrzemski" correctly without needing to look it up since the 1980s. Overpaying yesterday is simply underpaying tomorrow. ![]() |
#8
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I don't know about the percentages, but I was familiar with all of them, which I don't think is any great feat. Probably most sports fans who also collect sports cards can say the same.
Best wishes, Larry |
#9
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I’m embarrassed to say that i don’t even know who George Mikan is. I do know Vezina only because of our fellow Net54 member with his card as an avatar. I’m too lazy to even look him up right now. Haha!
Aside from Ruth and Cobb (and maybe Wagner / Cy Young), I doubt my wife could name one other pre-war baseball player. She’d maybe know five names on your entire list. I’ll ask her tonight to verify/refute my intuition. Might quickly get the percentages significantly lower if she’s representative of the general female population. She would know Mantle and a few others just because her dad liked them growing up (she’s 36). Yogi Berra (not listed) would probably also be higher than the prototypical HOfer because of his yogi-isms.
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... http://imageevent.com/derekgranger HOF "Earliest" Collection (Ideal - Indiv): 250/346 (72.3%) 1914 T330-2 Piedmont Art Stamps......: 116/119 (97.5%) 1923 V100 Willard's Chocolate............: 180/180 (100%) |
#10
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Just thought this would be fun to answer as honestly as I can as to who I knew of when I was 20 and who I know now that I am 40.
Babe Ruth 99% Y/Y Muhammad Ali 99% Y/Y Jackie Robinson 99% Y/Y Pele 99% N/Y Lou Gehrig 95% Y/Y Mickey Mantle 95% Y/Y Joe Frazier 80% Y/Y Roberto Clemente 80% Y/Y Joe DiMaggio 75% Y/Y Ty Cobb 75% Y/Y Shoeless Joe Jackson 60% Y/Y Wilt Chamberlain 50% Y/Y (I remember him more from Conan the Destroyer) Bill Russell 50% N/Y Jack Dempsey 30% N/Y Joe Louis 30% Y/Y (Again a movie reference Coming to America) Rocky Marciano 30% Y/Y (See above) Jim Thorpe 30% N/Y Jack Johnson 25% N/Y A.J. Foyt 25% Y/Y Richard Petty 25% Y/Y Honus Wagner 15% Y/Y Satchel Paige 15% Y/Y George Mikan 10% N/N Rogers Hornsby 3% N/Y Christy Mathewson 3% N/Y Walter Johnson 3% N/Y Bobby Jones 2% N/N Bronko Nagurski 2% N/Y Josh Gibson 2% N/Y Georges Vezina 1% N/N |
#11
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I would assume the general population you are referring to are citizens of the US. If it was North American (USA, Canada and Mexico, I would assume it would cause a sizable shift in the percentages). Also some age minimum should be indicated...18 years and older, etc.
edited to indicate slow typing on my behalf... Brian Last edited by brianp-beme; 03-07-2018 at 04:23 PM. |
#12
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Pele is 20% max.
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#13
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how do you determine "is familiar with"? Do you show them a picture and ask who it is? Do you give them a name and ask what they are known for? I think the percents can be varied by a great deal depending on how you set up the survey.
I think Pele is too high either way.
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Br.ia.n Ho.rn.e |
#14
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![]() Quote:
![]() Either way, I guess I was really wrong on Pele. ![]() I appreciate all the responses. Last edited by Bored5000; 03-07-2018 at 05:55 PM. |
#15
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I’d say George Foreman is more recognizable than many on this list...certainly Smokin’ Joe seems especially elevated.
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Thanks! Brian L Familytoad Ridgefield, WA Hall of Fame collector. Prewar Set collector. Topps Era collector. 1971 Topps Football collector. |
#16
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I think all the top athletes are way overstated. Even if you limit your sample group to adult English speaking people it is still overstated. Many people could care less about sports and a non-trivial amount of the people in the U.S. are illiterate (14.5% based on 2003 data).
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#17
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Pete who? Oh, Pele... What's Pele's last name?
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fr3d c0wl3s - always looking for OJs and other 19th century stuff. PM or email me if you have something cool you're looking to find a new home for. |
#18
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Cool thread. I think your numbers are crazy crazy high. Hell, probably 50% of the population can't name the Vice President. Here are my guesses.
Babe Ruth 99% Muhammad Ali 99% Jackie Robinson 90% Pele 20% Lou Gehrig 20% (disease obviously raises name recognition) Mickey Mantle 40% Joe Frazier 10% Roberto Clemente 10% (died too early) Joe DiMaggio 25% (Marilyn; Simon & Garfunkel song) Ty Cobb 5% Shoeless Joe Jackson 5% (mostly because of beloved/hated Field of Dreams) Wilt Chamberlain 10% (reports of 10,000 helped!) Bill Russell 5% Jack Dempsey less than 1% Joe Louis 5% Rocky Marciano 5% Jim Thorpe 1% Jack Johnson 1% A.J. Foyt 1% Richard Petty 20% Honus Wagner 5% Satchel Paige 5% George Mikan less than 1% Rogers Hornsby less than 1% Christy Mathewson less than 1% Walter Johnson less than 1% Bobby Jones less than 1% Bronko Nagurski less than 1% Josh Gibson less than 1% Georges Vezina about .001% Last edited by Snapolit1; 03-07-2018 at 06:56 PM. |
#19
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I doubt 75% of major league baseball players have any idea who a lot of these baseball players are.
Seems like every year there is a news story where some young player admits to a reporter he doesn't know who Jackie Robinson was. |
#20
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The trophy awarded to the NHL goaltender "adjudged to be the best at his position" each season - and every season since 1926-27 - is named in his honour, hence, even casual hockey fans have at least heard and know the name. |
#21
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OK, didn't know that about Vezina. Good point. A major award is named after him. Didn't know that.
By the way, how many people out of 100 in the US do you reckon are serious hockey fans? I can name large racial and ethnic groups that, as a general proposition, have overwhelmingly have very little if any interest in hockey. I think we are all biased in that we overestimate the general interest in things we are interested in. Last edited by Snapolit1; 03-07-2018 at 08:02 PM. |
#22
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It could be a single person out of that 100... and it would blow away that absurd and hyperbolic number you posted. You said it yourself... "I didn't know".... and apparently, you don't.
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#23
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Glad you specified that you're limiting the name recognition to the US. I'm a Canadian who has worked as a sportswriter in Beijing for the past seven years, so I can offer a different perspective. A couple of years ago my paper (circulation 675,000) ran a contest in which readers named their "all time favorite" sports hero. The No. 1 response, by a considerable margin, was Ali ... followed by NBA stars Yao Ming and Michael Jordan. Pele was fourth and David Beckham was fifth.
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#24
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#25
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Most of the guys know I collect, but nobody else does. I made a comment one day in the dressing room that I'm looking at an Art Ross card from 1910 (they wouldn't know what a C56 is). One guy on my team (in his 50's) said "Who's that? Never heard of him." I said "There's a trophy named after him." Now, appreciate the Vezina and the Art Ross are trophies that have been around since the 20's and the 40's respectively, and as well known as the Cy Young to baseball fans. I was embarrassed for the guy, but there is no excuse for ignorance. And he watches more hockey than almost anyone I know. Oh yeah, his dad is the commissioner of the NBA...
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Successful transactions on Net54 with balltrash, greenmonster66; Peter_Spaeth; robw1959; Stetson_1883; boxcar18; Blackie |
#26
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I think it would be hard to find a person who didn't know who Mike Tyson is and he's certainly an all time great.
Last edited by packs; 03-08-2018 at 06:28 PM. |
#27
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Ed Collecting PCL, Southern Association, and type cards. http://hangingjudgesports.com |
#28
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Was sitting here with my mom (75 this year) and asked her if she knew these names. Now sports was very predominate in our household growing up. And she has heard me blather about my card collection, so here are her answers. I figure I'll ask my wife as well and see what her answer will be.
Babe Ruth 99% - yes Muhammad Ali 99% - yes Jackie Robinson 99% - yes Pele 99% - yes Lou Gehrig 95% - yes Mickey Mantle 95% - yes Joe Frazier 80% - yes Roberto Clemente 80% - yes Joe DiMaggio 75% - yes Ty Cobb 75% - yes Shoeless Joe Jackson 60% - yes Wilt Chamberlain 50% - yes Bill Russell 50% - yes Jack Dempsey 30% - yes Joe Louis 30% - yes Rocky Marciano 30% - yes Jim Thorpe 30% - yes Jack Johnson 25% - no A.J. Foyt 25% - yes Richard Petty 25% - yes Honus Wagner 15% - yes Satchel Paige 15% - yes George Mikan 10% - no Rogers Hornsby 3% - yes Christy Mathewson 3% - yes Walter Johnson 3% - yes Bobby Jones 2% - n Bronko Nagurski 2% - no Josh Gibson 2% - no Georges Vezina 1% - no |
#29
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I cut the following list down to only people that have played baseball. The list has the original percentages. I didn't change any of those.
What former major league player is missing from this list that most MLB players have heard of? At least most or all baseball fans know this name? It aint rocket science.... Babe Ruth 99% Jackie Robinson 99% Lou Gehrig 95% Mickey Mantle 95% Roberto Clemente 80% Joe DiMaggio 75% Ty Cobb 75% Shoeless Joe Jackson 60% Jim Thorpe 30% Honus Wagner 15% Satchel Paige 15% Rogers Hornsby 3% Christy Mathewson 3% Walter Johnson 3% Josh Gibson 2%
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fr3d c0wl3s - always looking for OJs and other 19th century stuff. PM or email me if you have something cool you're looking to find a new home for. Last edited by Fred; 03-07-2018 at 09:59 PM. Reason: Removed Ali |
#30
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__________________
Ed Collecting PCL, Southern Association, and type cards. http://hangingjudgesports.com |
#31
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Dang, that was a bit too easy...
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fr3d c0wl3s - always looking for OJs and other 19th century stuff. PM or email me if you have something cool you're looking to find a new home for. |
#32
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Young is a bit of a special case, though, because the award named for him is such a part of baseball to this day. Vezina's only real claim to fame among the public today is that there is an award named for him, and Vezina's award is still not as well known as the Cy Young award is to baseball.
I left Cy Young off the list because I think WaJo and Matty are better indicators of fame, since neither of them have a pitching award named for them that keeps their names in front of the public every year. If there was no such thing as the Cy Young award, his notoriety would go down sharply among the modern population. If there was no such thing as the Heisman Trophy, how many people would ever know John Heisman today? The answer to that is just about zero. Last edited by Bored5000; 03-07-2018 at 11:14 PM. |
#33
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I did the same with my wife. Here are her responses.
Babe Ruth: Y Muhammad Ali: Y Jackie Robinson: Y Pele: Y Lou Gehrig: Y Mickey Mantle: Y Joe Frazier: N Roberto Clemente: "only because I've heard you talk about him" [henceforth "obihytah"] Joe DiMaggio: Y Ty Cobb: Y Shoeless Joe Jackson: Y Wilt Chamberlain: Y Bill Russell: N Jack Dempsey: N Joe Louis: N Rocky Marciano: "Is he a boxer?" Jim Thorpe: N Jack Johnson: "Is he that singer that did the songs for Curious George?" A.J. Foyt: Y [This one was a no for me though.] Richard Petty: N Honus Wagner: obihytah Satchel Paige: obihytah George Mikan: N Rogers Hornsby: obihytah Christy Mathewson: obihytah Walter Johnson: obihytah Bobby Jones: N Bronko Nagurski: N Josh Gibson: N [And this is my favorite player, and I've mentioned that multiple times, and I own a couple of Josh Gibson team baseball caps. Just not a distinctive enough name I guess.] Georges Vezina: N |
#34
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I've been to probably about 75 basketball games in my life, and consider myself a casual fan since Dr. J led the Nets to a few championships at the old Nassau Coliseum. First time I ever heard of George Mikan was on this board when one of his cards sold for a huge number. I posted at the time that I had never heard of this dude and the responses ranges from incredulity to "you can't be serious!?"
Many of these people are known today for reasons completely unrelated to their sports accomplishments. No doubt my wife knows Joe DiMaggio from Mr. Coffee, not what he did for the Yankees. Shoeless Joe from Field of Dreams, etc. Last edited by Snapolit1; 03-09-2018 at 07:52 AM. |
#35
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I don't even think Joe Jackson is really that well known at all. The general public might know about a world series being thrown but I'd be surprised if the average person could tell you what year it happened or what team threw it.
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#36
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I know that DiMaggio's name recognition is bolstered today among living fans by the Mr. Coffee ads. I also wonder how many people today know him for being married to Marilyn Monroe.
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#37
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I would say almost no one. If you know who DiMaggio is I would think your point of reference is the Yankees or baseball or one of the songs he's featured in (Joltin' Joe/ Mrs. Robinson). I would think Monroe as your only point of reference is pretty rare.
Last edited by packs; 03-09-2018 at 09:40 AM. |
#38
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He was also the face on ads for a bank in New York City in the 1980's. I recall seeing it, but was from out of town so the bank name does not come to mind.
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'Integrity is what you do when no one is looking' "The man who can keep a secret may be wise, but he is not half as wise as the man with no secrets to keep” |
#39
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These 99% recognition figures are crazy. I think the likely number for Ruth and Robinson nationwide are under 90%. There are over 1% of the people in this country who wouldn't recognize their own name.
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#40
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OK... just thought that I would do the same with my wife... for a different point of view (like the Chinese newspaper perspective) as she is Mexican and in her 40's and lived in the USA for less than 10 years.
I asked another question... who are 5 most important athletes of all time (no pre-established criteria)... Here are the responses: Ali Pele Diego Maradona Jackie Robinson Babe Ruth A bit interesting for me that there were 2 baseball players, although Jackie is probably more important for the social impact. I kindof expected 2 soccer players (and these two specifically) and Ali. She thought that pretty much all of the good baseball players played for the Yankees. Her knowledge of Josh Gibson and Satchel Paige are probably due to my collecting focus as well, I would not assume that most wives know these guys! Also my wife asked if we can open a "support group" for the wives of collectors! Here are the results on the broader list: Babe Ruth Yes Muhammad Ali Yes Jackie Robinson Yes Pele Yes Lou Gehrig No Mickey Mantle Yes - player for the Red Sox Joe Frazier No Roberto Clemente Yes - player for Yankees Joe DiMaggio Yes - player for the Yankees Ty Cobb Yes - Player for the Yankees Shoeless Joe Jackson No Wilt Chamberlain - No Bill Russell - No (heard the name) Jack Dempsey - No Joe Louis - No Rocky Marciano - Yes Jim Thorpe - No Jack Johnson - No A.J. Foyt - No Richard Petty - No Honus Wagner - Yes - not sure who he played for Satchel Paige - Yes George Mikan - No Rogers Hornsby - No Christy Mathewson - No Walter Johnson - Yes - pitcher - not sure of team Bobby Jones - No Bronko Nagurski - No Josh Gibson - Yes Georges Vezina - No |
#41
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I love that she had Mantle with the Red Sox.
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#42
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me too!
but hated that she placed pretty much everybody else on the Yankees
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Al Jurgela Looking for: 1910 Punch (Plank) 50 Hage's Dairy (Minoso) All Oscar Charleston Cards Rare Soccer cards Rare Boxing cards |
#43
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Here are my wife's answers. Sports except for 49er football, was not very prevalent growing up in her household.
Babe Ruth 99% - yes Muhammad Ali 99% - yes Jackie Robinson 99% - yes Pele 99% - yes Lou Gehrig 95% - yes Mickey Mantle 95% - yes Joe Frazier 80% - yes Roberto Clemente 80% - yes Joe DiMaggio 75% - yes Ty Cobb 75% - yes Shoeless Joe Jackson 60% - yes Wilt Chamberlain 50% - yes Bill Russell 50% - no Jack Dempsey 30% - no Joe Louis 30% - yes Rocky Marciano 30% - yes Jim Thorpe 30% - yes Jack Johnson 25% - no A.J. Foyt 25% - no Richard Petty 25% - no Honus Wagner 15% - yes Satchel Paige 15% - yes George Mikan 10% - no Rogers Hornsby 3% - no Christy Mathewson 3% - yes Walter Johnson 3% - no Bobby Jones 2% - no Bronko Nagurski 2% - no Josh Gibson 2% - no Georges Vezina 1% - no Last edited by DeanH3; 03-10-2018 at 05:52 PM. |
#44
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I’m going to run through this with my fiancé tomorrow. She told me that she doesn’t think she will do well, but I disagree. She does like sports and listens to the things I talk about. I believe she’s far past the average person.
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