T201 Mecca - Master Set/New Discovery/New Theory

[Marslife]

T201 Mecca Double Folders – Master Set Complete? New Discovery, New Theory?

see last post! Master Set Completed@

Hey All!

I am one of the fortunate folks that got my start to my tobacco card collection by winning the tobacco card lottery. My Grandpap was 12 years old in 1909; he was one of those “Newsies” hawking newspapers on the streets of NYC, while he was smoking Mecca cigarettes. I am sure he also harassed gentlemen coming out of the tobacco store begging for the double folders from their fresh packs. When he passed I inherited his shoebox of prized possessions from his rough childhood, amazed that they survived all those years!

He was obviously a Mecca man as most of the cards I inherited were the awesome double folders. Initially I had 65 or so double folders. I started swapping/trading or selling dupes to eventually make a full set. I then began upgrading, completed a few more sets to sell at auction, and fell under the “Master Set” spell. I began pursuing Factory sets about 2 years ago. My purchase of a Rucker/Daubert Factory 30 back last night, I believe (see below) completes my master set run (49/50 Factory 30 & 50/50 Factory 649).

By compiling several sets, research and reading about the double folders, the general hobby consensus is that the Lord/Dougherty is the only “short print” in the set as it could only be found with a Factory 649 back. I observed that the Lord/Dougherty is actually quite prevalent and easy to find for sale, albeit with a bit of a premium price.

My personal observations, as well as observations and postings from several other members are that the Kling/Cole is one of the harder cards to find. So here is my breaking news on the set.

I FOUND A Factory 30 Lord/Dougherty!! Located and purchased at the national this year. Photo is attached. I don’t know if this is one of a kind, or if there are many others out there and collectors just have not been cognizant of the Factory designations?? Admittedly I have been checking for another with a Factory 30 back since the National and haven’t located another.

Here is my NEW THEORY: I believe that the Kling/Cole is actually the short print of the set as I have been searching for a Kling/Cole Factory 30 back for 2 years and have not found one. I would ask that members of the Board search their Kling/Cole backs and either support or refute my theory. I would like to know either way. If none are found with a Factory 30 then my theory is likely correct. If there are Factory 30 Kling/Cole’s out there then my Master Set quest will continue!

I would appreciate any comments &/or assistance in searching for the Kling/Cole F30 back. If you find one of course would be interested in purchasing or swapping as I have many T201 dupes.

Thanks for your time and assistance!!

Also I would like to thank fellow Board members for assisting with swaps & sales of T201’s to help me along the way. Also special shout to Zach Wheat for sharing his knowledge and for the awesome T201 article in the Old Cardboard magazine. Also special acknowledgement to Keith Temple for his continued support of my upgrade quests.

Thanks again!

Cliff

photo 1.jpg

photo 2.jpg

[nolemmings]

Congrats on your acquisition! I know what a kick it is to find a scarce variation after looking for so long. I don't collect T201 myself, but was wondering if you could explain or point us to where there is a discussion of how the T201s were printed and/or their sheet assignments. For example, why isn't the Lord/Dougherty a short-print even though you found one? Sounds like it's tough and you wonder if it might be one of a kind--that would meet the criteria of a short print, no?

I used to collect T202s which, as you may know, were also printed only at Factories 30 and 649. The latter printed the backs only in black and the former mostly in red, but advanced collectors know that there are Fact 30s that can be found in black--not ridiculously scarce but far from common. Most sales make no distinction and ask for no premium, which may be happening here, although it sounds like you've scoured the market and come up empty. Good luck in your quest and please keep us posted.

[drmondobueno]

That is so cool to have a master set complete (unh, we think, pending proof to the contrary). Cant remember where I read the Lord card was shortprinted with factory 30 being the culprit but it's more than one source (maybe just one source, others repeating? Who knows at this point?)

No F30 Lord/Dougherty here, altho I have three F649 myself. As for Cole/kling, it took me over two years to find a decent quality specimen in factory 649 and it's still not the grade I am looking for. Oh well.

Be well, happy hunting!

[freakhappy]

Cliff...great work! The 201 set never seems to get the credit it deserves.

I checked mine and both are factory 649. And to possibly add to what you are stating about Kling/Cole...it was one of the last six I needed to complete my set. Kling/Cole was probably the one card in the set that I had a hard time finding and was never available in abundance.

Keep up the good work!


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[Bugsy]

Originally Posted by freakhappy

Kling/Cole was probably the one card in the set that I had a hard time finding and was never available in abundance.

Same here. That was the last one I needed for my set. I thought it was by far the toughest in the set. It was really tough in the pre-internet days.

[Tao_Moko]

Experienced the same with Kling/Cole. I did not collect the entire set, just certain players and abandoned it for imagery reasons before I ever landed the Kling. This thread should get some hype behind them.

[Fred]

Cliff,

Nice thread.

Now, if you really wanted to take on a T201 project regarding the different Factory Numbers then you could track ebay (there's always a lot of T201s for sale) and come up with a distribution of the different Factory Numbers.

What would you say the distribution is? Are there (5) Factory 649 for every Factory 30 back?

How many people went to ebay after reading this thread to see how many Factory 30 backs there were and how many looked for a Kling/Cole Factory 30 T201?

I've always liked the T201 set because it provides a beginning collector with a realistic chance of completing a "T" card set.

[drmondobueno]

Originally Posted by Fred

Cliff,

Nice thread.

Now, if you really wanted to take on a T201 project regarding the different Factory Numbers then you could track ebay (there's always a lot of T201s for sale) and come up with a distribution of the different Factory Numbers.

What would you say the distribution is? Are there (5) Factory 649 for every Factory 30 back?

How many people went to ebay after reading this thread to see how many Factory 30 backs there were and how many looked for a Kling/Cole Factory 30 T201?

I've always liked the T201 set because it provides a beginning collector with a realistic chance of completing a "T" card set.

Good questions. Unfortunately any survey will be skewed by the number of cards represented outside of eBay. Did a quick review of the cards I hold, around 62 purchased irregardless of backs , or factory number. Ten cards are F30, so around six to one?

You gotta start somewhere...

Keith

[GeoPoto]

It's not WaJo

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[nolemmings]

Here's one I used to own--that's Crawford and Cobb joining Turner and Stovall

[Marslife]

WOW!!!

NICE FIND ROB!

According to my tabulations, your Lord/Dougherty Factory 30 is the third known copy!

I found one years ago (original post) at the National. My T201 buddy and T201 Guru & board member Mike Wheat just stole one off Ebay last month!

lord F30.jpg
lord front.jpg


Your copy makes number THREE that has come to light!

I suspect that there was at least one sheet of Factory 30's made so if a sheet was a minimum of 9 cards there should be 6 more floating around. Based upon some of the miscuts that Mike and I have been collecting it seems that some of the popular players had at least one line across of copies on a sheet, with some of the lesser players having only one or two copies per sheet?

this theory may be out the window with the new post of the Cobb with turner/stovall :-(

Regardless... great set, keep the miscuts coming Mike and I are trying to archive them with hopes to do something with them someday :-)

Still working on the T201 Master Set, still missing the Kling/Cole Factory 30 with only one copy known that Mr. Wheat has, although recent update a generoud board member may be able to hook me up with my very own copy

Will post an update accordingly...

NICE FIND ROB!

[brianp-beme]

T201 cards are a must have if you like odd angular cuts.

Brian

[T206Collector]

T201s are great signed. I love mine.

Here’s one signed by Leifield and stamped by Burdick:



Here’s Doyle/Meyers signed by both:



All of my signed T201s lined up in a beautiful row...