Is T213-2 Coupon a complete set at 185?

[RCMcKenzie]

I have mostly focused on T213-1 and some on T213-3. Recently, I've started studying T213-2 and have realized that many hobby veterans think that there are really only 185 cards in the set. Questions? Answers?

t213rudolph23142.jpg

[DeanH3]

I sure wish I was more knowledgeable on this set so I could engage in a meaningful discussion. I think it's a beautiful and underrated issue. Hopefully I can help get the ball rolling.

[t213]

Yes, the set is complete at 185. The guide is wrong.

Andy

[buymycards]

Hi,
This is very interesting. Lew Lipsett lists the set as complete at 187 cards. SCD shows 188 cards. The difference is Demmitt. Lew shows him as Chicago American. SCD shows him as Chicago American with NY uniform and Chicago American with St Louis uniform.

The #1 set on the SGC registry is missing 5 cards:

Demmitt Chicago American NY uniform

Magee Philadelphia National - the #2 set has this card

McQuillan Phila Nat. - there is a mislabeled SGC slab on ebay - it is actually the Pittsburgh version.

Reulbach Brooklyn Fed

Sweeney Richmond

So, if the set only has 185 cards, 3 of the 4 cards listed above were never made - Demmitt, McQuillan, Reulback, or Sweeney. Does anyone have one of these cards? None of them are listed on ebay at the moment and I haven't checked the PSA registry.

Update - None of these cards are in the PSA set registry or pop reports. However, the SGC pop reports shows 1 Demmitt with NY uniform and 2 Sweeney Richmond.

That means 186 cards with 2 missing - Reulbach Brooklyn Fed. and McQuillan Phila. Nat. (If the pop reports are correct and no cards were incorrectly listed and graded.)


Rick

[deadballfreaK]

Which three are thought to not exist?

[cfc1909]

I worked on this set for a while and got to about half way.

After talking with some hobby friends that were way farther along and had more knowledge about the set I decided to just keep the Baltimore players.

The set has several different difficulty levels.

There have been several large finds and none have had the 3 cards in question including this latest find with Gary.

I will let the guys that have more experience and knowledge about the set reveal the exact 3 cards.

Andy already chimed in and confirmed the set is 185.

very cool set with the same images as t206 but much more difficult than 206 and it gets no respect.

It took me many years to get the Dunn Baltimore and now I have 3 because it was so difficult I have bought a couple more when I saw them available.
I think I am Dunn buying Dunn..

[Wite3]

I can say that I own a Magee Philadelphia Nat, so that exists...of course, I am missing the Magee Phila. Nat. card (if anyone has an off-condition one)...

I have seen the McQuillan Phila. Nat. card but have never seen a McQuillan Philadelphia Nat. card at all...I do not think it exists.

Andy Cook has done a ton of research on this set and is nearing completion or has completed it already. Hopefully, he will chime in.

Joshua

[cfc1909]

Andy is post #3 Josh

[Sean1125]

So what can you guys tell me about this card? What is it worth?

[Sean1125]

Is this the Philadelphia Nat. you are talking about?

[Wite3]

I was hoping Andy would elaborate on which cards should not be included in the set.

Sean, I would not mind seeing the backs of those cards if you get a chance.

Joshua

[buymycards]

Hi Sean, thank you for your scans. Your McQuillan is Philadelphia National. The one we are looking for is Phila. Nat.

Your Demmitt NY uniform is the only one listed in the SGC pop report and there are none listed in the PSA pop report. Maybe a one of a kind card? I don't know.

So, we are still missing McQuillan Phila. Nat. and Reulbach Brooklyn Fed.

I have been collecting this set for a couple of years but I am not even close to being an expert. There are several people on the board who are experts and I wish they would post. It seems like, unlike T206's, information on the Coupons is a closely guarded secret.

Rick

[t213]

The three missing cards are
Magee Phila Nat
McQuillan Phila Nat
Reulbach Brooklyn Fed

All three of the missing cards would have been issued in 1915 print run. All "Phila" cards were 1915.

Neither Magee or McQuillan were Phillies that year. Reulbach never had any connection with the Brooklyn Fed team (this was the series of Net54 thread about 4-5 years ago).

Andy

[Sean1125]

Those cards are from Gary's find. I will try to get him to chime in and get additional scans.

[atx840]

Great info guys.

[buymycards]

I went back and took a look at the #2 set at SGC. I thought they had the Magee but it was Philadelphia - not Phila.

Thanks for the updated info.

Now the question is - how did they get added to Lew Lipsett's checklist in the first place? Did he see these? It would be easy to make a mistake with Philadelphia, Phila. etc. - especially back in the days when computers were coming into play and a lot of his info must have been hand collated.

Andy - what do you think about Seans Demmitt NY uniform? Have you seen any others?

Rick

[Zach Wheat]

Rick,

I have never collected the set, but this is good information. Thanks.

Z Wheat

[Mikehealer]

Rick, there was a Demmit, New York uniform in the lot of Coupons in the recent Heritage auction that ended in early May. No scan of the card though.

http://sports.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleN...lotIdNo=147001

[t213]

Demmitt with NY shirt is very difficult; I think I've only known of about 4-5 of them - and most of those were in established collections and not on the market.

Andy

[t213]

On the errant Phila cards - I think someone once made a simplifying assumption when they were compiling the checklist that every Philadelphia card must have a corresponding Phila card. It's only when you break down each card by potential year of issue that it's clear this just isn't so. One player I'd point to is Collins who has three cards:
Philadelphia (1914)
Chicago with A on shirt (1915)
Chicago no A on shirt (1916)

Andy