A PINBACK MYSTERY - baseball or football?

[ooo-ribay]

A few days ago, I posted a pic of one of my NY (baseball) Giants pin cases. A board member (Joe aka icollectDCsports) PM'ed me to tell me he was "pretty sure" (90%) my "Scalp the Giants" pin was a Washington Redskins pinback and the Giants referred to were the NY (football) Giants. The red and yellow colors would support Joe's theory. Joe wondered if I had some reason to believe the pin is a baseball pin.

I actually had two reasons (at first)....I got my pin with a baseball bat "dangle" and I was also going by Paul Muchinsky's opinion that a button maker would be more likely to make a pin for a SERIES than for a single game. In this case, the 1954 World Series.

Joe and I sent a few more PM's back and forth and Muchinsky's book seemed to yield more clues which, I thought, increased the likelihood that this is, indeed, a baseball pin. The Cleveland Indians definitely used this indian head logo (as did the Boston Braves) and they did utilize the red and yellow color scheme.

So, I'm thinking...case closed, baseball pin....until Joe sends me an ebay link to the Redskins pin . As far as the "Scalp the Giants" pin, does anyone know for sure if this is Cleveland Indians or Washington Redskins?

[icollectDCsports]

A fun mystery. I've seen the "Scalp the Giants" pinback sold among other items in older Redskins collections on a couple of occasions over the years and, because of the yellow and red colors and the same profile logo as the other Redskins pinback of the same period, I'd assumed it was related to that team. Now seeing what appear to be red print with yellow (as opposed to white) backgrounds also used for a couple of Indians pinbacks (as shown in Muchinsky's book), I don't think my assumption (and that of at least some others) was necessarily correct. Suppose it could've been marketed for both, and baseball related dangles added in relation to the '54 Series. Or maybe it was produced exclusively for the Indians. But would be good to know if others have more specific info about it's intended use.

[MK]

I doubt we we ever know the answer to this and many other pinback questions. I have always thought it was a Washington Redskins pin based on the color and their big rivalry with the Giants. As to the attached bat, I don't think that proves anything as anyone could add it at any time. Undoubtedly, generic NY Giant pins with baseball hangers that were not sold during baseball season had those removed and footballs added for sale during football season.

[ooo-ribay]

All we need is either a photo match or testimony from someone who bought one of these when new!

[batsballsbases]

Rob,
We may never know the the reason why but probably these pins were know as duel pins. As they could be used for more than 1 sport thus saving the pin maker (and vendor) money ,didnt have to wait for the next baseball season to sell unsold pins just change dangles and bam new point of sale football to baseball and visa versa. There are alot of baseball giant pins and football giant pins that can be used either way. As was pointed out NEVER go by the dangle easy to change and really only attribute it if it is team specific or has a ribbon for a specific event. As for your pin I would lean more toward football than baseball. And remember Paul wasnot always right about pins. We (Paul and I)have had may an argument about this very subject. Here is one case in point Paul and I never spoke after this one as he didnt like being wrong... In the pinback book as allstar. I told him to start there was never an allstar game played in New Orleans. Then to back up my findings I showed him this. Now to this day (and I have told him also) there is someone on ebay who is a huge pin seller still lists that pin as BASEBALL allstar. This was an east west shrine football game moved from Ca. to New Orleans during world war 2 for fear that the Japanese planes could reach Ca but couldnt reach New Orleans and kill many people at the site. Only time the game was ever moved. Listed in Pauls book so it must be right

[ooo-ribay]

Everything you say is true, Al. I see many "GIANTS" or "NEW YORK GIANTS" pins that were used for both the football and baseball teams.This is not surprising at all, especially since the teams shared the Polo Grounds until 1956. The difference with the "Scalp Those Giants" pin is that the baseball Indians and football Redskins play 375 miles apart from each other. I think this pin was made for one team or the other but not used by both. Alas, I doubt I'll get to the bottom of this, short of finding a vintage photo of a baseball or football fan wearing this pin.