Hey, pennant guys

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by bocca001

2) I also found that the 12 x 36 toploaders work ok for oversized pennants. See the three Santa Clara pennants below. It took a few minutes to get them in a more or less centered position and they aren't perfectly centered, but I'll be able to hang them (eventually).

Nice job on fitting those Oversized Pennants to the rectangular toploaders. I wasn't sure whether the 12" width would be enough, but they look terrific.

And I do agree with Rob on the Single Bar Helmet... Early '70s era, at latest.

[bocca001]

And I do agree with Rob on the Single Bar Helmet... Early '70s era, at latest.[/QUOTE]


It has probably been discussed here before, but when did the super rigid pennants come into existence? Stylistically, I thought earlier as well. But the pennant is similar in feel (really, really rigid) to this yellow pennant from 1981/1982 that also has no NFL logo (although it does have a two bar helmet) and some others that I can date to right around 1980-1982.

[Fballguy]

Rigid pennants date back to the 1960s. I have several Super Bowl XVI pennants that feel as rigid as "1967" single bar helmet pennants which date to the late 60's, early 70s.

[bocca001]

Thanks, Rob. I like it even better now.

[jimm]

Very nice Niners

[bocca001]

Originally Posted by perezfan

Nice job on fitting those Oversized Pennants to the rectangular toploaders. I wasn't sure whether the 12" width would be enough, but they look terrific.

And I do agree with Rob on the Single Bar Helmet... Early '70s era, at latest.

Thanks, Mark. I've had those three pennants for years. Seems useful to use these for storage and/or display.

I e-mailed BCW and ultrapro a few years ago to ask about making a larger pennant toploader. They were willing to do it as a special order if I ordered some crazy number (in the thousands). It wasn't in my budget.

[jester]

Some recent acquired pennants.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by thetahat

I check this thread every day ... anyone got anything new and neat???

I'd say that the above post qualifies. Amazing pickups, Jeff!

[thetahat]

Originally Posted by perezfan

I'd say that the above post qualifies. Amazing pickups, Jeff!

It sure does! Awesome! Thanks guys. I’ll post a few myself soon.

[Duluth Eskimo]

Somebody has been busy. I’ve always like that 1939 WS pennant. Never got that one though. I have the Cinc version that is much more common for my collection. I see the Tigers pennant went to a good home too. That one has great character and little wear. You got some real tough ones there.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by jester

Some recent acquired pennants.

Every one of those is awesome. Wow!

[Fballguy]

Just in case anyone was wondering...I didn't really get this at Lelands. I'll stick to knock knock jokes with this crowd.

On a cold streak right now...but the upshot is my savings account is off life support.

Originally Posted by Fballguy

It's been a wasteland lately, but I did pick this up in the last Lelands auction.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by Fballguy

Just in case anyone was wondering...I didn't really get this at Lelands. I'll stick to knock knock jokes with this crowd.

Don't quit your day job.

[ooo-ribay]

I'm posting this here because I just realized it ties in with Kyle's incredible pennant research...

https://pennantfever.weebly.com/blog.../trench-mfg-co

I picked up this duplicate because it is a tough and unique pin and I couldn't pass it up for 10 bucks. I just now noticed the Sportservice "Double S" mark. Of my 800+ Giants pins, I think this is the only one with that mark...

[Domer05]

Nice pick-up, Rob. Love it when these pins come with the ribbon and trinket combo.

So, the Sportservice concessionaire's mark tells us this was likely purchased inside the ballpark--maybe even with a pennant.

Any maker's mark on the backside?

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by Domer05

Nice pick-up, Rob. Love it when these pins come with the ribbon and trinket combo.

So, the Sportservice concessionaire's mark tells us this was likely purchased inside the ballpark--maybe even with a pennant.

Any maker's mark on the backside?

No makers mark; just what we pin guys call the Union “bug.”

[bocca001]

Two recent pickups. The top pennant is pretty common, but I had been looking for one in Astros colors (it's blue and orange... my picture makes it look black). It has the double s Sportservice baseball logo.

I have been looking at Astrons pennants for a few years (sometimes more seriosuly than others), but had never seen the bottom one before. Most Astros pennants from the 60s through the 80s focus on the Astrodome. I like the tequila sunrise pattern on this one. It's a bit rough, but seems to be uncommon.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by bocca001

Two recent pickups. The top pennant is pretty common, but I had been looking for one in Astros colors (it's blue and orange... my picture makes it look black). It has the double s Sportservice baseball logo.

I have been looking at Astrons pennants for a few years (sometimes more seriosuly than others), but had never seen the bottom one before. Most Astros pennants from the 60s through the 80s focus on the Astrodome. I like the tequila sunrise pattern on this one. It's a bit rough, but seems to be uncommon.

Bleach canidate?

[bocca001]

Yeah... what about the red? Likely to run?

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by bocca001

Yeah... what about the red? Likely to run?

I did red pennant of that era with great success. My 1962, not so much. I’ll post a pic tomorrow.

As Clint asked, “Well, are you feeling lucky?”

[Domer05]

An eBay auction recently closed offering an early 1960s complete set of American League mini-pennants. See: https://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-MINT-1....m43663.l10137

Perhaps one of you won it?

I'm curious about the manufacturer, as I see these minis individually all the time. The same company also sold a similar set featuring National League teams.

I will post a photo from this listing and a separate one featuring the original card headers. Does anyone recognize the manufacturer? There appears to be a name or logo in the upper left corner of the card header, above the word "Colorful" but neither I nor the seller could make it out.

[Fballguy]

I didn't win it but here's a better pick. Hanco? Hancock?

[ooo-ribay]

Cool little set, Kyle. I didn't win and I'm not sure of the manufacturer. I have a different set of minis in original packaging. I'll check them.

Marc - here's the red pennant I bleached. It came out great. It's older than yours. I think I've seen it in a 1964 merchandise mailer. Which is weird, because my 1962 pennant was ruined...

[Fballguy]

I wouldn't recommend bleaching that Astros. I experimented with a couple late 60s/early 70's pennants a while back and the results wouldn't be classified as a success.

[perezfan]

One of us must be color-blind. I see those graphics as orange (not red). Not sure if that difference matters much, with regard to bleaching. But wanted to point it out, just in case.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by perezfan

One of us must be color-blind. I see those graphics as orange (not red). Not sure if that difference matters much, with regard to bleaching. But wanted to point it out, just in case.

Damn good point, Mark!

[bocca001]

I may hold off on the Astros.... but I do have a copy of that same Giants pennant that could use some cleaning.

[Domer05]

Rob: You are correct! It is HANCO, a pennant maker from New York City apparently, as confirmed by this label from a vintage Seaworld pennant I just came across. (See: https://www.ebay.com/i/142667782228?chn=ps)

Suffice it to say, I had never heard of them before.

I guess the logo is supposed to be a painter's palette, with a smaller pennant draped across it emblazoned with the name "HANCO".

Curious if HANCO ever made any other sports pennants beyond those AL/NL minis, which seem to have been made in the early 1960s...?

[bocca001]

I had a good US mail day. Two SF pennants that are tough to come by, both in decent shape (the Giants one is blue... my pics always make them look black).

The Santa Clara one is an upgrade, from Pennant Dynasty (who sought me out from reading this board. Thanks!). It is a Chicago Pennant Company pennant, with leather. It looks like is just came off the shelf today.

[perezfan]

Nice pennants and heck of an upgrade, Marc!

What an awesome early pennant. Matt (pennant dynasty) is a great guy and has helped me out countless times. He really has an eye for the good stuff, and is one of the best (if not the very best) ebay dealers.

[Fballguy]

Since we're showing San Francisco pennants...This is a recent addition. Not sure why, but I love these star spangled variations.

[bocca001]

Nice, Rob. Would love to see more SF/Bay Area pennants. I wonder if ooo-ribay has any SF pennants that he has never shown?

I'm also curious to know when the single bar helmet pennants came into existence. I assume that they exist for every NFL and AFL team (that was in existence in the 1960s)?

[Fballguy]

Yes...There are single bar face mask pennants for every team in existence from 1963-1976 including the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, but excluding (as far as I can tell) the Seattle Seahawks. Many teams have multiple variations.

I say 1963 because all AFL teams* (note the asterisk there...more on that in a minute) have single bar face mask pennants except the Dallas Texans and the New York Titans...who both ceased to exist by 1963.

*One anomaly regarding AFL teams. All post 1963 AFL teams, including the Bengals who were the last team to join the AFL, have single bar pennants with the AFL logo...except apparently the Miami Dolphins. I have never seen and can't find evidence of a Dolphins single bar pennant with the AFL logo (NFL logo or no logo yes). Initially, I thought it was because the Dolphins joined the AFL too late, but the Bengals joined later. Anybody have one?

Rob

[Fballguy]

Speaking of football pennant anomalies...I love this style of pennant. College teams show up in this style more often than pro, but there are several pro teams out there. I attribute these to the early 60s.

The anomaly...For pro versions of this pennant, the only teams I've ever seen have come from the old NFL East Division. I've seen Giants, Eagles, Browns and Steelers. No teams from the West Division...Rams, Packers, Colts, 49ers, Bears, Lions or Vikings.

Coincidence? Or was there a different style for the West? The Rams, Packers, Colts etc do have similarly colorful pennants in this era...but very different designs.

Sidenote...If anyone has a pro version of this pennant, I'd love to see a picture and would be interested in buying.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by Fballguy

Speaking of football pennant anomalies...I love this style of pennant. College teams show up in this style more often than pro, but there are several pro teams out there. I attribute these to the early 60s.

The anomaly...For pro versions of this pennant, the only teams I've ever seen have come from the old NFL East Division. I've seen Giants, Eagles, Browns and Steelers. No teams from the West Division...Rams, Packers, Colts, 49ers, Bears, Lions or Vikings.

Coincidence? Or was there a different style for the West? The Rams, Packers, Colts etc do have similarly colorful pennants in this era...but very different designs.

Sidenote...If anyone has a pro version of this pennant, I'd love to see a picture and would be interested in buying.

Kind of similar to these....the black one has the big guy, surrounded by small guys and the red one has the stars and a very similar "New York."

[bocca001]

Thanks for the info on the single bar pennants, Fballguy.

I just noticed that my new 49ers pickup has a Trench label on it. From Domer's website, that would seem to date it to the early 60's.

[Domer05]

Originally Posted by bocca001

Thanks for the info on the single bar pennabts, Fballguy.

I just noticed that my new 49ers pickup has a Trench label on it. From Domer's website, that would seem to date it to the early 60's.

By no means am I a football pennant expert ... that's clearly Fballguy's lane. I will defer to him on this, but your 'niners pennant looks to be from the late 60s, early 70s. Which, if true, is why I am shocked to learn it had a sewn label from Trench! I was under the impression Trench only used these in the early 60s, and for a limited time.

Rob G., your thoughts??

[perezfan]

That Niners logo is circa mid-sixties. I am sure that pennant was produced between the years of 1965-68. Perhaps Rob can pinpoint it a bit further, but they did not use that particular logo for very long.

[bocca001]

Based on a quick review of 49ers stuff listed on ebay, the image appears for the first time on a 1967 team card, and for the last time on all 1969 49ers topps cards.

I know that some of the single bar helmet pennants have an NFL logo with the year 1967 specifically mentioned. Not sure if that is related in some way to the need for the Trench label. Maybe there was no need for a label after the implementation of the 1967 restricted trademark logo?

[Fballguy]

I love the 60's NFL logos. That Niner logo was used from 1965-1972, but I'd say that pennant is definitely from the earlier part of that period. I have several of that Niner pennant (not sure why) and none have a tag or evidence of one ever being there. Pretty unusual Marc.

[ooo-ribay]

Originally Posted by Domer05

Rob G., your thoughts??

I have none.

[Domer05]

Originally Posted by Fballguy

I love the 60's NFL logos. That Niner logo was used from 1965-1972, but I'd say that pennant is definitely from the earlier part of that period. I have several of that Niner pennant (not sure why) and none have a tag or evidence of one ever being there. Pretty unusual Marc.

Rob, when would you say Trench used that sewn label, in your experience? I was thinking early 60s, like 1960, when I learned that Trench was first awarded a license from the NFL to make pennants. And since I usually observe more Trench football pennants from that era with no label at all, my impression was they only used labels for a short window of time. Is that correct?

Seems like the whole point of the label was to tell the consumer (and their competitors) that use of these team names and logos now required a license--and Trench was the recipient of one. In other words, "The pennant you just purchased is officially licensed merchandise." Therefore, it would surprise me to learn that they were still using labels in 1965, five years later. Or, that they would not start using the labels until five years after first securing the license.

On a side note, I am working on an update to my Trench post. I have identified (unlicensed) Trench football pennants made in the late 1940s and early 50s, which I had not realized were theirs. This means that Trench was actually making football pennants much earlier than 1960, as I had mistakenly believed when I wrote my last piece.

[bocca001]

Originally Posted by ooo-ribay

I have none.

It's tricky having two Rob G's on here.

[MCyganik]

I know nothing about pennants... is this Red Sox pennant anything special or just a vintage homemade folk art kind of thing? Made of felt, about 15x5.5 inches...

Pennant.jpg

[ooo-ribay]

Notfolk art. Pretty old, I would say (1930’s?).

That said, I think its small size and “plainess” would make it not all that desirable/valuable. Other guys know more than I....I live in mylittle Giants world.

[erikc21]

Hey guys - been a while since I’ve been on here. Some great pickups and conversations lately! Here are a few of my pickups the last few months (a couple of phantoms in there). Hope everybody is well - I need to participate more than I have lately!!

[Fballguy]

Great finds Eric! You know how I feel about the 49ers and Eagles pennants.

Sweet all star pennant as well.

Let me know when you're having your yard sale.

[Fballguy]

Originally Posted by Domer05

Rob, when would you say Trench used that sewn label, in your experience? I was thinking early 60s, like 1960, when I learned that Trench was first awarded a license from the NFL to make pennants. And since I usually observe more Trench football pennants from that era with no label at all, my impression was they only used labels for a short window of time. Is that correct?

Sorry for the delayed response...I'm going to try and make time today to go through some of my pennants. I know I've seen that label in my collection somewhere. Just have to find it. I want to say on a Rams photo pennant from around 1962...but I may be mistaken. I'll let you know what I find.

[ooo-ribay]

Yeah, Erik, great pennants!

So......Mays played for the Millers and the hockey team was the Millers. What is it they “mill” in Minneapolis.

[gradedcollectibles10]

Even though it has seen better days...I think it’s very cool. I have only seen 2 others in this style. Does anyone know if its one of the tougher to find ones?