O/T autographed '53 Topps Mantle

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Posted By: peter chao

Guys,

I have a '53 Topps Mantle in vg condition autographed by Mickey Mantle. The card and autograph is ungraded. I have no plans to sell the card. However, I have always been curious as to whether the card itself is any more valuable on the market because it's signed. Perhaps it's worth less. If you have an opinion, let me know, thanks.

Your opinion may influence whether I get cards signed in the future.

Peter

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Posted By: davidcycleback

If the autograph is sharp, it's probably worth more with the signature. If you get the card and sig authenticated by PSA or SGC, you'll have no trouble finding a buyer.

For getting autographs signed, consider the value of he card and the value of a signature. It's not always best to get a $3 autograph on a $1,000 card, though it would be fine to get the $3 autograph on a $3 or even $20 card. For example, if you have a Gem Mint 1968 Topps Nolan Ryan/Jerry Koosman rookie, it might not be the best idea to have Koosman sign across the front. But getting Koosman's sig on a 1978 Topps sound like a good idea. With the 53T Mantle, the card is valuable and Mantle's autograph, while not rare, is also valueable.

For lower grade semi-valuable cards, an autograph can be a nice edition and raise value. For example, an Eddie Murray or Robin Yount signed Very Good rookie.

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Posted By: fkw

IMO, With a player like Mantle (common autograph).....if the card is lower grade its worth slightly more, if mid to high grade and card is $1000+, its worth less.

Scarcer autographs (ie. Foxx, Dean, Hornsby, etc.) the card is definately worth alot more in lower grade and slightly more in higher grade.

Great cards to get signed are 1921-66 Exhibit cards because they display well and are not as pricey overall compared with cards of the same era.

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Posted By: peter chao

Guys,

Thanks for the advice, I was pretty much thinking about the same thing when I got the '53 Mantle autographed. If the card was in better condition I would have never done it, but the card has a minor crease and would have never been graded any higher than vg so I had the Mick sign it. This was at Cody's bookstore in Berkeley a couple years before he passed away.

Peter

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Posted By: jay behrens

DAvid, funny, you mention the Ryan/Koosman card. I used to buy them all the time in the early 80s as Koosman grew up a few miles from my mother. I managed to get Ryan to sign one of the cards at a Phillies game when I was living in Philly in 1982. I later got Koosman to sign the card. The card was a blazer, but when I went to sell it, none was willing to pay anywhere near the price of what an uncsigned card would go for. Both sigs were nice a crisp in ball point pen with no skips in the ink. The only other card I ever got signed was a horrible looking MP&Co Feller I got free and Feller was signing for free, so I figured why not.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: peter chao

Jay,

My guess on why the dealers wanted to pay less for your signed Ryan rookie would be because they knew that they would have to hold the card longer before it sold. There really aren't that many people that collect autographed baseball cards, and those that do generally would prefer to have Ryan's signature alone on the card.

Peter

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Posted By: davidcycleback

A classic example is Pete Rose's rookie. The card is valuable, but Rose's autograph is as common as they get. Rose's autograph would not ruin the value of the rookie card. However, some would say leave the card alone and have Rose sign a baseball. That way you have Rose's rookie and a Rose signed baseball. Display them side by side if you wish.

On the other hand, a Thurman Munson signature on his rookie card would dramatically raise the value, as Munson's signature is rare especially on his rookie card.

I like autographed cards and have had HOFer signed Goudeys and Diamond stars, and, yes, even a Pete Rose sharpie signed 63 Topps. I think many of the modern Topps/Upper Deck/Fleer Old Timers certified inserts card nice. I'm not talking about the cut signature cards, but the ones where the Yaz and Seaver and Nolan Ryan were paid to sign directly on the card. The players were under contract, the cards have the card manufacturer's COA stamped or printed directly on the card, and the card designs are usually nice. There are certified insert cards of Mickey Mantle (Score), Ted Williams (Upper Deck) and Joe DiMaggio (Pinnacle). In fact, the Barry Halper catalog has a picture of Mantle in the process of signing a small pile of the Score cards.

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Posted By: William Brumbach

I like autographed cards as well. The signed Ryan rookie with Koosman both in ballpoint sounds awesome to me. I have a 1966 Jenkins I just got signed but can't find sufficient information on Bill Sorrell, the other player on the card, to get that half signed. I think that multiplayer cards not signed by all of the players pictured look cheesy and incomplete.

I am currently working on autographed 1952 and 1953 Topps sets. There was a slabbed 1953 Topps Mantle in eBay recently with an "Auto Grade" of 9 with a BIN for $3500, too much in my opinion. Honestly, you would probably have a harder time finding a poorly signed Mantle auto. For all of the stories about what kind of drunk jerk he was, he signed consistently high quality signatures, at least what I have seen. There was also a Sharpie signed 1953 Topps Mantle in the 2005 REA but I have been told that two bidders with ultra-deep pockets ran the card up. I forget what it ended at but I think it was over $5000, or in that neighborhood.

I would think that something in the $2000 area is more realistic, depending on signature quality and card presentation. I have seen more 1952 Topps Mantle autographs than 1953 in the 3-4 years that I have been collecting autographs like this. 1953 Topps is a very popular set to collect autographed and there are close a dozen different bidders on eBay that I bid against often. The cards are bright and provide great contrast to the signatures, it is relatively smaller in size and more managable than other contemporary sets, there are no checklists or multiplayer cards, and a signed set could be realistically put together given time.

I realize that none of this is the focus of the forum but it is what I am primarily collecting now and it is rare that I can spout off about it. My wife doesn't really care about the unfortunate fates of Howie Fox, Snuffy Stirnwiess, Vern Bickford, or Karl Drews.

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Posted By: peter chao

Will,

That '53 Topps autographed set your putting together, generally what kind of condition do you collect the cards in.

Peter

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Posted By: William Brumbach

Me personally, I avoid paper loss from scrap book removal, Sharpie signatures, excessive creasing that breaks the surface, and poor quality signatures that are either light or have too many skips or breaks in them. This is a link to what I currently have, I used to have more but gave up on the set about a year and a half ago and sold off what I had. Earlier this year I started the project again and this is what I have so far. I know where there are more, it is just a matter of getting the funds together. Many of the cards have surface creasing or blemishes, but the scanner hides them or they are not that bad. The Jerry Priddy has the worst creasing over most of the card, and the Allie Reynolds has the most noticable creasing.

http://www.geocities.com/wbrumbach/1953_Topps.html

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Posted By: peter chao

Will,

I went to the website you posted, that's a good-looking collection you put together. Do you normally try to obtain the signatures yourself. It's going to be a lot more difficult for you in the near future, the ballplayers are getting elderly and not signing at shows anymore. Are you able to buy off E-bay to add to your collection. Also, I notice that your collection consists of ungraded cards, is it more difficult to find raw cards now days as compared to 5 years ago. Just curious. Collecting this set is going to keep you occupied for a while. Laugh out loud, good luck.

Peter

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Posted By: Jon Canfield

I have a 1960 Topps autographed Yankees team set. Actually, I am 5 shy away from completing the team set. It has taken me almost 8 years now, but I have found all of the tough signatures (and all have been slabbed and authenticated). Mantle, Maris and Elston Howard are really not the tough ones in the set, albeit they are 3 of the 4 most expensive cards. The toughest cards, by far, were the 4-coaches card with Crosetti and Dickey and - the key to the autographed set... the Duke Maas card. In fact, the Duke Maas I have is the only 1960 signed card I have ever seen of him.

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Posted By: John Barnes

I collect 1957 topps football signed, I get them signed through the mail.. here is a link to all I have http://s46.photobucket.com/albums/f121/Ahmanfan/1957%20Topps%20Football/

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IMO the cards look nice signed.
John

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Posted By: Alan

Peter -

The short answer is: it depends on the collectors' point of view. A card collector will treat the autograph as writing on the card & therefore it will be worth very little to them and they won't want the card (even if EX otherwise). An autograph collector will want & pay a lot for these.

There is a huge market of people that specifically collect signed trading cards both in person/shows & thru the mail. To them it doesn't matter if the card is a reprint card or authentic - they just want the card signed.

The rule of thumb as stated previously is NOT to get an expensive card signed.

Hope that helps.

Alan

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Posted By: peter chao

John, Alan

I like the autographed 1957 Bowman Football cards that were posted above. However, I cringe at the thought of sending near mint 1957 Bowman Football cards through the mail hoping to get them autographed. Surely, you have a way of increasing the probability the cards will be actually signed and returned. Thanks.

Peter

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Posted By: DJ

I love the 1953 Topps and 1957 Topps ventures. Congratulations! I too love both these sets, but haven't had the patience to begin such a feat myself. I know someone else who is doing the 1957 Topps signed set the same way and he has found willingness from the players themselves which is wonderful to know that you can get Lenny Moore through the mail (did he ask you for money?), a great Hall Of Famer like that, but if you try and get any of these kids today who couldn't carry his shoe, you will be shut down.

I should know having contacted former Oklahoma Sooner Quentin Griffin for a friend and he didn't bother to respond to me and I have no idea where he is playing today. That goes for Delhomme's back up Chris Weinke.

I think when it comes to Bart Starr and/or Paul Hornung, approach carefully.

It eases the pain going to the mail box and brings a bit of a surprise. Bill, Bill, Bill, Bill, signed card, Bill.

Nice Hank Thompson in the 1953!

DJ

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Posted By: peter chao

John,

I'm sorry, you posted 1957 Topps Football cards not '57 Bowman. I should have known better. At the last card show I attended I was staring at a 1957 Topps Paul Hornung. What a gorgeous card.

Peter

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Posted By: William Brumbach

Thanks for the compliments all.

Peter, I generally pick up the cards already signed as like the older signatures from the players were younger. I think that it is sad to see a shakey old man's signature, it just doesn't do anything for me. Later Spahn and Newhouser autographs as well as post-accident/stroke Campanella's are depressing. I have visions of a frail old man trying to eak out one more autograph, but as was stated above most people just want something signed. I'm a little pickier.

Most of the autographs either come from a collection being broken up of someone who collected the autographs through the mail (TTM) back in the 70's or from larger auction house lots being sold as singles by a dealer. Many of the cards that I now have were originally slabbed but I broke them out since I like the plastic sheet method better. I have my HOF autographs slabbed or intend to get slabbed eventually but these other ones I like in the plastic sheets.

I don't get the problem with signed "expensive" cards. If it is for a project or someone wants that item signed, then by all means go for it. I'd like nothing more than to have the 1952 Topps Mantle that Mastro had a year or two ago where the facsimile autograph on the card was erased and someone had Mantle sign his autograph inside of the box. Autographed vintage cards are cool!

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Posted By: peter chao

Will,

Thanks for posting the '52 Topps Mathews. Aaron and Mathews a very underrated twosome. That's what happens when you play in the boondocks.

So for your '53 Topps autographed cards you actually broke the cards out of slabs and put them in plastic sheets, I love it!!! I'm sure PSA registry guys are thinking that you are off your rocker. I understand where your coming from. I like my cards uniformly displayed also. I have a few PSA graded '57 Topps cards but I keep them out of my '57 collection. The '57 collection are in plastic sheets.

I like the idea of adding an autograph to '53 Topps cards since the '52 Topps cards came with an autograph.

Peter

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Posted By: Jeff Drum

Guys,
I have been collecting auto'd cards for years (30+) and have somewhere near 10,000 at this point from 1909 through 2006. I love the 1952s and 53's but have the most 57s and 67s. I used to send them through the mail for years using the Smalling address book. Still chip away at some of the sets little by little. Added a 1957 Ken Boyer and 1967 Roger Maris just lately. Probably never finish any set but it is fun. I sent some of my pre-war to the Net54 museum for uploading. Great thread.

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Posted By: peter chao

Jeff,

If you have close to 10,000 signatures then you probably have a large number of doubles or alternatively, you have a large number of non-baseball celebrity autographs. I cannot imagine anybody having close to 10,000 different baseball autographs. That would be a humongous number considering there's approximately a 1,000 major leaguers playing in any given year.

Anyway, sounds like a great collection.

Peter

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Posted By: Mark Evans

About 8 ago maybe, I was working in the same building as retired (now deceased) Supreme Court Justice Whizzer White. I asked his secretary of many years to have him sign his 1955 Topps All-America card for me, which I bought from Steve Verkman just for this purpose. I got the card back the next day with a signature of White but obviously written by the secretary. I stuck the card in my desk drawer and last year, while going through 30 years of accumulated junk in preparation for retirement, tossed the card in the trash. Mark

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Posted By: Jeff Drum

Peter,
Nope the 10,000+ is in just baseball from 1909 through 2006. Comes from 30+ years of writing athletes, going to shows, buying some collections, going to hotels, spring training, ballparks, etc. Also have some FB, HKY, GLF & BKT. Don't really have any celebrity autos unless you count Adam West. I do have some duplictes but make an effort not to get something signed that I already have.

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Posted By: peter chao

Jeff,

What do you think of Topps and Upper Deck selling autographed and serial numbered cards. Do you have any in your collection. Do you think they are as valuable as the cards that you personally got autographed.

Peter

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Posted By: DJ

Mark, that sucks.

Whizzer was never good at signing through the mail.

DJ

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Posted By: davidcycleback

As a Supreme Court Justice, Whizzer disliked being called Whizzer. Perhaps he gave secraterial signatures to those who called him Whizzer.

Star athletes turned Supreme Court Justices or politicians are good deals, as they are desirable to sports and political autograph collectors.

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Posted By: Jeff Drum

Peter,
In better response to your question; I have over 10,000 baseball cards signed with very few duplicate cards but a lot of duplication as far as players go. As far as certified cards go - I think they are fine. I'd rather have something I got signed myself than pay $5 a pack and pull a signed Casey Kotchman. Certified autgraphed cards are a part of the lottery mentality that modern baseball cards have become. Not for me.

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Posted By: peter chao

David,

On the whole I think your right, sports stars turned politicians have always been popular. I'm sure that Jim Bunning's 1957 Topps rookie card wouldn't be worth that much if he didn't subsequently become a senator.

But how about Steve Largent, becoming a politician hasn't helped his cards much.

Peter