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Reload this Page Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
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  #1  
Old 02-01-2005, 10:07 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Bill Kasel

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this look extremely thin, and conspicuous on the left side? Admittedly I've been touched in a bad place by PSA recently on another HOF t206 Port, but it points to the fact that you should ALWAYS buy the card, and not the grade.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31718&item=5159968951&rd=1

I'm just trying to keep people from making the same mistake I made.

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  #2  
Old 02-01-2005, 10:22 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Hal Lewis

It's graded PSA 2 "good"...

as in...

someone did a "good" job in getting that card trimmed and slabbed while PSA was snoozing.

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  #3  
Old 02-01-2005, 10:40 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Gilbert Maines

I know that I have much to learn on this (and other) subjects; but I would have bet that this card was not trimmed recently, and would have thought that it wasn't trimmed at all.

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  #4  
Old 02-01-2005, 10:45 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Ben

I'm going to go against the grain on this one - from looking at the auction scan, there's nothing about that card that makes me think trim. Sure, there's a little breathing room on the left side, but the edges look ok to me. Just one man's opinion...

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  #5  
Old 02-01-2005, 10:49 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Josh A.

Could it just be off-centered?

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  #6  
Old 02-01-2005, 10:56 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Mike Williams

I agree with you...IMO, the left corner wear also helps to make your "point".

Take care all (especially you Leon

Mike

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  #7  
Old 02-01-2005, 11:18 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: dan mckee

I say not trimmed, authentic, and properly graded.

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  #8  
Old 02-01-2005, 12:59 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: warshawlaw

psa holders are not that precise. card itself looks ok

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  #9  
Old 02-01-2005, 01:17 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: qualitycards.com

The seller is a reputable dealer and the card looks nice for a PSA-2.
I would have no problem bidding on it.

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  #10  
Old 02-01-2005, 01:19 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Ray

which would you rather own??? That one or mine???



It fits my beaters collection well!
I have all three Matty's in SGC 10 or GAI 1 (this one being the worst) and I couldn't be any happier!

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  #11  
Old 02-01-2005, 01:33 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Josh K.

sorry Ray, I would prefer the psa 2.

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  #12  
Old 02-01-2005, 02:09 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: tbob

Ive seen Matty portrait "3s" that don't look nearly as nice.

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  #13  
Old 02-01-2005, 02:12 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Lee Behrens

I would have to go towards the trimmed side. The left border looks way to clean compared to the rest of the card. I have dealings on the past with the seller all to satisfaction.

Ray, The bottom right hand corner looks trimmed how did you get that by SGC?
Lee

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  #14  
Old 02-01-2005, 03:46 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: scot reader


... at identifying trimmed T206s but this Evers that got slabbed is shameful.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31718&item=5162122137&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

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  #15  
Old 02-01-2005, 04:27 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Richard Simon

Those of you who know me, do know that I am an autograph dealer and authenticator.
I have always wondered, though, about PSA's card graders. I have seen them set up at shows with their card grading on sight, and most of those card graders look like they are barely out of high school.
Does this concern anyone else?

Rich

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  #16  
Old 02-01-2005, 04:45 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Judge Dred

Richard,

I think you've hit it on the head. They're not using the trained monkeys anymore. The "just out of high school" group that couldn't make it in fast food are now "making it" by grading our cards. I think there is some type of tax benefit for hiring these otherwise unemployable individuals. Does this concern me - heck yes it does, what are they going to do with the trained monkeys? What a waste of talent.

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  #17  
Old 02-01-2005, 06:12 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Joe

Since it is my card being discussed I wanted to state categorically that the card is not trimmed. The bottom left border paper has worn away from the corner and the corner itself has abraded slightly as a result. From the scan it looks a little short in that corner but when you see it up close it is clearly not short only abraded (from natural looking paper loss). As I look at the card sitting right in front of me, there is consistent wear on each side to side border and each corner has wear and abrading.

I stand behind the card. If someone buys it and is not happy I'll offer a full refund.

Joe
Setbuilders

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  #18  
Old 02-01-2005, 06:25 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: MW

It's impossible for me to be sure on this one without seeing it in person, but based solely on a visual inspection from the eBay image, I'm going to agree with Joe from Setbuilders -- the card has a slight diamond cut but it does not appear to be trimmed.

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  #19  
Old 02-01-2005, 06:29 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: WallyPost

I know Joe personally and he is a standup guy. He would never knowingly sell a trimmed card. Is it reasonable to publically say that this card is trimmed without examining the grain?

With regard to PSA i went on their website and did a little research regarding their graders. I found this :
Reza Tabatabai
Director of Grading, Professional Sports Authenticator (PSA)

Expertise: Sportscard grading
Reza Tabatabai has been a collector for over 15 years. Reza is a senior member of the PSA Grading team with vast knowledge in all areas of collectible sports cards. He has been grading professionally for PSA since 1998. Reza earned a Bachelor of Science degree in Business Finance from Fresno State University in 1990.

What are this guys credentials to be head of grading for psa. It is no wonder that their is such an abundance of speculation regarding questionable material in PSA holders. Has PSA ever tried to hire the services of a real hobbiest such as Lew Lipset or Mark Macrae?

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  #20  
Old 02-01-2005, 06:44 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: MW

Scot,

That's one of the most random grades I've ever seen from any grading company.

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  #21  
Old 02-01-2005, 06:46 PM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: WallyPost

Is it me or is that evers 1/8 of an inch smaller that the 05 Duffy?

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  #22  
Old 02-02-2005, 12:33 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: jay behrens

Knowing Mark Macrae, he wouldn't want anything to do with PSA, or any other grading company. Julie would know for sure, but I don't think Mark has a single slabbed card in his collection. If he buys one, he generally frees them from their holder.

Jay

Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming --- WOW, What a ride!

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  #23  
Old 02-02-2005, 01:15 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Elliot

Hard to tell on the Matty without seeing it in person, which Joe has, and he is a stand-up guy so I would have to say that it is not trimmed. HOWEVER, is there any doubt about the Evers???? That card is sooo short.

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  #24  
Old 02-02-2005, 06:27 AM
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Default Tip of the iceberg.....PSA
Posted By: Bill Kasel

I'm certainly not calling out any dealer/seller on this. My PSA trimmed Willis came from James Verill, and he is top notch in my book, and I will certainly purchase from him again. The fact of the matter is, even if the Johnson is ok (which it appears it is), I no longer trust PSA worth a damn. They obviously do not have the staff to properly grade pre-WWI cards. Maybe a few of them are really good, but too many slip by for my liking. I will try to post more about positive things, rather than focusing on the negatives. However it seems that even the most unassuming strings turn into a pi$$ing match between two or three juvenile minded collectors thus ruining the fun of them. "One That Got Away" string and many others. Thanks Scott(s), maybe you should take it off-line.

I love hearing the stories of finds, hits, misses, pains and overall fun that these cards put us through. I also cant get enough of the scans of the low, and the high ticket items.

Thanks everyone for the input and insight. Nine new E95's should be arriving any day now! WHOOO HOOOO!!!! Thanks Wesley!

Bill Kasel

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