Interesting Stats : Most All-Time steals by position

[Chuck9788]

Catcher : Jason Kendall = 189 Steals

1'st base : Jeff Bagwell = 202 Steals

2'nd base : Joe Morgan = 689 Steals

Shortstop : Bert Campanaris = 649 Steals

3rd base : Howard Johnson = 231 Steals

Left field : Ricky Henderson = 1406 Steals

Center field : Willie Wilson = 668 Steals

Right field : Ichiro Suzuki + 509 Steals

Designated hitter : Hal McRae = 109 Steals

Pitcher : Bob Gibson = 13 Steals


What do you think? Any surprises?

[GasHouseGang]

Wouldn't Ohtani fit into the pitcher category?

[BobbyStrawberry]

Did you include 19th century? If so I don't believe Gibson has the record.

[Jim65]

Originally Posted by GasHouseGang

Wouldn't Ohtani fit into the pitcher category?

I assume it would only count stolen bases he had while being a pitcher, the others wouldn't count toward that.

[mrreality68]

First it is interesting that most of the top base stealers were left fielders

But I am confused by the list

Wasn’t Ty Cobb centerfield and he had 897 stolen bases
Eddie Collins played 2nd base and had 741 stolen bases
Honus Wagner short stop 723 stolen bases

Unless I am missing something

[Jim65]

Originally Posted by mrreality68

First it is interesting that most of the top base stealers were left fielders

But I am confused by the list

Wasn’t Ty Cobb centerfield and he had 897 stolen bases
Eddie Collins played 2nd base and had 741 stolen bases
Honus Wagner short stop 723 stolen bases

Unless I am missing something

Same here, at first I thought because Cobb played 700 games in CF but Rickey played 400 games in CF but has his total career number listed. It is confusing.

[D. Bergin]

According to the article this originated from, it's a Post-1920 list (live ball era).

https://www.mlb.com/news/stolen-base...-each-position

[D. Bergin]

Most surprising I guess is Howard Johnson. I completely forgot about him. He didn't have much of a prime, but did have a very nice 5 year run for the Mets and got the bulk of his stolen bases in a 6 year stretch.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

According to the article this originated from, it's a Post-1920 list (live ball era).

https://www.mlb.com/news/stolen-base...-each-position

I can see breaking off a question about home runs between the dead and live ball eras, but not so clear as to how a live or dead ball would impact someone's ability to steal bases. Unless they think that once the home run became such a big deal in the live ball era that managers quit having their players steal so much to try and get into scoring position. With the emphasis on home runs today, once a player is on first base, they're often already considered to be in scoring position, based on who's coming up to the plate next. Wonder if that was the reason for the 1920 cut-off?

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by BobC

I can see breaking off a question about home runs between the dead and live ball eras, but not so clear as to how a live or dead ball would impact someone's ability to steal bases. Unless they think that once the home run became such a big deal in the live ball era that managers quit having their players steal so much to try and get into scoring position. With the emphasis on home runs today, once a player is on first base, they're often already considered to be in scoring position, based on who's coming up to the plate next. Wonder if that was the reason for the 1920 cut-off?

Did not realize it was post 1920. It said all time so that is why I was confused. Since most of Wagner and Cobb steals were pre-1920.

But I agree I would not have made that the cutoff since all records are seem to be based all time from the pre 1900 to present like hits, home runs, career stolen bases etc so odd that they separated stolen bases to do by position Post 1920

Me personally I think the article is highly flawed as a result

[D. Bergin]

I don't know. The article says exactly what it's intention is and why.

The biggest flaw is that it doesn't break down the numbers into actual stolen bases in games played in that position.

Rickey Henderson actually had 1132 stolen bases as a Left Fielder.

Don't really have time right now to look up all the rest.

[cgjackson222]

HoJo!!!

[Rad_Hazard]

If we are truly going All-Time (since the inception of stats in 1871), then it looks like this (I used my Stathead Account). Rickey was the only holdover.

My only criteria was: at least 50% of games played at that position - NOTE: If I change this to a lower % like 40, this changes some of the entries, I just figured 50% or more would be a good qualifier.


Catcher : Jack O'Connor = 219 Steals

1st base : Jack Doyle = 518 Steals

2nd base : Eddie Collins = 741 Steals

Shortstop : Honus Wagner = 723 Steals

3rd base : Arlie Latham = 742 Steals

Left field : Ricky Henderson = 1406 Steals

Center field : Billy Hamilton = 914 Steals

Right field : Patsy Donovan = 518 Steals

Designated hitter : Don Baylor = 285 Steals

Pitcher : Tony Mullane = 112 Steals


Fun Fact: Baseball Reference lists Don Baylor's nicknames as "Groove" or "The Sneak Thief", automatically putting him the S tier of nicknames.

[mrreality68]

I just hope with the bigger bases and the pitch clock and throw over rules that steals makes a comeback

I always liked stolen bases and catchers trying to throw out the base runner and small balls

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

If we are truly going All-Time (since the inception of stats in 1871), then it looks like this (I used my Stathead Account). Rickey was the only holdover.

My only criteria was: at least 50% of games played at that position - NOTE: If I change this to a lower % like 40, this changes some of the entries, I just figured 50% or more would be a good qualifier.


Catcher : Jack O'Connor = 219 Steals

1st base : Jack Doyle = 518 Steals

2nd base : Eddie Collins = 741 Steals

Shortstop : Honus Wagner = 723 Steals

3rd base : Arlie Latham = 742 Steals

Left field : Ricky Henderson = 1406 Steals

Center field : Billy Hamilton = 914 Steals

Right field : Patsy Donovan = 518 Steals

Designated hitter : Don Baylor = 285 Steals

Pitcher : Tony Mullane = 112 Steals


Fun Fact: Baseball Reference lists Don Baylor's nicknames as "Groove" or "The Sneak Thief", automatically putting him the S tier of nicknames.

How can Chuck's list be wrong even as to DH????? Seems like an apples to oranges thing going on here.

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

How can Chuck's list be wrong even as to DH????? Seems like an apples to oranges thing going on here.

Chuck’s list was based off the link in post #7 from mlb.com. It was a post-1920 list (live ball).

I was taking into account all stats from 1871-present.

The DH swing and miss by MLB in that article is just plain lazy. Baylor had more DH at bats than McRae so there is no excuse for them missing it.

Here is the list of DH stolen bases all-time (top 15).

[mrreality68]

Great info thanks

and interesting to see some of these players on the list

and looking forward to more steals this season. THey say that the rate of steals this spring training is up more than 40% compared to prior spring trainings. So hopefully that means more in the season

[carlsonjok]

Originally Posted by Jim65

I assume it would only count stolen bases he had while being a pitcher, the others wouldn't count toward that.

This is correct.

ohtani.jpg

[carlsonjok]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

Chuck’s list was based off the link in post #7 from mlb.com. It was a post-1920 list (live ball).

I was taking into account all stats from 1871-present.

The DH swing and miss by MLB in that article is just plain lazy. Baylor had more DH at bats than McRae so there is no excuse for them missing it.

Here is the list of DH stolen bases all-time (top 15).

There is a difference between stolen bases by a player who was primarily a DH and stolen bases by a player while playing as a DH. Based on his career splits, Baylor played the most games as a DH, but most of his stolen bases were when he was playing left field.

baylor.jpg

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by carlsonjok

There is a difference between stolen bases by a player who was primarily a DH and stolen bases by a player while playing as a DH. Based on his career splits, Baylor played the most games as a DH, but most of his stolen bases were when he was playing left field.

Attachment 562549

Ah ok!

But in that case, wouldn't McRae still be incorrect? According to Baseball Reference, McRae would only have 74 SB as a DH.

The true career leader in that position would be Paul Molitor with 169 SB as a DH.

If this is correct, that makes the MLB article even lazier than I expected.

[D. Bergin]

Molitor would likely be the correct answer, but because he played less then half of his games as a DH, he's not clumped into the statistical data. Same as Baylor.

Most of these lists are using the model, that the player counts as that being his regular position only if he played a certain % of his games at that position.

That's what I thought was flawed about the list to begin with, not that it's a post-1920 list, which was declared to be the case right at the outset.

I'd guess the lists are compiled this way because baseball reference doesn't spit out a neat compilation list in this category, and you have to go to each individual players "Career Split" page.....and that could end up being pretty time consuming.

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Molitor would likely be the correct answer, but because he played less then half of his games as a DH, he's not clumped into the statistical data. Same as Baylor.

Most of these lists are using the model, that the player counts as that being his regular position only if he played a certain % of his games at that position.

That's what I thought was flawed about the list to begin with, not that it's a post-1920 list, which was declared to be the case right at the outset.

I'd guess the lists are compiled this way because baseball reference doesn't spit out a neat compilation list in this category, and you have to go to each individual players "Career Split" page.....and that could end up being pretty time consuming.

That makes sense, and I completely agree with that last statement 100%.

I missed Molitor on my initial assessment since my criteria was at least 50% playing time at the position.

This is good stuff though, I always like diving into stats I previously had no idea about.

What I learned is that Molitor is the DH SB king, and Don Baylor had some serious wheels in his younger days and two of the coolest nicknames in baseball.

[D. Bergin]

What's really interesting, is that Paul Molitor should hold both the DH and the 3B record.

If you just count games they played at that position, Molitor beats Howard Johnson 185 to 154.

Unless of course there's somebody else out there who is being left out of the statistical data we haven't thought of yet.

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

What's really interesting, is that Paul Molitor should hold both the DH and the 3B record.

If you just count games they played at that position, Molitor beats Howard Johnson 185 to 154.

Unless of course there's somebody else out there who is being left out of the statistical data we haven't thought of yet.

I think you are right!

At a glance the post-1920 leader at both 3B and DH is Molitor. Enos Cabel comes in 2nd at 3B with 183.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

I think you are right!

At a glance the post-1920 leader at both 3B and DH is Molitor. Enos Cabel comes in 2nd at 3B with 183.

Wow, that's close. Cabell wouldn't have crossed my mind in a million years to even be in the running.

Molitor got caught a lot less though.

[Rad_Hazard]

Ok, we are wrong again!

There is a split finder tool on Stathead.

For 3B it's actually Carney Lansford!

Also, Bob Gibson at P with 13 is correct, Molitor is by far #1 at DH with 169 (Baylor 2nd with 80, and McRae 3rd with 74), and Kendall at Catcher with 169 is also correct.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

Ok, we are wrong again!

There is a split finder tool on Stathead.

For 3B it's actually Carney Lansford!

Also, Bob Gibson at P with 13 is correct, Molitor is by far #1 at DH with 169 (Baylor 2nd with 80, and McRae 3rd with 74), and Kendall at Catcher with 169 is also correct.

Damn, Carney Lansford! It's hard to look at that card and say to yourself "That's the same guy who stole 37 bases, 3 years after that picture was taken".

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Damn, Carney Lansford! It's hard to look at that card and say to yourself "That's the same guy who stole 37 bases, 3 years after that picture was taken".

Incredible! Lansford is a legend and my pick of that particular card was 100% intentional.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

Incredible! Lansford is a legend and my pick of that particular card was 100% intentional.

LOL, great choice. Some of his later cards he actually looks like a guy who could have stolen 37 bases.

It's either the glasses, or he started "working out" a lot more with Mark & Jose.

Based on his HR stats, I'd guess the 1st one.

[Rad_Hazard]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

LOL, great choice. Some of his later cards he actually looks like a guy who could have stolen 37 bases.

It's either the glasses, or he started "working out" a lot more with Mark & Jose.

Based on his HR stats, I'd guess the 1st one.

I love 1990 Fleer. I remember in elementary school the lunch lady would put singles on each lunch tray for us. I was jealous of the kid who got Bo Jackson.

[mrreality68]

Originally Posted by Rad_Hazard

I love 1990 Fleer. I remember in elementary school the lunch lady would put singles on each lunch tray for us. I was jealous of the kid who got Bo Jackson.

nice set but I if i had my choice the first Oakland players card i would have chosen Ricky