Diamond Stars wrapper question

[nolemmings]

Question for those who collect 1930's Diamond Stars and National Chicle premiums, which I generally do not.

When conducting some preliminary research, I saw that Old Cardboard has pictures of eight different wrappers for the Diamond Stars set(s) issued by National Chicle. These have basically two different color schemes, yellow-red and blue-reddish, but all 8 advertise one type of premium or another available at the store in exchange for 15 wrappers. Has anyone seen and can show a Diamond Stars wrapper that does not advertise these premiums? I am curious as to the actual dates they were issued.

As I understand it, 1936 Diamond Stars are the most difficult to find of the three-year set, and these “high numbers” command greater prices. Yet all known wrappers for Diamond Stars supposedly advertise premiums that are attributed to 1936--R311x2, R312 and R313 Wide Pens (although one may have been issued in conjunction with National Chicle’s Batter-Up set). Are none of these premiums more properly associated with 1934 or 1935? Why are there no Diamond Stars wrappers, at least on OC's website, that do not mention premiums if in fact for two years there were none? If anything, it’s logical to assume that 1936 wrappers should be even tougher to find, since they were supposedly being traded in fifteen at a time for the various premiums. It is also odd that National Chicle would generate eight different wrappers for a set containing only a couple dozen cards, although I suppose test and geographic marketing may have been behind at least some of that.

Explanations and theories would be appreciated.

[RCMcKenzie]

Todd, I don't know a lot about these premiums, but I think this is an interesting topic. Are you asking if the National Chicle premiums could have been issued in 1934-1936, instead of only 1936?
I checked some of the bios/stats of the Color Tints and Eugene Schott began his career in 1935. I could not find a player that retired before 1935 or changed teams, but I haven't nearly looked at all the players.
The only thing I came up with in a search on the wrappers was this old Trader Speaks article by Bud Tompkins http://www.sportscollectorsdaily.com...pany-wrappers/

[nolemmings]

Thanks for the response and link--yes that is my question. In digging further, I see it is established that the R311 glossy photos were issued in at least 1935, as evidenced by an ad piece Leon posted some time ago that stated as much:
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=198771
These were probably not available as premiums with the 1934 set, since Joe Cronin is shown wearing a Boston cap, and he was not traded to the Red Sox until after the 1934 season in October. So the various wrappers that list the players found in the glossy set are probably from 1935, which then begs the question of why no wrappers from 1934 are known, at least to OC.

R312 shows a photo of Joe Dimaggio from Comiskey Park and it seems that some or all of R312 was issued after April, 1936. The R311 leathers and R313 are likely from 1936, since both contain a Joltin' Joe card from Spring Training in that his rookie season, but I believe the latter (Fine Pens) may have been spread over more than one year and/or were likely given with the Batter-Up cards. I am hopeful someone can point to other evidence out there that better pins down when these premiums were printed and issued.

[tedzan]

I completed the basic Diamond Stars set of 108 cards back in the early 1990's. The last 12 cards (# 97-108) were really tough to find.
And, all 12 of these cards were simply a repeat of subjects printed throughout the set. So, why did they re-print these guys ?
In this 1936 Hi # series, if National Chicle could have instead included rookie cards of Joe DiMaggio, Johnny Mize, etc., their set would
have been considerably more popular than it is.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.

[rhettyeakley]

The R311 set is what is being advertised on the Diamond Stars wrappers.

The R311 set is not a 1936 only issue, they were issued over a few different years (presumably 1934 to 1936). Different cards were added along the timeline as others were eliminated, which is why some cards from the R311 set are MUCH tougher to find than others, the later series of R311 (and by association Diamond Stars) are harder to find. The first R311 offered are the most common. These are the Bill Terry, Dizzy Dean, Earl Averill, Mickey Cochrane, etc. which are several times easier to find than some of the later "cards". I think the last ones I needed when I finished the set several years back were the Columbus Red Birds, Mel Harder, and Schoolboy Rowe.

This information was somewhat known to collectors at least anecdotally but several years ago there was a "1935" envelope with the offered premiums from that year with a checklist and the cards still included and a note to the retailer about how to distribute them. I do not have the photo right in front of me but if I get a chance I will try to find it.

[rhettyeakley]

I was able to find the cards with the instructions. From Love of the Game auctions...

http://loveofthegameauctions.com/lot-13261.aspx

Likely a set of photos from "1934" will someday be found that has some of the cards we already know about being dated to that season... perhaps the Jimmy Foxx, Frankie Frisch, Jim Bottomley, and Pepper Martin? As these cards are not advertised on the 1935 display and could date to earlier, some of the 1935 photos could have also been distributed in 1934 as well as there are some of those that are really east to find. Most of the teams seem to date from 1935 or 1936 as they are showing the pennant winners of the 1934 season or are dated to 1935 or 1936.

[Leon]

Nice research on this stuff. I wish I had my display back.

Originally Posted by rhettyeakley

I was able to find the cards with the instructions. From Love of the Game auctions...

http://loveofthegameauctions.com/lot-13261.aspx

Likely a set of photos from "1934" will someday be found that has some of the cards we already know about being dated to that season... perhaps the Jimmy Foxx, Frankie Frisch, Jim Bottomley, and Pepper Martin? As these cards are not advertised on the 1935 display and could date to earlier, some of the 1935 photos could have also been distributed in 1934 as well as there are some of those that are really east to find. Most of the teams seem to date from 1935 or 1936 as they are showing the pennant winners of the 1934 season or are dated to 1935 or 1936.