FS: Lawrence Ritter - The Glory of Their Times DVD! - SOLD

[cor3y7]

SOLD. Thanks for the interest.

Video version of Lawrence Ritter's renowned book of the same name, The Glory of Their Times. Originally released in 1977 on VHS, finally converted to DVD. This is an official release, not a bootleg. Watched once, plays perfectly. Case has a tiny piece of plastic cracked off on the side (see photo #4).

Asking $20.00 shipped (net to me, so cover fees or pay using check, m.o., PayPal F/F).

[cor3y7]

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[cor3y7]

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[svtPONY95]

PM sent !

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[Michael Peich]

If it’s still available I’ll take it. I lent mine to a forum
member who never returned them!

Cheers, Mike

[cor3y7]

PM sent!

[Hankphenom]

Not casting any aspersions whatsoever on this transaction, which is legitimate in every way. HOWEVER, as someone who was very close to both Larry Ritter and his "Glory" projects, I find it astonishing that someone would have the gall to put this out with no mention of either Ritter, whose work it is based on entirely, or Bud Greenspan, who produced it. I assume that Doak Ewing of Rare Sportsfilms, which claims the copyright to this DVD, knows his law well enough to feel safe to issue this product, either that or that with the passing of Ritter and Greenspan he figures there is little chance that anyone will care enough to come after him for it. I've long admired Ewing's work in finding and issuing great old films that otherwise would have been lost or ignored and never become available to the public. I met Doak at a national many years ago, we had a long chat, and he seemed like a good guy. And I'm actually thrilled to see Greenspan's wonderful film out on DVD, it's been many years since the VHS version went out of print and obsolete. I just wish credit had been given where it is due.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

Not casting any aspersions whatsoever on this transaction, which is legitimate in every way. HOWEVER, as someone who was very close to both Larry Ritter and his "Glory" projects, I find it astonishing that someone would have the gall to put this out with no mention of either Ritter, whose work it is based on entirely, or Bud Greenspan, who produced it. I assume that Doak Ewing of Rare Sportsfilms, which claims the copyright to this DVD, knows his law well enough to feel safe to issue this product, either that or that with the passing of Ritter and Greenspan he figures there is little chance that anyone will care enough to come after him for it. I've long admired Ewing's work in finding and issuing great old films that otherwise would have been lost or ignored and never become available to the public. I met Doak at a national many years ago, we had a long chat, and he seemed like a good guy. And I'm actually thrilled to see Greenspan's wonderful film out on DVD, it's been many years since the VHS version went out of print and obsolete. I just wish credit had been given where it is due.

I know Doak very well. I was the first person to list his DVDs on Amazon, including The Glory of Their Times. When I stopped selling on Amazon (a long, sad story) I hooked Doak up with my longtime friend Brent Lee, who sells Doak's products on Amazon now.

Incidentally, I wrote the first review of Larry's book on Amazon, and he wrote to thank me, and sent a signed, first edition hardcover copy of the book to me! We corresponded a bit, with Larry sending me some articles about those old players, especially one of his favorites, Chief Meyers. Keith Olbermann once told me that he attended Larry's funeral, and there were many, many people there, from all over every imaginable spectrum (he mentioned Paul Voelker specifically.)

I still have a nice, long, hand-written note from Larry to me, and I call Doak once or twice a year to visit, so my opinion of both are pretty high. While Doak didn't mention Bud Greenspan on his DVD presentation, he does clearly state on the back cover, in bold: "The Glory of Their Times (Based on the book by Lawrence Ritter)"

I believe Doak wants Larry to have the credit he is due, and my strong guess is that Larry wants this DVD to be enjoyed and appreciated by as many people as possible; not for Larry's glory, but for the memory of these great players, and the fascinating story of their lives and times.

[Knoxy24]

This movie is available on YouTube for free if anyone is interested in seeing it.

[Hankphenom]

Originally Posted by Mark17

While Doak didn't mention Bud Greenspan on his DVD presentation, he does clearly state on the back cover, in bold: "The Glory of Their Times (Based on the book by Lawrence Ritter)"

You barely address my real bone of contention with Doak's edition of the video: zero mention of the man who made it, the very famous sports documentarian Bud Greenspan, and one meager parenthetical reference to Ritter on the back of the package. That is hardly enough credit, in my opinion, given to these two legendary figures whose work Ewing has repackaged and sold as if it came out of nowhere. This DVD isn't "based on the book" at all, in fact, but is a brilliant and highly original production of Greenspan's that includes some of Larry's recordings. You went to great lengths to establish your history with and regard for Larry and "Glory," which I don't doubt for a minute, so I'll give you mine: I co-produced and edited, with Neal McCabe, the audio edition, published by Highbridge in 1998 and currently available for download wherever audio products are sold. I wouldn't be thrilled to think that, once our work moves into the legal realm of public domain, it would be issued without any mention of those who made it, as Doak has done to Greenspan on his DVD, and scant reference to the man who recorded the interviews in the first place. And I don't imagine Larry would be, either.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

Not casting any aspersions whatsoever on this transaction, which is legitimate in every way. HOWEVER, as someone who was very close to both Larry Ritter and his "Glory" projects, I find it astonishing that someone would have the gall to put this out with no mention of either Ritter, whose work it is based on entirely, or Bud Greenspan, who produced it.

What you said, above, was partly untrue and somewhat (though not completely) unfair to a friend of mine. All I did was set that record straight. And while Doak's cover does not mention Greenspan, his name is prominently displayed at the beginning of the movie, along with Larry's. So anybody who watches it knows who produced it.

You and I agree, Bud Greenspan should certainly have been credited on the cover. Obviously, Larry's original material was not video, and Bud also wove various non-baseball events into the story to put it all in historical content. The title came from Larry, and the core essence (to me, a baseball fan, the original baseball interviews are 90% of the fascination of the video.)

I might also add that I have the Highbridge cassette tape (4 tape) set and am impressed that while you used the famous picture of Cobb sliding into Austin at third, you did credit Charles Conlon as the photographer (the credit is in very small print, but it is there.)

I was saddened to read your opinion that Larry would not be happy with the DVD as it is being sold now. I have always wanted to think that he wanted that story of those men out there, for as many people to hear and remember, as possible. As another poster noted, it can be viewed on Youtube, too, where there is no cover to give anyone credit. But, again, as with Doak's DVD, Greenspan and Ritter are prominently mentioned near the beginning.

I see your point, I hope you see mine, and I think we agree more than not. You obviously knew Larry infinitely better than me, but for my own comfort I think I'll go on believing that he's glad his interviews are still popular, and easily available, today and likely forever into the future, despite the concerns we share regarding Bud's credit omission on the cover of the current DVD production.

In fact, when I see a T205 or T206 of one of those guys he interviewed sell for a little premium, I smile. It's kind of fun to look at a Hans Lobert card and be able to hear his actual voice, talking about his career. I also want to think that Larry would get a kick out of that too; the idea his book and recordings made Lobert, Gibson, Crawford, Wood, etc. a little better known and more popular.

[Hankphenom]

Yes, Larry did get a tremendous kick out of what he did for the players and their memories, including sharing his royalties with them for years. And you're right that I did miss the small and parenthetical mention of Ritter's book on the back cover on first glance at the package. But how hard would it have been to feature the names of both these famous men on the cover, giving full credit where it's due? I'd guess their estates won't be seeing any money from this publication of their work, but letting buyers know whose work this is would seem to be a basic consideration for someone issuing this product out of love for it and a desire to get it into the hands of those who would appreciate it. As I said, why wouldn't you want their names on the package? Why would you be surprised that Neal and I gave credit to Conlon for the cover photo? We gave credit to all the many photos we used. As for what Larry would think about the DVD, what comes to mind is what he said about the film when I asked him about it. Laughing sardonically, he said: "Oh yeah, the film. Bud and I are friends, but I never got a dime out of it." I doubt if he'd care one way or the other that someone was putting out the DVD with his famous title on it, and would no doubt have something similar to say about the way it was issued. Larry knew how the world works.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

As I said, why wouldn't you want their names on the package?

I agree, they should be. One is.

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

Why would you be surprised that Neal and I gave credit to Conlon for the cover photo?

I didn't say surprised, I said "impressed."

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

I doubt if he'd care one way or the other that someone was putting out the DVD with his famous title on it, and would no doubt have something similar to say about the way it was issued. Larry knew how the world works.

Good, I am glad. This was the sentiment I assumed Larry would have, in my original post.

[Hankphenom]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Good, I am glad. This was the sentiment I assumed Larry would have, in my original post.

You're glad that Larry would accept this for the kind of cynical commercial exploitation that goes on in the world? That makes you happy? Tell you what: Just let your friend Doak know that you agree with me that he should at least get the artists' names where they belong on his unlicensed issuances of their work, and maybe we'll have actually accomplished something here rather than just wasting time defending our positions.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

As for what Larry would think about the DVD, what comes to mind is what he said about the film when I asked him about it. Laughing sardonically, he said: "Oh yeah, the film. Bud and I are friends, but I never got a dime out of it." I doubt if he'd care one way or the other that someone was putting out the DVD with his famous title on it, and would no doubt have something similar to say about the way it was issued. Larry knew how the world works.

If you want to take issue with Doak not mentioning Bud on the cover of his DVD presentation (now that we have established he DID give credit to Larry) I would say that Bud not giving Larry "a dime" for use of Larry's material, while it was still under copyright protection, is a far worse example of unfairly appropriating someone else's work.

If Larry had issues with "cynical commercial exploitation", I would think that being taken advantage of, financially, as you describe above, would have been far more impactful than anything Doak has done with Larry's now public domain material.

And if Bud didn't pay Larry (or, I would surmise, any of the interviewed players) "a dime", then I'm not going to cry if Bud's name isn't in big bold letters on the DVD cover.

Both Bud and Larry are clearly credited on the actual film, so it's not like anyone is trying to hide their contributions.

I've become bored with your attack on Doak. If you want to complain to him, go ahead.