Fake Rube M. Are these bad Ted Williams???

[yanks12025]

Not sure if most have seen this thread on the main board

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=262580&page=2

But on the same date of 8/16, several Ted Williams signed cards were authenticated by JSA.. I went thru and screenshot them, so we can have a record whether they're good or not and before JSA possibly purges them if they're fake like the Rube M card.

[yanks12025]

Anyone have concerns about any of these Williams?

[bigfish]

I can tell you the Marquard and Williams cards are not from the same source. The Williams came from an old time autograph collector who lives in the boston area. His collection had 8 Mantle cards and a few Maris cards which all passed PSA.

[Smanzari]

Originally Posted by yanks12025

Not sure if most have seen this thread on the main board

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=262580&page=2

But on the same date of 8/16, several Ted Williams signed cards were authenticated by JSA.. I went thru and screenshot them, so we can have a record whether they're good or not and before JSA possibly purges them if they're fake like the Rube M card.

Ted used a stamp for TTM responses for years and good handful of those (ok, all of them) appear to be that stamp

[jason.1969]

The last Williams scan looks to be on the cover of the Clean Sweep catalog.

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[jad22]

Originally Posted by Smanzari

Ted used a stamp for TTM responses for years and good handful of those (ok, all of them) appear to be that stamp

Seriously?

[shelly]

The only williams I liked was in the middle at the bottom.
I think that Stvan is correct that they are stamped. Look how everyone of them is smeared at the exact identical spot. You can not read most of the Williams.
The only one that is not like that is the one I like.

[daves_resale_shop]

I dont believe they are stamped as their respective size and character formation varies... that said, im not comfortable with them. Find it interesting that the williams went to jsa, and the mantles/maris went to psa

[Smanzari]

Originally Posted by jad22

Seriously?

Yea, he seriously used a stamp for ttm- I will share my example of it if I can find this evening

Upon further thought, I do think these may have all been in “black” so my initial response may not be correct, though I would personally not buy any examples posted

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[daves_resale_shop]

Originally Posted by Smanzari

Yea, he seriously used a stamp for ttm- I will share my example of it if I can find this evening

Upon further thought, I do think these may have all been in “black” so my initial response may not be correct, though I would personally not buy any examples posted

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+1

[jad22]

Originally Posted by Smanzari

Yea, he seriously used a stamp for ttm- I will share my example of it if I can find this evening

Upon further thought, I do think these may have all been in “black” so my initial response may not be correct, though I would personally not buy any examples posted

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My concern would be the TPA missing stamped Williams. Missing fairly well executed forgeries is one thing, missing stamped signatures is another.

[Mr. Zipper]

Regarding the Williams signed cards...

The images are way too small and angled, but even from the small photos, it's clear there are differences in the shape of the Ws, relative height of the Ls, etc. Too many substantive differences to be the same rubber stamp.

[phikappapsi]

Originally Posted by Mr. Zipper

Regarding the Williams signed cards...

The images are way too small and angled, but even from the small photos, it's clear there are differences in the shape of the Ws, relative height of the Ls, etc. Too many substantive differences to be the same rubber stamp.

+1 if there's a stamp in there, there's only 1 maybe 2, because none of those examples appear to be identical to me, though a couple are very close

[shelly]

My mistake. I will still stick with the middle Williams at the bottom is the only one I would buy.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by Smanzari

Ted used a stamp for TTM responses for years and good handful of those (ok, all of them) appear to be that stamp

I haven't seen examples, but a season ticket holder I know who also got autographs told me about the stamp being used in person when he was at Fenway too.


Just ask for an auto, no way. (Maybe for a kid? Maybe I forget)

"Hey ted, here's $5 for the jimmy fund.".. out comes the stamp.

25+ If I remember it right got an actual auto

[tha-rock]

Here's my Williams stamped signature from a mail request back in the 1970s:

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by steve B

I haven't seen examples, but a season ticket holder I know who also got autographs told me about the stamp being used in person when he was at Fenway too.


Just ask for an auto, no way. (Maybe for a kid? Maybe I forget)

"Hey ted, here's $5 for the jimmy fund.".. out comes the stamp.

25+ If I remember it right got an actual auto

That's pretty horrible. Surprised Willie Mays hasn't done that, maybe use extra ink so a blob could run down over other signatures.

[mr2686]

Originally Posted by Runscott

That's pretty horrible. Surprised Willie Mays hasn't done that, maybe use extra ink so a blob could run down over other signatures.

LOL...I haven't laughed so hard in quite some time. Thanks for that!

[steve B]

Originally Posted by Runscott

That's pretty horrible. Surprised Willie Mays hasn't done that, maybe use extra ink so a blob could run down over other signatures.

I don't recall them mentioning it, but I'd like to think that Ted was a decent enough guy to not simply stamp something that had multiple signatures.


It was late 70's, maybe early 80's? Whenever he was some sort of special batting coach. Most of what I saw people trying to get signed back then was balls, programs and cards. none with autographs already on them.

Apparently he did pick up a decent bit of cash for the jimmy fund that way.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by steve B

I don't recall them mentioning it, but I'd like to think that Ted was a decent enough guy to not simply stamp something that had multiple signatures.

It was your comment about him using the stamp while 'signing' in person that was stunning to me. If it was known up-front, no problem - then it would just be plain strange.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by Runscott

It was your comment about him using the stamp while 'signing' in person that was stunning to me. If it was known up-front, no problem - then it would just be plain strange.

From what I recall, it was known to the people with season tickets who went after autographs. Probably not known to the people who were casual collectors. From what they said, he was very open about using the stamp. I don't know how consistent that use was, but it seemed pretty consistent.

It's possible the donation changed situationally too. The guys I knew were pretty regular and were always looking for autographs. So they may have gotten a big upcharge being regulars. They also took photos, and got an invite onto the field after giving one player a photo they'd taken.


It's all going off a roughly 40 year old memory of stuff I was told about. I wasn't an autograph hunter back then, and have really only made a handful of tries in situations other than shows. (And not many there either)