1925-1931? Exhibit Lou Gehrig Rookie Card!!! W/Strip

[Tenney]

Alright I need everyone's help. Two weeks of research no one has ever seen one. It's not a reprint, it was down the road from Hoy Field at one point. It's the exhibit rookie photo, yet it's a strip. The gentleman that sold it to me has a storied career in the majors and was friends with Ted Williams.

[ullmandds]

sorry but your images are still way too small to deduce anything? If it's not a full size exhibit...it is 99% a fake of some kind.

[Tenney]

Ya we had the paper stock checked out, it's concurrent with the 20's. I will take some better pics.

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[Tenney]

Here

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[Leon]

I still think it's fake from the looks of it. Just my opinion and hope I am wrong. This was moved from the BST section too....

And I would want to know who checked out the paper too?

[Tenney]

I have done my homework and have had it verified be separate independent sources I trust that say this card was made and printed on paper from the 1920's. The print pattern and certain marks on the card match that of the exhibit post card.

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[Leon]

Originally Posted by Tenney

I have done my homework and have had it verified be separate independent sources I trust that say this card was made and printed on paper from the 1920's. The print pattern and certain marks on the card match that of the exhibit post card.

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I think in the long run you will find you made mistakes on this. I am with Peter in that it is not going to be real. Again, I have been wrong before but I will be really surprised if this turns out real. I have handled a ton of reprints and fakes and that one looks almost exactly like the ones I have handled. Not that they will know (due to what we have seen recently) but send it to a TPG and see what they say. I would send it to BVG for the best answer . I can help with that if you are interested....a PM would be best. But regardless good luck with it. I hope it is real for your sake...

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Leon

I think in the long run you will find you made mistakes on this. I am with Peter in that it is not going to be real. Again, I have been wrong before but I will be really surprised if this turns out real. I have handled a ton of reprints and fakes and that one looks almost exactly like the ones I have handled. Not that they will know (due to what we have seen recently) but send it to a TPG and see what they say. I would send it to BVG for the best answer . I can help with that if you are interested....a PM would be best. But regardless good luck with it. I hope it is real for your sake...

And if all else fails you can parade it from one media outlet to the next claiming it's real and worth millions despite the opinions of numerous "experts" who have decades of hobby experience as well as TPG'ers (for all that's worth) who say it's fake!

[Snapolit1]

Best of luck. Convinced me. Those unnamed independent sources get me every time.

[RCMcKenzie]

What does it have on the back? Does that say "Ithaca, New York"? What are the dimensions? Why are you calling it a "strip card"? Here's one from an old H&S auction...Yours looks to have a tint to it. It may be the scan...

[kevinlenane]

Eh, I don't think I've ever seen an "exhibit strip card" - but I've seen lots of trimmed ones. FWIW I think these came single out of a machine - not sure there is a history of hand-cut or strip exhibit cards given how they were delivered. Anyone have an example of a gigantic strip of uncut exhibit cards? Would be first for me.

[glchen]

It's a reprint/fake. Artificial ageing for the cardstock, typewriter print on the back. I've seen too many of these type of fakes on ebay.

[steve B]

Paper from the 1920's is easy to find, and most will go through a printer just fine.
There also isn't much difference in paper from say 1880 till the late 1940's

[ctownboy]

Oh boy, not another "the paper was tested by experts" story....

David

[Jobu]

+1 --- Gary is spot on, this is 100% a fake.

Originally Posted by glchen

It's a reprint/fake. Artificial ageing for the cardstock, typewriter print on the back. I've seen too many of these type of fakes on ebay.

[Tenney]

I was just looking for help in piecing together a little history on it. This is me turning to the experts and look how you treat people.

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[Tenney]

It's an old man who sold it to me 70's. He had a career with mlb. Have a bunch of history to go with it and I'm not trying to sell it

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[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Tenney

It's an old man who sold it to me 70's. He had a career with mlb. Have a bunch of history to go with it and I'm not trying to sell it

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Regardless of the "history" you have to go with this...and regardless of your statement that you do not plan to sell it...it's still fake!

[Tenney]

That's mine, not screen shot. It's stamped Ithaca arms Ithaca NY, a gun factory down the road from Hoy Field at cornell

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[ullmandds]

that image looks very different than the others you posted.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Tenney

I was just looking for help in piecing together a little history on it. This is me turning to the experts and look how you treat people.

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No one has treated you unfair at all. You just got an answer you don't like. Per our PMs I am still happy to help but I really do think, as others, it is a foregone conclusion. This isn't a personal attack on you at all. It is only forum members telling you what they think. You might be the nicest guy in the world but that has nothing to do with the card in question.

[x2drich2000]

In addition to what Leon said, a little additional background might help you understand where people are coming from and why they are making the comments they are. A few years ago, a pair of guys came on the board claiming to have a T206 Wagner. They refused to have it graded by any of the established grading companies. Instead they kept taking the card to different "experts" who indicated the paper was right, the ink was right, etc. Despite people telling them exactly why it was not authentic, they just kept pushing on and on about their experts. In their mind, the card was authentic and everyone else was wrong. This thread comes across in the same tone and manner.

[maniac_73]

NOt sure where anyone was treating you unfair. Seems like they were helping you by giving the information you were asking even though it may not be the info you wanted to hear

[Tenney]

Thank you. That makes a lot of things make more sense. I'm more than willing to have it graded

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[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Tenney

I was just looking for help in piecing together a little history on it. This is me turning to the experts and look how you treat people.

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How are we "treating" you? Nobody has insulted you, called you names, or insinuated that you're trying to commit fraud. We've just tried to tell you that, no matter the story you got when you acquired the card, it has all the earmarks of being fake. Frankly the image quality alone screams reproduction. Can you see the difference in resolution between yours and the one posted from the recent auction?

If you came here expecting people to blindly tell you what you wanted to hear then I guess we have treated you poorly. If you came here wanting opinions from people with tons of experience in the hobby with exactly this kind of thing, then I think we have given you decent return on your time. You also got some reasonable advice to submit it to a TPG, though in all honesty I think most of us feel that would be a waste of money.

What does anyone here stand to gain by telling you it's a fake for no reason?

Do you realize how often we get new members with stories similar to yours, or how often they pop up in the hobby in general? If you can't handle a little cynicism, and that's really about the most offensive thing I've seen in regards to this card, despite the fact that this is your second thread on the subject, then you don't really want opinions you want validation.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Tenney

Thank you. That makes a lot of things make more sense. I'm more than willing to have it graded

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Th problem with that is it is an unknown item, none of them grade unknown items as far as I know.

As to your story, I had a very similar thing happen recently. Can't remember if it was on this forum or eBay. Anyway something about the item just seemed off to me. Owner said they got it from a guy they had been doing business with for decades and still was doing business with the seller. The item came with a great story.

We worked out a price we could both live with. After I received the item I knew it was not what it was supposed to be. I emailed the seller and told them what the item really was. Seller told me he could not believe the other person lied to him.

I told him maybe that guy got the same story he told you and was being honest. Just because something turns out bad it does't mean the person who sold it to you was the POS scammer.

Good luck to the OP and his item.

[Exhibitman]

Fake as f***. Without even seeing the card in person I can tell you three things about it:

1. ESCO never made minis of its 1925 cards, nor did anyone else do so. The only ESCO minis ever made were strips made from the PC back set (W517, W517 mini, and a very rare series of ten card horizontal strips). That's it. What you have there doesn't match with anything else ever seen. The odds of that happening and it being a 1925 Gehrig are, well, slim to none with slim leaving the building as we speak.

2. There is a seller at the National every year who has a number of these sorts of smaller versions of larger cards with various typed or printed attributions on the backs. All are rare/expensive cards of superstars and all are fakes.

3. A close look at the 'card' will show that it is made from a scan downloaded from an auction site, printed, and artificially aged. I found a great example of one at the National and bought it as a novelty:



It is really well done as a card of JJ's Fatima poster and way fun to have but it won't fool anyone with any understanding of vintage cards.

I posted the Jackson information in the other thread you started on the issue yesterday and that was the end of that thread. Now, you've started another thread asking the same thing and posted the card in a BST thread in reply to someone looking to buy a genuine Gehrig RC. That suggests that you are less interested in an answer than in trying to find someone who will agree with you and validate your belief that you have a unique Gehrig rookie card, and perhaps offer you Gehrig RC pricing for it.

The skepticism here is not personal and not unreasonable. Characterizing it as otherwise is an effort to deflect the actual and valid critique of your item. You asked, people answered.

There are at least two other collectors on here who are as well versed in Exhibit cards as I am, probably even better. If one of them chimes in and has something different to say, I'd love to hear it. I suspect, though, that you just got taken for a ride on a very nicely made fake. Sorry.

If you want to learn more about Exhibit cards than any reasonable person should:

http://www.lulu.com/shop/adam-warsha...-23637151.html

[shameless plug]

[Tenney]

I agree with you guys. That's shitty of people to do. I was actually just trying to find a place to tell me if it's real or not. I respect all your guys insight. It's been two weeks of trying to figure it out. Just wanted some help. Unfortunately what we are holding is real. So price and location of this TPG and I can get out of here. My apologies this is the first forum I've joined. Sorry if I didn't do it correctly with the thread. I DONT WANT TO SELL THIS CARD REGARDLESS.

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[111gecko]

No one is being unfair. Everyone on this site supports each other and the new members. Trust me.. We all want it to be real for you.

[Tenney]

Hey thanks.

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[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Tenney

I was actually just trying to find a place to tell me if it's real or not.

what we are holding is real

Then you didn't actually want opinions.

[Snapolit1]

Hint: if you are looking to snow people with bs or for blind affirmation of outlandish positions, this ain't the place.

Of course is a real something. It's just not what you are desperately hoping it is.

[Tenney]

No one is desperate. It's been fun learning about the older cards and since it cost 5bucks from an old man off of offer-up by accident. Think it's something neat. I could tell you about my 3,500 mint collection from 80-20 that ain't worth dick, butt that's not why we are here. Yes, opinions on the best places to have something like this graded were sought. My question now would be how to mail it to a stranger and feel comfortable about as I'm sure you already know these things.

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[Tenney]

Side note, wife's a doctor at Joe DiMaggio children's hospital. We were going to donate money in Gehrigs name as Joe did his best to fill Lou's shoes.

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[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Tenney

Side note, wife's a doctor at Joe DiMaggio children's hospital. We were going to donate money in Gehrigs name as Joe did his best to fill Lou's shoes.

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You should really stop now. It's like you're following the formula of every scammer who's come before you. I'm not saying you are dishonest, just that you're not helping your cause.

[Jobu]

If you want to get it graded, you can send it to either of these places:

https://www.psacard.com/

https://gosgc.com/

The result is going to be spending money for one of them to tell you that it has questionable authenticity (their phrasing for fake/modern/fantasy piece). They will send it back to you not enclosed in one of their holders so you will have the card just as you have it now.

It is certainly your call on paying the money for this, and I understand some hesitancy of trusting a bunch of people on the internet with whom you have never interacted, so I can see some motivation for wanting to send it in. I would ask that you come back here to post the results when they send the card back.

[Jim65]

I always have to laugh when people seek experts opinions then tell those experts they are wrong when they don't like the answers.

[JackW]

Originally Posted by Jim65

I always have to laugh when people seek experts opinions then tell those experts they are wrong when they don't like the answers.

See the "Need some input regarding US mail legalities and baseball cards" thread.

[Tenney]

Thank you Jobu. Some Major League love right there thank you sir.

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[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Jobu

I understand some hesitancy of trusting a bunch of people on the internet with whom you have never interacted

Then why ask them? He would've "trusted" us if we told him what he wanted to hear.