EBay Best Offer Game Playing

[Snapolit1]

I realize it's not completely rational, but when I make a decent opening offer on an expensive item and someone takes more than a day to respond, I assume there is some game playing going on. And I immediately am inclined not to do a deal. If you list a pretty valuable item, and really want to sell it, I'm guessing you don't need 35 hours to respond. There is a part of me that realizes a work crisis could intervene or you could be dealing with a family situation that's more important than a baseball card sale, but I just can't help it. I feel like you are playing games. And I don't care that eBay gives you twice as long to respond. As I just being an ass?

[T206Collector]

That annoys me, too. I would guess it is a negotiation strategy. Doesn't mean it works. However, I would interpret a fast response with a lower price to signal an interest in going further down in price.

[Snapolit1]

Very few of us have cards that others don't. If you want to sell something don't yank my chain. Chances are someone else is selling the same card in the same condition or will be shortly.

[drcy]

I agree with your point, though know that some dealers wait to see if someone else is going to make an offer.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Very few of us have cards that others don't. If you want to sell something don't yank my chain. Chances are someone else is selling the same card in the same condition or will be shortly.

Or just maybe the person selling the card does not do it for a living and is not logged into eBay 24/7.

I know I sometime sell on eBay and only check stuff every few days. I sometimes use the Make Offer option but unfortunately I get those idiots that want to make a low offer then expect me to waste my time negotiating instead of just offering their best price to begin with.

Buyers are just like cards another one will come buy shortly.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Since when is there anything wrong with a negotiating strategy, particularly on an expensive item? If you need instant gratification hit the BIN, otherwise be patient. Geez.

[calvindog]

Not everyone obsesses over a $100 card or even a $10,000 card when selling it. Sometimes people are just really busy. I don't think you should read much into it.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by drcy

I agree with your point, though know that some dealers wait to see if someone else is going to make an offer.

Nothing wrong with that, as a seller one has no obligation to sell the card to the first person who asks.

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Not everyone obsesses over a $100 card or even a $10,000 card when selling it. Sometimes people are just really busy. I don't think you should read much into it.

I realize people are busy, but if you are selling a lot of cards, and are not an occasional seller, I'm guessing this is an important source of income to you, and you pay more than passing attention to an item that's listed for sale for a few thousand dollars.

As far as a negotiating strategy, sure that's fine. I'm a busy guy too, and I don't have two days to wait for you to get off your touchas to respond.

And I'm talking about a card that has been listed for many months.

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Or just maybe the person selling the card does not do it for a living and is not logged into eBay 24/7.

I know I sometime sell on eBay and only check stuff every few days. I sometimes use the Make Offer option but unfortunately I get those idiots that want to make a low offer then expect me to waste my time negotiating instead of just offering their best price to begin with.

Buyers are just like cards another one will come buy shortly.

If someone makes an offer on your item you get an email. Do you know a lot of people who don't check their emails for a few days? Other than my 82 year old mother I don't.

[Snapolit1]

I guess my point is is, if its a negotiating strategy, I think it's a crappy one. I am a not infrequent seller and a frequent buyer. When I list something for sale I actually want to sell it. And I'm happy when a potential bidder emerges. I engage them pretty quickly and if I am lucky enough to have competing bidders I am very happy. Maybe I'm old school but I feel as seller that I owe my potential buyer a relatively quick response either way. Can't believe it would take me more than a day to reject or make a counter offer.

If the seller is unable to take a few seconds to respond in a day because of some other situation that is more urgent that's understandable.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

If someone makes an offer on your item you get an email. Do you know a lot of people who don't check their emails for a few days? Other than my 82 year old mother I don't.

Add me to that list with your 82 year old mother.

[Snapolit1]

OK, added. I now know 2.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

I realize people are busy, but if you are selling a lot of cards, and are not an occasional seller, I'm guessing this is an important source of income to you, and you pay more than passing attention to an item that's listed for sale for a few thousand dollars.

As far as a negotiating strategy, sure that's fine. I'm a busy guy too, and I don't have two days to wait for you to get off your touchas to respond.

And I'm talking about a card that has been listed for many months.

So retract your offer and move on, why get worked up about it? Bitching about it is as wasteful as bitching about high BINs.

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

So retract your offer and move on, why get worked up about it? Bitching about it is as wasteful as bitching about high BINs.

Not really bitching, just wondering why someone would employ that as a deliberate strategy.

Sort of like saying to someone who enters you store "I will be right with you." Sure, someone can decide for some reason that they don't care to do it, but curious to me why they would.

[mintacular]

I think you are projecting what you would do. At the end of the day, there is a policy and that is what you should follow. The seller has 48 hours? to respond or whatever, if it takes them to that point to counter, than so be it...

[vintagerookies51]

Why would this be a negotiating strategy? I think people just don't go on eBay multiple times a day and you're overthinking it...

[scooter729]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Not really bitching, just wondering why someone would employ that as a deliberate strategy.

Ok, I will bite. Say the item is listed at $3,000, and you offered $2,500. Maybe the seller is willing to accept that, but before he accepts, he is waiting for something close to 48 hours to see if an offer higher than $2,500 comes in. If so, great and he goes with that. If not, he hits accept on yours before it expires.

What's wrong with that?

[swarmee]

Why would they leave your offer sitting there? Because if there are a lot of watchers or page views, and there are open offers on the item, the odds are better that one of those watchers or viewers is going to click "Buy it Now" for full price. Or at least make a strong offer knowing one is already out there and the item could be bought at any time.
I respond very quickly to offers, but I completely understand why not everyone does.

[AGuinness]

Originally Posted by scooter729

Ok, I will bite. Say the item is listed at $3,000, and you offered $2,500. Maybe the seller is willing to accept that, but before he accepts, he is waiting for something close to 48 hours to see if an offer higher than $2,500 comes in. If so, great and he goes with that. If not, he hits accept on yours before it expires.

What's wrong with that?

True dat. Or another: the seller already has another offer in hand and started negotiating with that buyer first, and now is just waiting to see where that lands.

I'd say a 48-hour window is about the right amount of time for a seller to have (24 hours would probably be too short, given all the things that can happen in life).

BUT, one of the things that separates an average seller and a great seller is that the great seller will reach out and let the potential buyer know the offer was received and will be considered but needs a little time for it.

[PhillipAbbott79]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

If someone makes an offer on your item you get an email. Do you know a lot of people who don't check their emails for a few days? Other than my 82 year old mother I don't.

There are lots of very serious dead spots in the middle states, and cell phones break.

There are lots of reasons why people don't respond for a few days. People are getting ready for summer, going to graduations, planning parties, birthdays, vacations, etc.

People do not always work standard business hours and may be dead asleep or work double shifts.

Some people just don't view it as super important, and most email systems now have some sort of lag or delay.

Personally my wife praises my ability to not work on a computer, when I am actually capable of doing so.

[savedfrommyspokes]

My response time on best offers depends on two things.....how recently the item was listed, and the offer price as compared to others.

First, if the item was listed in the past few days (up to a week) and there is a lot of activity around the item, I typically do wait the full 48 hours if I like the buyers offer to see if there is not another offer.

Second, if I have a first offer out, and the price on a second offer is in my acceptance range but lower than the first, I will likely wait to see what happens with the first.

Either way, if I am not responding to an offer immediately, it is because it is a reasonable one .... if an offer is not in my range, I would either decline if it was super low or counter with my price.

[basesareempty]

Originally Posted by scooter729

Ok, I will bite. Say the item is listed at $3,000, and you offered $2,500. Maybe the seller is willing to accept that, but before he accepts, he is waiting for something close to 48 hours to see if an offer higher than $2,500 comes in. If so, great and he goes with that. If not, he hits accept on yours before it expires.

What's wrong with that?

Or maybe the buyer offered a ridiculous $1000 offer on a $3000 item and doesn't feel the need to respond to such a silly offer. Me personally, if offered $1000 on a $3000 item would counter with $2999 so the buyer gets the message, especially if the $3000 item is priced correctly.

[Rookiemonster]

On board with hating this. Because in the mean time you could be missing out on something because your waiting on a response.

So I started to do this. When it ask you how much you would like to offer I put in the amount . Under that window is another that says what are the terms of this offer. I ussally put response within this amount of time or my offer is void.

[Snapolit1]

Originally Posted by basesareempty

Or maybe the buyer offered a ridiculous $1000 offer on a $3000 item and doesn't feel the need to respond to such a silly offer. Me personally, if offered $1000 on a $3000 item would counter with $2999 so the buyer gets the message, especially if the $3000 item is priced correctly.

My experience is that I offer $1000 on a $3000 item because two days ago one sold at an AH for $1400 and my $1000 offer, perfectly rational, mortally offends sellers sensibilities and he ignores me. Just happened this week.

[Huysmans]

Originally Posted by scooter729

Ok, I will bite. Say the item is listed at $3,000, and you offered $2,500. Maybe the seller is willing to accept that, but before he accepts, he is waiting for something close to 48 hours to see if an offer higher than $2,500 comes in. If so, great and he goes with that. If not, he hits accept on yours before it expires.

What's wrong with that?

I think some buyers see the problem with that being the hypocrisy of some sellers/dealers.
If a person walked into a card store let's say, or approached a dealer at a show and tried to sell a card and received an offer, but then told said dealer that he wants to shop the card around the show for the next 2 days to see if he can receive a higher offer, and if not, could he return and accept the original offer? .... Most dealers would respond no, the offer expires when you go to shop it somewhere else....

Therein lies the problem for some, and legitimately so.

[TheBigRedOne]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

My experience is that I offer $1000 on a $3000 item because two days ago one sold at an AH for $1400 and my $1000 offer, perfectly rational, mortally offends sellers sensibilities and he ignores me. Just happened this week.

Agreed. I typically give reasons why I'm offering what I am, usually based on what's sold recently and/or the approximate value that the t206insider rates a specific card. I got a recent lecture after making a very reasonable offer on a common PSA 3 rated t206 on how the seller wishes that he could buy cards for what a books says and that the real worth is what someone is willing to pay for it.

It's still on eBay at his high asking price, needless to say.

After receiving a similar counter offer, would you bother to reply to that? I didn't.

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by AGuinness

True dat. Or another: the seller already has another offer in hand and started negotiating with that buyer first, and now is just waiting to see where that lands.

I'd say a 48-hour window is about the right amount of time for a seller to have (24 hours would probably be too short, given all the things that can happen in life).

BUT, one of the things that separates an average seller and a great seller is that the great seller will reach out and let the potential buyer know the offer was received and will be considered but needs a little time for it.

I used to do that with sales here, telling people who made decent offers below my asking price that I'd get back to them in a day or two and that if I didn't receive a better offer in the meantime they could have it. Then I got back to one of those people a couple of days later, and he said, "Well, if nobody else offered as much as I did then I guess it's not worth so much. You can keep it." So I don't do that anymore.

[obcbobd]

Originally Posted by vintagerookies51

Why would this be a negotiating strategy? I think people just don't go on eBay multiple times a day and you're overthinking it...

+1

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

My experience is that I offer $1000 on a $3000 item because two days ago one sold at an AH for $1400 and my $1000 offer, perfectly rational, mortally offends sellers sensibilities and he ignores me. Just happened this week.

Why would he sell for less than 1400, Because of the "buyers premium"?


Someone still paid 1400 , and quite recently


You are about 40% below the current market, and krss than half his start price pretty low IMO

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

Why would he sell for less than 1400, Because of the "buyers premium"?


Someone still paid 1400 , and quite recently


You are about 40% below the current market, and krss than half his start price pretty low IMO

28.5% isn't really "about 40% below the current market," but it's still less than what the seller could reasonably expect to clear if he consigned it.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

28.5% isn't really "about 40% below the current market," but it's still less than what the seller could reasonably expect to clear if he consigned it.

Actually 28.5714285714% approximately.

[Republicaninmass]

And a buyer could reasonably expect to pay 1400 plus AH shipping

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

And a buyer could reasonably expect to pay 1400 plus AH shipping

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

Then it would be more than 28.5714285714%

[Snapolit1]

If the seller comes back with something significantly down that acknowledges the card is overpriced based on recent market action I will certainly come up and meet him higher. In most cases I will pay what it just sold for as that's what the market says its worth. But if you drop down $100 or ignore me that's probably the end of the dance.

It's been discussed here a lot. . . many sellers really aren't in a rush to sell their good stuff. If they get a dream price that's hundreds or thousands over their cost depending on the card they will sell. Nothing inherently wrong or immoral with that at all, but it does waste a lot of time.

The nicest most amazing cards I've seen on BST have been listed by Jeff L. And when he lists a card for $75,000 that's pretty much the market value. He doesn't list them at $225,000 when they are worth $75,000.

[megalimey]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

I realize it's not completely rational, but when I make a decent opening offer on an expensive item and someone takes more than a day to respond, I assume there is some game playing going on. And I immediately am inclined not to do a deal. If you list a pretty valuable item, and really want to sell it, I'm guessing you don't need 35 hours to respond. There is a part of me that realizes a work crisis could intervene or you could be dealing with a family situation that's more important than a baseball card sale, but I just can't help it. I feel like you are playing games. And I don't care that eBay gives you twice as long to respond. As I just being an ass?

as THE GODFATHER SAID "I AM GOING TO MAKE HIM AN OFFER HE CANNOT REFUSE" I guess with your "decent offer" that was not the case.

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

28.5% isn't really "about 40% below the current market," but it's still less than what the seller could reasonably expect to clear if he consigned it.

AH and EBAY aren't equal, as as you mentioned this would be less than what the seller would get consigning.

What some buyers don't think about is that the seller doesn't have to give up some to buyer's premium, but that same seller is paying a fee on Ebay that doesn't show up in a final price either. So in the end someone is paying a fee, with AH it is the buyer (typically no commission, but another thread showed one guy paid a commission on top of BP. I never have), with ebay it is the seller.


As far as delaying in a response I agree that it is you projecting. You assumed that someone not responding is just playing games. Yet you even admit there could be other reasons. I am 34 and I don't have a smart phone. I don't have a tablet. I don't have a functional laptop anymore. So unless I am at home or at work in front of a desktop I am not responding to any emails or anything short of phone calls and texts (though I am not always good about responding to those). On top of this it isn't going to my main email, I have a separate email for baseball cards. So sometimes that doesn't even get opened. With as much as my four children have going on it is common for me not to get on over the weekend. If I am anxious (right after my initial listings) I do try and make a point to check, but after a month being listed with no new activity by me it is a bit more sporadic.

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by megalimey

as THE GODFATHER SAID "I AM GOING TO MAKE HIM AN OFFER HE CANNOT REFUSE" I guess with your "decent offer" that was not the case.

Let's hope not. Did you see the movie?

[Gradedcardman]

I agree. Yea I get an email but I get over a hundred a day and have a life outside of cards and work. I try to respond quickly but if the person makes it personal then they can retract or buy it now. I really don't care to be honest. Just like there's always another card there always another buyer.


=calvindog;1664117]Not everyone obsesses over a $100 card or even a $10,000 card when selling it. Sometimes people are just really busy. I don't think you should read much into it.[/QUOTE]

[Stonepony]

Steve....come on...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=219656
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=228798
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=23185
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=233940
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=232511
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=235406
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=238638

Here's a very close paraphrase of a conversation on card on EBay I very much wanted. It was listed at $950 and I feel it's a $500-$600 card.
Me- Hi, I'm very interested in this card. Would you take $650? That's as high as I can go. Thanks for considering.
Seller- Sorry Dave I can't go that low
Me- ok, thank you
Seller- You're welcome

No one flipping out, ranting or wadding up panties for Christ sake.

[Luke]

I agree with what everyone else is saying. My first thought was if you're really offering $1000 on a card listed at $3000, the seller might see it, chuckle or sigh and then quickly forget about it.

I don't use "best offer" when I sell on ebay, but I'll sometimes get an ebay message with someone asking me if I can take $150 for a card I have listed at $300. I get these alerts right away and often I am in line at a store or something when I see them. For an offer like that, I'm not going to drop everything and reply "no thanks" to them, so it will sit until I'm at home on my desktop and see it again.

[steve B]

I think the internet in general has given positive reinforcement to a lot of impatience.

Steve B

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by steve B

I think the internet in general has given positive reinforcement to a lot of impatience.

Steve B

Yep. Instant gratification world.

[ALR-bishop]

Couple of questions. If you make an offer can you put your own time limit on it in a note to seller that eBay will recognize, as someone suggested above ? Also, I think eBay gives you the option to retract your offer before the seller responds, right ? If you do that, does it show up as a bid retraction on your eBay record, the same as retracting a bid on an auction ?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Couple of questions. If you make an offer can you put your own time limit on it in a note to seller that eBay will recognize, as someone suggested above ? Also, I think eBay gives you the option to retract your offer before the seller responds, right ? If you do that, does it show up as a bid retraction on your eBay record, the same as retracting a bid on an auction ?

No, it's not the same as a bid retraction.

[glchen]

I don't think this is always a negotiation strategy. As others have said, sometimes you get busy. The dealer could have seen the offer, but he likely has to do some research to see if that is a price he is willing to accept. He may need some time to look at VCP, see the price he purchased the card for, look at other places the card may have been sold for, etc. Therefore, the dealer may have seen the offer, but still may need a good 45min block of time to do the research and come back with a counteroffer or take the offer as is. And sometimes, it can be hard to find that chunk of time.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Stonepony

Steve....come on...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=219656
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=228798
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=23185
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=233940
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=232511
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=235406
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=238638

Here's a very close paraphrase of a conversation on card on EBay I very much wanted. It was listed at $950 and I feel it's a $500-$600 card.
Me- Hi, I'm very interested in this card. Would you take $650? That's as high as I can go. Thanks for considering.
Seller- Sorry Dave I can't go that low
Me- ok, thank you
Seller- You're welcome

No one flipping out, ranting or wadding up panties for Christ sake.

Agreed. This isn't difficult, but people sure can try to make it seem so.

[RedsFan1941]

Originally Posted by Stonepony

Steve....come on...

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=219656
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=228798
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=23185
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=233940
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=232511
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=235406
http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=238638

Here's a very close paraphrase of a conversation on card on EBay I very much wanted. It was listed at $950 and I feel it's a $500-$600 card.
Me- Hi, I'm very interested in this card. Would you take $650? That's as high as I can go. Thanks for considering.
Seller- Sorry Dave I can't go that low
Me- ok, thank you
Seller- You're welcome

No one flipping out, ranting or wadding up panties for Christ sake.

awesome post

[JasonD08]

If you make a stupid lowball offer I will not even respond. People that are reasonable get a reasonable response. Simple. I buy and sell and treat respect with respect. If you do not like it you can always move on. I treat my purchasing the same way. If a seller is grossly overpriced and will not deal I simply move on without bitching about it.

[T205 GB]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

My experience is that I offer $1000 on a $3000 item because two days ago one sold at an AH for $1400 and my $1000 offer, perfectly rational, mortally offends sellers sensibilities and he ignores me. Just happened this week.

Yeah but what did the past 2-3 sell for? Could have been a fluke that the AH card sold for less. Either way offering 33% of asking is a kick in the sack and I can bet you he too seen the one at auction. I bet the one you offered on was also a nicer card than the AH one too. I don't know you Steve but I just get the vibe that you always have to be correct about whatever it is.