PSA "Authentic Altered" v. "Authentic Trimmed"

[Bliggity]

I just called PSA with this question but they were completely useless.

I'm looking at a card in a PSA holder that says "Authentic Altered." I'm trying to determine if the alteration is trimming. I have seen some trimmed cards in PSA holders that say "Authentic Trimmed," and so I thought maybe an "Altered" designation meant that the alteration was something other than trimming. However, there are other PSA cards that are clearly trimmed, where the "Authentic Altered" designation is used, instead of "Authentic Trimmed." Here are examples of two trimmed cards in the two different types of slabs (not my cards):




What determines whether a trimmed card ends up slabbed "Authentic Trimmed" or "Authentic Altered?" I'm guessing that the "trimmed" designation is an old style that is not used anymore, and now all types of alterations, including trimmed cards, end up with the "altered" designation. If that's true, then it means a card labeled "Authentic Altered" might be recolored/etc, but it also could be trimmed only, with no other alterations. Is that correct? Thanks all.

[Leon]

It reminds me of that subset game we played in elementary. Every trimmed card is altered but every altered card isn't trimmed . I don't know the real answer unfortunately.

[Den*nis O*Brien]

When you say PSA was "Useless" regarding your inquiry....do you mean that they could not articulate the difference between the two designations? Could this have been a "Rookie" customer service rep or was your sense that there were just no company guidelines defining the two? I have called PSA once to ask some basic questions and got what I took as rude, impatient and unhelpful short answers. However other board members do just fine with the staff. So maybe "Luck Of The Draw" on who answers the phone. I would want to know the difference ,in your situation, with clear definitions of their terminology. Seems like a reasonable request from you.
Sincerely, Den*nis O*Brien

[begsu1013]

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[Bliggity]

Originally Posted by Den*nis O*Brien

When you say PSA was "Useless" regarding your inquiry....do you mean that they could not articulate the difference between the two designations? Could this have been a "Rookie" customer service rep?

Yes - this. I probably could have called again and found someone else who knew the answer, but thought I'd try here first.

[glchen]

I think it's as you said, the Altered qualifier is a superset of the Trimmed one, so could include trimming, recoloring, attempted erasure of marks, rebuilt corners, etc. Sometimes there are cards that are marked Authentic w/o either the Altered or Trimmed, but that could also mean there is trimming, etc, similar to Altered, or just that the card is so worn down and beat up that it didn't even merit the Poor grade.

[ls7plus]

Yes, "altered" could mean any one of a number of alterations having been done to the card, including trimming, while "altered--trimmed" makes the latter conclusive.

May collecting be joyful,

Larry

[JustCollectVP]

In my experience, the use of the terms ALTERED and TRIMMED are at any given time, synonymous, ambiguous or incongruous. There seems to be no rhyme or reason with respect to the application or lack of application of the TRIMMED quantifier and seems to be dependent upon the mood of the grader.

I guess it is what it is . . . unless it isn't.

[basesareempty]

Originally Posted by ls7plus

Yes, "altered" could mean any one of a number of alterations having been done to the card, including trimming, while "altered--trimmed" makes the latter conclusive.

May collecting be joyful,

Larry

This seems pretty clear to me!

[Bliggity]

Ok - on the third call to PSA, I think I have the answer. I'm now told that prior to about 2010, PSA would designate certain types of alterations on the flip, such as "Authentic Trimmed" or "Authentic Recolored." However, for the past few years, they are no longer designating the type of alteration, but grouping everything generally under the "Authentic Altered" flip. So, an "Authentic Altered" designation could be just a trim, but there's no way to know.

I don't have 100% confidence in that answer, but I guess I'll go with it for now.

[GasHouseGang]

Is that more in line with what SGC does? I have this card that is trimmed, but it doesn't say trimmed, it just say AUTH, which I guess is their word of choice instead of ALTERED.