Thinking of starting a W554 set

[x2drich2000]

Good afternoon,

I'm currently considering starting another set and the W554 set caught my attention. However, I am not familiar with this set and was hoping I could get some more information regarding this issue. Due to budget constraints, I imagine I would be looking at VG or lower condition. Below are some of the questions I have, but please feel free to add any additional info you may have.

What is the card stock?
Are they condition sensitive?
Any common condition issues?
What is the difference between the B&W and browntone? Are all cards found in both versions? Any premium on either version?
From the checklist it seems Ruth & Gehrig are the two big cards. What is the general fair market value of these two in VG? How about commons?
How difficult are the cards to locate via Ebay or major shows like Philly?
Any individuals that are more scarce than others?

I know that is a lot of questions, just trying to get a better idea of the set and see if it’s actually something to consider pursuing further.

Thanks
dj

[fkw]

It would be a good set to collect, especially to display. The W554 set has the highest % of HOFers of all sets of its size with 13/18 being HOFers and also an O'Doul who should be.

Ive only had maybe 10 of them over the years and all have been the sepia with name at bottom type. I think the B&W ones are really the cards aka R316 5"by7", but Im not sure, maybe some can show a true B&W W554. The SCD Catalog says the W554 are B&W and this should be corrected as they are obviously sepia in most cases.

The stock of the Sepia ones Ive had is sturdy for the size, far thicker than R309-2, R310, R311, R312. The main condition prob would be corners and maybe pinholes, they dont seen to have many big creases but sometimes corner creasing. Most if not all of the images are the same as the R316 group (3 sets), and the smaller W553 and Leader Novelty sets.

The commons can be had in nice shape for under $25 sometimes, and the HOFers sometimes for $35-$50 or slightly more.



edited to correct to 13 HOFers

[Leon]

Nice, inexpensive set to collect. I am not familiar with black and white ones at all. Would love to see one. Also, some of these have neat stamps on the backs of them. regards

[fkw]

Leon your top one is almost B&W, and its the kind w/o the caption on bottom border too. love the back stamps, those are very tough

[lhardem]

Paul Griggs wrote a comprehensive article in Issue #18 of Old Cardbaord magazine, including a full set gallery, display of three different back variations and examples of other sets that use the W554 images. You can see an abstract of Paul's article at www.oldcardboard.com/misc/issue18/issue18.asp.

The W554 Gehrig pose is also found in the 1933 Goudey set. Unless I am mistaken, 13 of the 18 W554 players are now in the HOF.

Lyman

[paul]

Any explanation for this one? It's the size and stock of a W554.

[leftygrove10]

Frank: The 1929 R316 5x7's are different... They are glossy and are on a different stock... See below....

Here are the two 1930 W554 variations (sepia on left, black/white on right):


Here is the 1929 R316 5x7 (very hard to find):

[fkw]

Thanks Brad, nice to see all 3 of them together.

Maybe all the noncaption W554's are the B&W kind? looks like yours, Pauls and Leons are B&W to me.

[leftygrove10]

Frank:

You are correct. All of the non-caption W554's are black and white and all of the captioned cards are brown/sepia. Although I couldn't find a scan (I know I've made a comparison in the past), I believe that you can tell which variation it is by just looking at the back of the card. The backs are a slightly different color.

[x2drich2000]

Thank you everyone for your help. I am really leaning toward starting this set now. I imagine the Ruth and Gehrig are going to cost more than other HOFers, any idea how much more? Also, Paul's Ott seems a little different than other Ott's. Notice the Giants text in the lower right. The one on the old Cardboard site (http://www.oldcardboard.com/w/w554/w554gal.asp) and this one that ended on Ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com/1930-W554-Mel-Ot...item33622cd567) do not. Thoughts?

dj

[glchen]

I recently picked this up at the most recent Baggers auction, and it is a sepia W554 with no caption.

[Jaybird]

As long as we're reviving an old thread... got this one on ebay within the last month.

[glchen]

Yea, I revived this thread because earlier Brad said that all sepia's were captioned and all b/w were non-captioned, and wanted to show an exception.

[leftygrove10]

Originally Posted by glchen

Yea, I revived this thread because earlier Brad said that all sepia's were captioned and all b/w were non-captioned, and wanted to show an exception.

Gary:

Do you have sepia captioned and b/w non-captioned images that you can show next to the Gehrig -- preferably from the same camera or scanner that was used to make the Gehrig image above? I want to see the sepia vs black and white differences.

Thanks!

Brad

[glchen]

Brad,

Unfortunately, I don't have a B/W W554. I did also recently pickup a W554 Ruth and Gehrig from ebay with captions, but I sent these to PSA along with the SGC one above. (Basically, I was going to keep the SGC one in its holder, but when I received it, the holder was cracked open during shipping, so I sent it w/ the others to PSA.) I'll post back in a month since it typically takes PSA a month real time for 10 business day submissions. (Note the previous scan was taken from the Baggers auctions, and the ones included here are directly from the ebay auctions.) I do have a 1929 R316 5x7 Gehrig that's B/W that might be able to make a bit of a comparison that I can include.

[glchen]

I've gotten the cards back from PSA, so here are the cards from the same camera. I also have scans if needed from the same scanner. I think the W554's are both sepia, and I've used as a comparison a Kashin 5x7 Photo.

[leftygrove10]

Gary:

Your two Gehrig's do look sepia. It begs the question, "Does a no-caption Gehrig exist in black and white?"

I have two Grove's with caption and they are both sepia. I have two Grove's with no-caption and they are both black and white. So maybe there is a third variation that is sepa without the caption...

That's a nice R316 5x7.... They are hard to find....

[x2drich2000]

Gary,

Do you know why the one Gehrig came back as altered?

dj

[glchen]

Hi DJ, for that Gehrig, the card stock on the W554 is very thick, so that crease down the middle is really a fold that nearly breaks the card in half. On the back side of the card, I had to add tape to make sure that the pieces don't come apart, which is the reason for the Altered Qualifier from PSA.

[deadballpaul]

Gary, those Gehrigs are beautiful cards. Also, the no caption W554s look B&W, & they are on slightly thiner stock. I own many of both variations.

[glchen]

Reviving this thread as a recent W554 set with many variations sold in the last Love of the Game auctions here: Link

Just checking to see if any more non-caption W554's have been discovered out there. For my personal benefit, if anyone knows of a W554 non-caption Ruth or if a b/w non-caption b/c Gehrig exist, I'd be happy to know about it. Thanks!

To add a picture, here are my W554 caption and Kashin 5x7 Photo, just missing the W554 non-caption variation.