Lou Gehrig ball on Ebay

[CMIZ5290]

Is this the same seller that several people have complained about on other autographs? The Ebay # is 381511964142. This signature is a joke....

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Here's the link for everyone:

http://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/381511964142


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[CMIZ5290]

How is this guy getting these COA's? Some of these autographs look like Stevie Wonder signed them....

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

How is this guy getting these COA's? Some of these autographs look like Stevie Wonder signed them....

I def noticed that as well on a few...


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[Snapolit1]

Why I will never buy an autograph. Particularly off eBay. Way too much fraud.

[HOF Auto Rookies]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Why I will never buy an autograph. Particularly off eBay. Way too much fraud.

Sucks because that's my medium, but I'd be lying if I never thought of getting an auto again...


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[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Is this the same seller that several people have complained about on other autographs? The Ebay # is 381511964142. This signature is a joke....Who is this seller?? How are these balls getting COA's?

Comes with full LOA from JSA with no clubhouse, removals or trace overs.




This autograph is guaranteed authentic and has been certified by JSA, the authority on autograph authentication.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Comes with full LOA from JSA with no clubhouse, removals or trace overs.




This autograph is guaranteed authentic and has been certified by JSA, the authority on autograph authentication.

Peter, I know that. Having said that, do you think this autograph is legit?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Peter, I know that. Having said that, do you think this autograph is legit?

Well beyond my expertise. Why do you think it isn't?

[CMIZ5290]

delete..

[David Atkatz]

The Gehrig signature is perfectly fine.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

The Gehrig signature is perfectly fine.

David, You have seen Gehrig sigs like this?

[David Atkatz]

Absolutely. It's a late career signature.

[CMIZ5290]

Are you joking or what? Look at this guys listings on Ebay. He has Jimmie Foxx and Ty Cobb balls that look like a second grader signed them. Do you mind sending me a copy of a late career Gehrig that looks badly like this? thanks...

[CMIZ5290]

Please give me your opinion on this joke of a ball. JSAY37206, this is the authentication number, Jimmie Foxx ball that this guy has on Ebay right now, absolutely ridiculous....Ebay number is 381256028101, this ball is almost comical..."Jimmy Foxx"? Absolutely unbelievable, and I'm really surprised that more people have not commented on it...

[pokerplyr80]

I'm far from an autograph expert but it seems you have a strong opinion about the Gehrig and Foxx balls. I looked up the listings. Do you mind sharing what gives them away as obvious fakes?

[Tedski_TX]

What does that mean, "with no clubhouse?"

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Comes with full LOA from JSA with no clubhouse, removals or trace overs.




This autograph is guaranteed authentic and has been certified by JSA, the authority on autograph authentication.

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Are you joking or what? Look at this guys listings on Ebay. He has Jimmie Foxx and Ty Cobb balls that look like a second grader signed them. Do you mind sending me a copy of a late career Gehrig that looks badly like this? thanks...

No, I'm not joking. The Gehrig is good. But, as I've got no dog in this fight, I really don't care what you think of the signature, or what you think of my opinion of the signature, for that matter. But let me give you a little tip. If you really want someone to help you out by providing exemplars, don't get nasty first.

[yanks12025]

I'm not a expert, but that Foxx looks like all other Foxx autos that I have seen. Not sure were you get it looks like a second grader wrote it.

[jgmp123]

I will say one thing, it's hard not to believe that Jimmie Foxx hasn't been heavily traced over.

[yanks12025]

Never mind I was looking at another foxx ball.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

No, I'm not joking. The Gehrig is good. But, as I've got no dog in this fight, I really don't care what you think of the signature, or what you think of my opinion of the signature, for that matter. But let me give you a little tip. If you really want someone to help you out by providing exemplars, don't get nasty first.

I did not mean to be nasty with you. My point was only that some of these autographs are a joke, and how in the Hell did they get COA's? I know you know autographs and I asked you about the Gehrig ball because I have never seen it with this much difference. The Foxx ball is a joke, and yes, it has the worthless COA...What's your opinion on that ball? Second time I've asked it. There is no way in Hell PSA certified this piece of garbage. If they did, where there's smoke there's normally fire and a lot of questions need to be answered....

[David Atkatz]

Do you mean the 1920s Foxx ball? I don't like it. But I am not knowledgable at all regarding Foxx's signature.

[CMIZ5290]

David- Do you mean to tell me that you're not sure of this autograph? Come on, I don't buy that at all. You know the hobby. Why are people hiding from this guy and James Spence's bullshit? Even if you didn't know Foxx's sig, look at the boldness of the ink of the signatures. It looks like it was signed yesterday with a black sharpie. Also, Jimmy, not Jimmie? The members on this board need to know when they can get constructive help pertaining the hobby...

[David Atkatz]

What do you want me to say? I don't like it. At all. But I don't know Foxx. (I like to think that when I offer my opinion, it's an educated opinion. I'm not educated about Foxx.)

You think I'm "protecting" JSA and PSA? Then you don't know me at all. I've been against TPAs from the get go. And I find their "expertise" laughable.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

What do you want me to say? I don't like it. At all. But I don't know Foxx. (I like to think that when I offer my opinion, it's an educated opinion. I'm not educated about Foxx.)

You think I'm "protecting" JSA and PSA? Then you don't know me at all. I've been against TPAs from the get go. And I find their "expertise" laughable.

David... No, I didn't mean you at all. But whoever this seller is has some super strong connections, or so it would seem. I was only hoping that more people would come forward and speak up about some of these bullshit autographs..

[btcarfagno]

I'm not sure how the Foxx ball dates to the 1920's. Bob Johnson's career didn't start until 1933. Assuming this was signed while they were teammates, it would date to 1933-1935.

Tom C

[Runscott]

I'm only chiming in because a board member asked me about this, and because this is exactly the kind of thread that I think we need to see more of in this sub-forum - we're talking about vintage autographs and we've got people participating who have expertise.

...but I'm not one of them But I can say that a very similar situation came up for me when I was looking for a Gehrig autograph. I asked David A about it, thinking it was an absurdly ugly Gehrig, and David educated me on the fact that Gehrig's autographs changed over time and that there were idiosyncrasies with Gehrig's autograph within a time period as well, depending on various factors. I had complete faith in David's assessment at that time, and no reason to change my thinking now.

So, with Gehrig there are some ugly ones that are real. On the other hand, there are plenty of Gehrig autographs out there that are obviously real - beautiful signatures in ink - so there's no reason to consider one that you aren't very confident in.

I never did buy a Gehrig, because I never felt personally confident enough in my own ability to authenticate them. I still feel that when it comes to high-end autographs, if you aren't willing to do the research and learn enough to feel more confident in your own opinion than in JSA's or PSA's, then you should keep your money in your pocket.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Runscott

I'm only chiming in because a board member asked me about this, and because this is exactly the kind of thread that I think we need to see more of in this sub-forum - we're talking about vintage autographs and we've got people participating who have expertise.

...but I'm not one of them But I can say that a very similar situation came up for me when I was looking for a Gehrig autograph. I asked David A about it, thinking it was an absurdly ugly Gehrig, and David educated me on the fact that Gehrig's autographs changed over time and that there were idiosyncrasies with Gehrig's autograph within a time period as well, depending on various factors. I had complete faith in David's assessment at that time, and no reason to change my thinking now.

So, with Gehrig there are some ugly ones that are real. On the other hand, there are plenty of Gehrig autographs out there that are obviously real - beautiful signatures in ink - so there's no reason to consider one that you aren't very confident in.

I never did buy a Gehrig, because I never felt personally confident enough in my own ability to authenticate them. I still feel that when it comes to high-end autographs, if you aren't willing to do the research and learn enough to feel more confident in your own opinion than in JSA's or PSA's, then you should keep your money in your pocket.

Scott- Great input, thanks for your opinion and experience...

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by btcarfagno

I'm not sure how the Foxx ball dates to the 1920's. Bob Johnson's career didn't start until 1933. Assuming this was signed while they were teammates, it would date to 1933-1935.

Tom C

Thanks Tom, you are exactly right..

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Scott- Great input, thanks for your opinion and experience...

Thanks Kevin - there is also some contextual research you can do on the Gehrig ball. You've got autographs of Combs, McCarthy, etc., that you can compare to exemplars. If the others are real, you would expect the sweet spot autograph to be real;i.e-why would a ball be filled up with real autographs, and have the sweet spot left empty (a forger taking advantage of the situation years later to add a Gehrig)?

[btcarfagno]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Thanks Tom, you are exactly right..

I have seen a few Foxx signatures where he curved the end of the "e" in a downward fashion where there is some slight similarity with a "y", but this to me is clearly a "y".

No way I would touch this ball with a ten foot pole.

Tom C

[CMIZ5290]

I guess this thread will just die but I hope it at least raises people's awareness to this. These autographs are just ridiculous but I guess he'll just keep laughing all the way to the bank... I still want to know, HOW AND WHY did these get COA's???

[CW]

Originally Posted by Tedski_TX

What does that mean, "with no clubhouse?"

They are claiming the ball has no clubhouse signatures. Clubhouse sigs are not from the players themselves, rather an employee of the ballclub like a trainer or bat boy who mimics the actual player's signature.