Is Dahlen a lock ????? VS others at position why not ??

[Gradedcardman]

Any thoughts on the "pre-integration" committee Hall of Fame voting that happens tomorrow ?? I looked at the stats for Dahlen and he measures up very well. 21 seasons mostly at Shortstop, 100+ runs in his first 6 seasons, 120+ hits 15 times AND was the active HR leader at retirement in the Dead ball era. Gotta be there this time ??

http://baseballhall.org/hall-of-fame...016-candidates

[Topps206]

He should be a lock. Nothing is guaranteed. If I had a vote: Adams, Breadon, Dahlen and Stovey would be those I selected.

While I'm not a champion of his case, I would vote for Walters before I'd vote for Ferrell.

[mybuddyinc]

Dahlen --- YES !!!!!!!!!!!

I have also felt Chris von der Ahe should be in. He did revolutionary things with ownership that weren't even thought of at the time.

Looking up Dahlen the other day, I also checked out George Davis. A lot of people think he shouldn't be in, but with his stats, a definite. Then, right below him in encyclopedia is Harry Davis, who, imo, also should be in.

[Yoda]

Anybody else feel that Tip O'Neil and Jimmy Ryan merit consideration? John

[Griffins]

I'd have Tony Mullane and Lefty O'Doul (for contributions on and off the field) on there as well.

[GregMitch34]

So, forgetting merit, do we think Dahlen WILL get voted in? And why? Because he's still on the ballot while others have been knocked off--and no other strong player candidates?

[Klrdds]

My vote is
Dahlen
Breadon
Stovey

With Herrmann, Adams, and Von Der Ahe worthy of election but not at this time.

[Fred]

The HOF should really look towards creating a "pioneers of the game" section that recognizes the early players from baseball history like Ross Barnes and a host of other 19th century players.

[vthobby]

Originally Posted by Griffins

I'd have Tony Mullane and Lefty O'Doul (for contributions on and off the field) on there as well.

I do not believe Dahlen is a lock but I do think Lefty O'Doul should be in the Hall of Fame!

Dahlen was the (pre Ty Cobb) in terms of surliness and bad attitude. He was not well liked but look where that got Cobb! Of course it helps to have a lifetime .366 BA!

Dahlen's surliness certianly was not limited to the field as The Chicago Inter Ocean of January 4, 1901 reported Dahlen’s wife suing for divorce, alleging he choked her in February 1897 and struck her that December. The suit also claimed Dahlen had threatened his wife’s life and used “vile, abusive, and opprobrious language” toward her.

I guess in retrospect he will fit in nicely with some other Hall of Famers!

Peace, Mike

[Yoda]

Lefty O'Doul owned and ran a bar restaurant in San Francisco. It still exists and serves great pub grub. Right off Union Square, if I recall. Joe DiMaggio, a buddy of Lefty's when they both played with the Seals, tried unsuccessfully for many years to get him into the Hall but to no avail. Probably too late now. John

[GregMitch34]

Again, my query is, forgetting others, is Dahlen a lock--and if so, why????

[RaidonCollects]

One player who I don't think who should get in: Frank McCormick. He was a good player, but certainly not hof worthy.

I can't wait to see who's going to get in,

~Owen

EDIT: Also.. to Greg who had the question above,

Dahlen is considered by some a lock, mostly because of the new SABR stats (mostly WAR), it shows how some players were very valuable to their team, even if other stats show otherwise. Dahlen is one of these players.

[vthobby]

Originally Posted by Yoda

Lefty O'Doul owned and ran a bar restaurant in San Francisco. It still exists and serves great pub grub. Right off Union Square, if I recall. Joe DiMaggio, a buddy of Lefty's when they both played with the Seals, tried unsuccessfully for many years to get him into the Hall but to no avail. Probably too late now. John

Now I really have a reason to head West. That sounds very cool! Thanks for the tip.

Mike

[Topps206]

I think Dahlen does get in. Looking at the candidates, Dahlen has the strongest case among players. They elected three before, why not three or four this time?

[Bruinsfan94]

My question is how much will his and others card prices go up if they get in? Also am I the only one who thought Babe Herman was in the hall of fame? Off topic but I just found out he wasn't after thinking he was for a long time. Also realized Marion wasn't a hall a famer only a few weeks ago!

[z28jd]

His prices will jump a lot tomorrow, then fall until they level out at normal HOF prices for the lesser known players. He should be a lock tomorrow, but you never know with the Hall of Fame voting. If they knew about WAR in the 1930's-40's, Dahlen would have been voted in 70 years ago. He was one of the most valuable players period, not just among players not in the HOF.

[refz]

Originally Posted by Yoda

Lefty O'Doul owned and ran a bar restaurant in San Francisco. It still exists and serves great pub grub. Right off Union Square, if I recall. Joe DiMaggio, a buddy of Lefty's when they both played with the Seals, tried unsuccessfully for many years to get him into the Hall but to no avail. Probably too late now. John

My grandparents gave me this Lefty O Douls ashtray from his bar.

[packs]

I'm really hoping Stovey gets in. He was the first modern player a hundred years before the modern player. I'd think his OJ prices would be pretty strong if he does get in. Hank O'Day's card is pretty expensive now.

[z28jd]

Originally Posted by packs

I'm really hoping Stovey gets in. He was the first modern player a hundred years before the modern player. I'd think his OJ prices would be pretty strong if he does get in. Hank O'Day's card is pretty expensive now.

N172 Von Der Ahe prices will shoot higher because he is tougher to find. There is one real nice one on Ebay and another ratty one on the interwebs from a big dealer. It's $500(plus a 15% discount) but don't expect that price tomorrow if he does get elected, the price will go up. I learned that the hard way when O'Day got elected and I immediately tried to buy the one he had for sale.

[Joshchisox08]

I don't know much about the others but Dahlen deserves to be in there. I would add that quite a few other from that era he played in should be considered as well.

[Topps206]

I paid $70.00 for a PSA 1 in his Boston uniform. Any chance I could turn a profit on that?

[z28jd]

Originally Posted by Topps206

I paid $70.00 for a PSA 1 in his Boston uniform. Any chance I could turn a profit on that?

Maybe tomorrow you can get a little more than that right after he's elected, but there are a lot of them on Ebay right now, so people have options. Unless your PSA 1 has great eye appeal, it will probably be worth about $55-60 within weeks of him being selected. Also, he's the type of player who people already assumed would make it, so there could be less people than normal who need one right away.

[Topps206]

Originally Posted by z28jd

Maybe tomorrow you can get a little more than that right after he's elected, but there are a lot of them on Ebay right now, so people have options. Unless your PSA 1 has great eye appeal, it will probably be worth about $55-60 within weeks of him being selected. Also, he's the type of player who people already assumed would make it, so there could be less people than normal who need one right away.

Should I contact Dean's? I can't decide if I want to keep it because I'd love to build a monster set or if I should flip because I haven't worked since August.

[z28jd]

Originally Posted by Topps206

Should I contact Dean's? I can't decide if I want to keep it because I'd love to build a monster set or if I should flip because I haven't worked since August.

If you have an Ebay account, just list it tomorrow after they announce the new HOF'ers(or before so it's up already). Assuming he makes it, his cards will probably never be worth more than right after they announce it.

People rush to buy them, sort of like when a player passes away, or when Topps talked about that Derek Jeter error. People were paying ridiculous amounts for that card during the first couple days. You can get them for less than $5 now.

[Topps206]

I don't have one. Which is why I'm curious what I could get. I want to build a T206 set, whilst also being tempted at the prospect.

[Joshchisox08]

Originally Posted by Gradedcardman

Any thoughts on the "pre-integration" committee Hall of Fame voting that happens tomorrow ?? I looked at the stats for Dahlen and he measures up very well. 21 seasons mostly at Shortstop, 100+ runs in his first 6 seasons, 120+ hits 15 times AND was the active HR leader at retirement in the Dead ball era. Gotta be there this time ??

http://baseballhall.org/hall-of-fame...016-candidates

Adam the real question should be does the Committee actually research anything and take real candidates into consideration???

Why isn't Rip Van Haltren ever in contention?????????

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...anhage01.shtml

[Topps206]

Maybe he'll be one of the ten for 2019.

When I look at Dahlen, I also look at Dick Allen - qualified for Cooperstown but linked to character issues.

[ejharrington]

Originally Posted by Fred

The HOF should really look towards creating a "pioneers of the game" section that recognizes the early players from baseball history like Ross Barnes and a host of other 19th century players.

I 100% agree Barnes should in the HOF.

[GregMitch34]

What hour tomorrow do they announce who is in?

[Topps206]

I'm thinking in the afternoon, around 2:00 or 3:00.

[sayhey24]

11 am on MLB Network (according to the HOF website).

Greg

[GregMitch34]

correct

BTW an SGC 40 Dahlen t206 (Boston) went for about $70 tonight on the Bay

[Topps206]

Originally Posted by sayhey24

11 am on MLB Network (according to the HOF website).

Greg

I won't be home but I'll be checking my phone like crazy, eagerly looking to read Dahlen's name. I'm looking so forward to the results I don't know how much I'll sleep tonight.

[Jay Wolt]

I hope Chris von Der Ahe, Tip & Lefty get the nod



The only card in the N284 Buchner set that depicts an owner


Lefty, Joe & Dom Dimaggio & Ty Cobb

[sayhey24]

Unfortunately Tip and Lefty can't get in -- they're not on the ballot.

Greg

Jimmy Ryan, Jack Glasscock, Bill Dahlen

[GaryPassamonte]

Ditto for Ross Barnes. He was the best of his era. This cabinet is not mine, but I would sure like to find one.

[dougscats]

From what I read, I think Dahlen should be in, though I wouldn't call it a lock.

My OT question is, Why isn't Harry Pulliam [NL president, 1902-09] in?
He seems to have all the credentials [he was also the league secretary, treasurer, and record-keeper, I believe].

If I accurately recall what I've read on the internet,
He was beloved by much of baseball, but hated by John McGraw
[Pulliam was the ultimate judge, upholding Merkle's boner as a force play, forcing a playoff game--Despite tremendous pressure from the powerful NY Giants].
It seems as if he may have been hounded to suicide, possibly because he might have been gay.
He was memorialized at the World Series for many years.
Yet no one mentions him. Is he even a candidate?
I'd love to know more about his story, and if the rest of you think that he belongs, too.

My apologies for diverting this thread, but today's h-o-f vote seems to have become the general topic, and I'm following that.

[Topps206]

These are some beautiful cards. I'll be very disappointed if Bad Bill isn't elected.

[sayhey24]

No one was elected.
12 votes were needed, Doc Adams had the most with 10.

Greg

[GregMitch34]

Wow glad I held out (barely) on buying a Dahlen last night...

[KCRfan1]

Thanks for nothing HoF.

[Topps206]

Shame on the committee for not electing anyone.

[sayhey24]

Doc Adams had 10 votes as mentioned above. Dahlen and Harry Stovey had 8 votes each (50% of the 16-person committee).

Each of the remaining candidates had three votes or fewer.


Greg

[Topps206]

Originally Posted by sayhey24

Dahlen and Harry Stovey had 8 votes each (50% of the 16-person committee).

Each of the remaining candidates had three votes or fewer.


Greg

I understand Adams had 10.

This is a sham. First this crap last year with Dick Allen and now this. I hope the voters are happy with themselves.

[z28jd]

The Hall of Fame voting process is pathetic. They should be ashamed of themselves

[packs]

I'd like to know what qualifies a player to vote on something like a pre-integration ballot. What kind of insight could Bobby Cox or Phil Niekro possibly have re: Stovey and Dahlen? It should only be historians voting on these ballots.

[GregMitch34]

Niekro himself is lucky to have gotten in the Hall.

[vthobby]

Originally Posted by vtgmsc

I do not believe Dahlen is a lock but I do think Lefty O'Doul should be in the Hall of Fame!

Dahlen was the (pre Ty Cobb) in terms of surliness and bad attitude. He was not well liked but look where that got Cobb! Of course it helps to have a lifetime .366 BA!

Dahlen's surliness certianly was not limited to the field as The Chicago Inter Ocean of January 4, 1901 reported Dahlen’s wife suing for divorce, alleging he choked her in February 1897 and struck her that December. The suit also claimed Dahlen had threatened his wife’s life and used “vile, abusive, and opprobrious language” toward her.

I guess in retrospect he will fit in nicely with some other Hall of Famers!

Peace, Mike

Now if we could only get Lefty O'Doul in!
Peace, Mike

[z28jd]

I'm almost as annoyed right now as when they snubbed Ron Santo until after he died, or when Buck O'Neil didn't get in with everyone else. Rarely do you follow a HOF vote and say "good job", they're almost as bad at their job as weathermen, yet they somehow keep doing it